The Power of Poison!

[Soulchild]

Most special attacks aren't fighting type though, with the only really common special fighting move thrown around being gengar's focus blast, and even then it can be defeated even by the 4x weak tyranitar (another potential special sponge) if gengar lacks LO or if ttar is +sp.DEF.

Also, in regards to Weezing (but actual in regards to dusknoir and spiritomb as well), overall Rotom just does the job better. Dual STAB, electric's welcome resistances, thunderwave and trick on top of WoW just make it much more versatile. Pain Split is an extremely overrated move, and even if rotom has it I don't think I'd make room for it.

Tyranitar and the rock type in general has really common weaknesses as is and adding the dark type just boosts it more. You'll only be able to survive two focus blasts from a timid gengar and that requires you to run a +sp. def nature and invest largely into it. I would never dream of using Ttar as a wall, while muk will still be a decent one. I'd take one common weakness over 5 or 6 anyday for a wall.

I don't think pain split's anywhere near overrated. Rotom's lack of recovery that doesn't help the opponent setup isn't cool.

 

[bulbasauresrec]

Gunk Shot definitely should be given another look, even with its 75?? accuracy. People tend to think that average damage would be proportionate to base power multiplied by accuracy, i.e Gunk Shot is only 120 x 0.75 which adds up to an average attack of 80 Base power.

However this only is true when Gunk shot has been used a large number of times, at least 50 times, for the normalization of the probabilty of hitting. As long as a move has accuracy more than 50%, it should be expected to hit, more often than not in the short run.

With that being said, SD Gunk Shot Toxicroak is seriously scary.

 

[CHENN]

One of the best things about Poison pokemon is resistance to Bullet Punch, X-Scissor/U-turn and Superpower/Brick Break, making it a very good type to resist Scizor, whose the 2nd most common OU pokemon.

Poison doesn't resist steel. But as you said, it is a nice type to go against Scizor. Weezing would be a great counter. Switching in on most attacks other than Bullet punch barely hurts it.

 

[Youkai Enslaver]

Gunk Shot definitely should be given another look, even with its 75?? accuracy. People tend to think that average damage would be proportionate to base power multiplied by accuracy, i.e Gunk Shot is only 120 x 0.75 which adds up to an average attack of 80 Base power.

However this only is true when Gunk shot has been used a large number of times, at least 50 times, for the normalization of the probabilty of hitting. As long as a move has accuracy more than 50%, it should be expected to hit, more often than not in the short run.

With that being said, SD Gunk Shot Toxicroak is seriously scary.

Gunk Shot has 70% accuracy.

 

[Darkmalice]

Poison doesn't resist steel. But as you said, it is a nice type to go against Scizor. Weezing would be a great counter. Switching in on most attacks other than Bullet punch barely hurts it.

Whoops. What a stupid mistake. I was just thinking of Tentacruel when I said that, who could have 252 Hlth EVs and some Def EVs to effectively wall Scizor. Weezing works too with WoW, and Nidoqueen with Fire Blast.

 

[Chou Toshio]

Tyranitar and the rock type in general has really common weaknesses as is and adding the dark type just boosts it more. You'll only be able to survive two focus blasts from a timid gengar and that requires you to run a +sp. def nature and invest largely into it. I would never dream of using Ttar as a wall, while muk will still be a decent one. I'd take one common weakness over 5 or 6 anyday for a wall.

I don't think pain split's anywhere near overrated. Rotom's lack of recovery that doesn't help the opponent setup isn't cool.

I was just using tyranitar as an example of how I wouldn't say fighting resist is that important on a special wall. On a side-note, TTar's not a special wall, but you have to admit that being able to achieve 300+ ATK and 400+ HP and the equivalent of 400+ special defense all at the same time is amazing.

As for Rotom's lack of pain-split-- trick, thunderwave, will-of-wisp, screens, and STAB shadow ball/thunderbolt are all way better than pain split. Rotom is overall a much stronger pokemon than the other defensive w-o-w users (weezing/dusknoir/spiritomb).

 

[Soulchild]

I was just using tyranitar as an example of how I wouldn't say fighting resist is that important on a special wall. On a side-note, TTar's not a special wall, but you have to admit that being able to achieve 300+ ATK and 400+ HP and the equivalent of 400+ special defense all at the same time is amazing.

As for Rotom's lack of pain-split-- trick, thunderwave, will-of-wisp, screens, and STAB shadow ball/thunderbolt are all way better than pain split. Rotom is overall a much stronger pokemon than the other defensive w-o-w users (weezing/dusknoir/spiritomb).

I'll admit it's cool, but I'd much rather go for rhyperior and solid rock if I wanted a defensive juggernaut that could return hits. I've got a huge rhyperior bias tho so, that doesn't mean much. :P

I'll admit rotom's more versatile, but he still has no form of recovery and can't wear down walls as well as pain split users, especially if the pain split user is under a status aliment. WoW and pain split aren't the only things weezing, spiritomb, and dusknoir can do btw.

 

[lati0s]

Gunk Shot definitely should be given another look, even with its 75?? accuracy. People tend to think that average damage would be proportionate to base power multiplied by accuracy, i.e Gunk Shot is only 120 x 0.75 which adds up to an average attack of 80 Base power.

However this only is true when Gunk shot has been used a large number of times, at least 50 times, for the normalization of the probabilty of hitting. As long as a move has accuracy more than 50%, it should be expected to hit, more often than not in the short run.

With that being said, SD Gunk Shot Toxicroak is seriously scary.

120 x 75%=90 not 80 and as already stated gunkshots accuracy is actually only 70%

 

[Phizzlax]

Gunk Shot definitely should be given another look, even with its 75?? accuracy. People tend to think that average damage would be proportionate to base power multiplied by accuracy, i.e Gunk Shot is only 120 x 0.75 which adds up to an average attack of 80 Base power.

However this only is true when Gunk shot has been used a large number of times, at least 50 times, for the normalization of the probabilty of hitting. As long as a move has accuracy more than 50%, it should be expected to hit, more often than not in the short run.

With that being said, SD Gunk Shot Toxicroak is seriously scary.

Hate to be like the 3rd guy to pick on you, sure it'll hit more often than it doesn't, but how much do you want to rely on a move that will miss once for every two times it hits (approximate average)? In a given battle you may not use it more than once or twice, but over the course of 10 battles that's 10-20 times. Guess what, you'll have missed 3-6 times. Each of them potentially damning. The more power an attack has, the more likely it is that some of that power is unnecessary. An attack with 400 power and 25 accuracy wouldn't be better then an attack with 90 power and 100 accuracy even though it averages to a higher amount, because when you just want to kill something wounded already the former attack is terrible.

In conclusion, Poison Jab>Gunk Shot.

 

[Kietharr]

Poison doesn't resist steel. But as you said, it is a nice type to go against Scizor. Weezing would be a great counter. Switching in on most attacks other than Bullet punch barely hurts it.

Weezing IS a great counter, would be nothin. He's also a perfect answer to Lucario, Gyarados, Weavile, and Heracross. He's without a doubt the best pure poison type in the game, if he had reliable recovery he'd easily be OU.

Rotom is great and all but he doesn't have the defense that Weezing has, and his only fire attack is overheat, which is really a poor option for a defensive pokemon. Fire Blast/Thunder Bolt/Will-O-Wisp/Pain Split on Weezing handles the great majority of physical threats out there, with the exceptions of Gallade, Medicham, and the occasional Zen Headbutt Metagross. Pain split isn't classified as reliable recovery, but it's a hell of a lot better than Rotom's options. Rotom is more of a support/status abuser while Weezing is a full on physical wall.

Also, a restalk weezing is pretty viable, being great for status absorption as well as sponging physical hits, you've got to dump either WoW or Fire Blast though unless you're feeling bold and want to run a restless stalker.

 

[Darkmalice]

Weezing IS a great counter, would be nothin. He's also a perfect answer to Lucario, Gyarados, Weavile, and Heracross. He's without a doubt the best pure poison type in the game, if he had reliable recovery he'd easily be OU.

Rotom is great and all but he doesn't have the defense that Weezing has, and his only fire attack is overheat, which is really a poor option for a defensive pokemon. Fire Blast/Thunder Bolt/Will-O-Wisp/Pain Split on Weezing handles the great majority of physical threats out there, with the exceptions of Gallade, Medicham, and the occasional Zen Headbutt Metagross. Pain split isn't classified as reliable recovery, but it's a hell of a lot better than Rotom's options. Rotom is more of a support/status abuser while Weezing is a full on physical wall.

Also, a restalk weezing is pretty viable, being great for status absorption as well as sponging physical hits, you've got to dump either WoW or Fire Blast though unless you're feeling bold and want to run a restless stalker.

Rotom also blocks rapid spin and gains STAB on that Thunderbolt off a higher SpcAtt and Speed. STAB Sludge Bomb is so bad, many Weezing dont have it (you didn't even mention it). One Overheat is enough to OHKO Scizor and Forry, so the SpcAtt drop doesnt mean much (and you have THunderbolt for Skarm); it's mainly a concern with Bronzong, who has had a popularity drop with the Hypnosis nerf.

Weezing is immune to Ground, whilst Rotom is immune to Ground, Normal and Fighting, so Weezing still gets confused against Machamp.

The main reasons for Weezing is to not have a Dark/Ghost weakness (at the price of a Psychic weakness), Explosion, Haze (which is futile against special sweepers), Pain Split (though Rest and Sleep Talk is available to both Rotom and Weezing). Weezing is only a physical wall, while Rotom can be a spinblocker, status abuser, support (e.g. DS), a physical wall, a tricker and a decent special attacker.

So, in short, Rotom-a OU and Weezing UU.

 

[Iamslow]

Weezing is awesome!

I like Fire Blasting Skarmory and Thunderbolting Gyrados the best with him. Man I had good times with this thing over Wi-Fi...

 

[Farewell]

How is Rotom a Status Absorber, at least Weezing is immune to 1 Status (Poison), while Rotom has to have Rest-Talk?

And Rotom being a Physical wall is being a little excessive, sure W-o-w helps, but usually Rotom has to invest in Speed and HP before it can effectively invest into Defense, let alone Special Attack, while Pokemon like Spiritomb and Weezing need less worry about Speed.

P.S. if it makes a difference, Weezing also gets Curse, so it can effectively Stat-up while using Pain Split, to really become an effective Physical, Self-healing wall...

Weezing also offers similar resistances as Rotom (Bug, Poison, Fighting), the same Ground Immunity, and 1 that Rotom doesn't in Grass, making it a great Breloom counter, especially if using Sleep Talk.

Fire Blast > Overheat.

 

[Ancax]

I would say that Poison should hit Water Super effective, but they probably do not want the Base form Starter Pokemon sharing a weakness. Plus Ludicolo would be screwed.

Poison should hit Bug super effective though. Also, Poison being SE to Fighting might be plausible.

 

[Property =/= Melvin]

I use sludge bomb Gengar. It really surprises things like Celebi switching in expecting a shadow ball

edit: meant blissey not celebi >__>;

 

[Bogmire]

I use sludge bomb Gengar. It really surprises things like Celebi switching in expecting a shadow ball

yeah, celebi resisting shadow ball and all. its the most obvious gengar switch in.

 

[Soulchild]

I use sludge bomb Gengar. It really surprises things like Celebi switching in expecting a shadow ball

edit: meant blissey not celebi >__>;

There are still better uses of that slot. Blissey's only going to be taking a max of like, 60 damage from any sp. atk anyways.