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VGC's Metagame
- Thread starter acinod
- Start date
Yes, but that requires godlike prediction, and you would probably be better off protecting if you are predicting like that.
This may have been asked before but are there plans for a VGC ladder once shoddy battle 2 is released?
I actually think it is not more random than 2v2 with "regular" rules. No sleep clause, DT and OHKOs allowed, but all these tactics were rarely successful (only some Smeargles and too lucky Bronzongs lol), so what? Teams are much less standardised than in singles play and most of them would still follow the usual rules. A VGC ladder would indeed be a good idea, so one can prepare better for the next tournament series by TPC. Well, only if the Shoddy team manages to avoid those obvious bugs that NB has. Apart from the mentioned switch bug, the wrong damage dealt by multi-hit moves also really annoys me (too strong Surf/EQ/b00m, too weak Slide/Cheat Wave/Blizzard), as it fakes kills and survivals all the time.
There's testing being done on WiFi as well, which will not yeild as accurate results as a simulator (to an extent), still provides us with the information needed.
Well put it this way, if there isn't going to be a VGC ladder on the Smogon server, there really ought to be, since that's the only doubles mode we have set in stone so far. The "main" doubles ladder would probably be comparable to a suspect ladder since we don't know anything about that metagame yet.
Yeah, people who have a generally good understanding of the game are going to excel regardless of the style, but I think calling what Vash said asinine is unfair - we are comparing a few threads on the topic of double battling to a virtual encyclopedia on singles strategy. Pokemon has had double battling for 7 years now, so if you mean to say that Smogon doesn't have an on-site analysis "yet" in a way that suggests it will at some point, it certainly is taking it's time :P
Same reason Mew, Shaymin, and Manaphy are banned, more likely due to their stat distribution than how rare they are.
Since this thread is titled 'VGC Metagame', I guess I can ask a metagame-related question here. Does anyone have any estimate on the proportion of the commonly-used teams (Rain Dance, TR, good stuffs) that are likely to be used at Worlds? Specifically in the Juniors. I know that last year's Juniors winner used some kind of TR team, consisting of Bronzong, Garchomp, Hippowdon and Metagross, but what about everyone else?
To add on to why the Rotom formes are banned I believe it is because those players in the United Kingdom and Germany can not use them on their Diamond / Pearl cards. So I believe they're banned solo for that.
The best thing I can think of, TBH, is to watch the Nationals for this year (all countries) and last years Japanese games, be they Seniors or Juniors.
The best thing I can think of though is NOT to change your team to beat 1 specific team, but to tweak your team in a manner to plug up as many holes as possible. If I didn't do that for Rain in Nationals, I would have lost my first 2 matches in Swiss, lmao.
Or, also, tweak your team so that it can work as two different teams. If, say, you end up fighting the same person twice. That's how me and Shoe made his team: it's sort of a combination of mine and his, with the reserves working to transform the team into a completely different strategy if needed. It actually works really well.
Ha! Yeah! Setting up your team to beat 1 specific team can REEEEEally backfire on you! Just ask Siddarth! XD Vash is right.
1)Make sure YOUR pokes all complement each other and are as strong and fast as possible
2)fill up as many of it's holes as possible with specific movesets and alternates
3)Practice, Practice, Practice till you know when those little opportunites come up and don't waste them
4)Hope for the best!
Yeah, that's what we've done. From testing, we've found a few specific teams that can beat my brother's, and have chosen our two backups accordingly :)
It's pretty good overall; it just has a few problems with some specific strategies/Pokémon.
EDIT: What's the fastest often-used Pokémon (Choice Scarf, maybe)? I'm not sure whether he should use a +SpA or +Speed nature on one of his Pokémon...
It's pretty good overall; it just has a few problems with some specific strategies/Pokémon.
EDIT: What's the fastest often-used Pokémon (Choice Scarf, maybe)? I'm not sure whether he should use a +SpA or +Speed nature on one of his Pokémon...
That is always the case, Wichu, as it just isn't possible to cover up and/or beat all strategies out there - you have only got six Pokémon... Although I cannot give specific tips without further information, I want to say that it is best for you and your brother to just choose six Pokémon who YOU put trust in and pull it through.
Aunt Edith:
The Japanese use Scarftricklatios, at least one of the seniors does. Another Pokémon that is scarved most of the time is Heatran, spamming Heat Waves. I cannot remember much more, though, as locking oneself into one, possibly wrong, move is something very unfavorable in Doubles. It might be that specific strategies rely on Scarfed leads, such as Scarf Dark Void Smeargle but other than that I do not think that scarves have been used that frequently...
Aunt Edith:
The Japanese use Scarftricklatios, at least one of the seniors does. Another Pokémon that is scarved most of the time is Heatran, spamming Heat Waves. I cannot remember much more, though, as locking oneself into one, possibly wrong, move is something very unfavorable in Doubles. It might be that specific strategies rely on Scarfed leads, such as Scarf Dark Void Smeargle but other than that I do not think that scarves have been used that frequently...
wouldnt dragonite be banned? I saw a previous poster say that t-tar is banned because it evolves from pupitar at level 55. Doesnt dragonite evolve at level 55 as well?
There was a Level 50 Dragonite released as an event in both the US and Japan, so it's allowed, so long as it's that Dragnoite.
ok, thanks for clearing that up. You should add non toys-r-us dragonite to the ban list to avoid confusion.
No, it really doesn't, actually (excellent prediction skills)
In the matches I've played, Explosion hasn't been all that common. Even so, the Pokemon you'd mainly see with it are Metagross, Azelf, Uxie, Bronzong, Heatran - all Pokemon who can utilize it in singles.
Either way, it'd be a lot easier to just use Protect.
Ok, so I exaggerated a bit. Sure you can see it coming a mile away, but if you actually predict it right, you might as well have protected.
Hmmm....it's situational. If both your teammates can protect and the surviving poke won't be given a turn to set up (like exploding Azelf + TR Dusknoir) then double protecting would make the most sense. If you DO have the case of say an Azelf paired with a Dusknoir, you'd probably better switch in a damp poke and Taunt with the other. That would diffuse the situation best. Switching in a Damp poke could be useful...
Man. Doubles has so much more strategery than Singles ;D Who would ever want to play boring Singles...?
I simply have to agree on that one!
Trying a doubles rain dance team.Question:would raikou be a better candidate for setting up rain dance vs. jolteon?
I wanted to use an elctric with thunder but I thought raikou being a cooler pokemon + a legendry might be-able to do better.
Example of what im trying with raikou.
Raikou @ Focus Sash
Hasty
Evs:68 HP / 116 SpA / 72 SpD / 252 Spe
~Rain Dance
~thunder
~HP water 60
~Protect
Thats the best raikou i can get my hands on.
Iv paired it with fake out ludicolo to see how it works.thoughts?suggestions?
I actually want it to hit 1 hp from an EQ cause then i protect while the opponent trys to kill me with its moves and i can surf pokes to death!
Just wondering, why all that bulk on Raikou when it's hasty and is holding Sash anyway? (i.e. why not just max SpA?)
Basically, if you are going to put focus sash, I'd say Jolteon will be better because of the higher speed (being able to at least tie Aerodactyl/Crobat might be useful, and also outspeeding Weavile / Adamant (Trick)Scarfgross also might come in handy.). Stat-wise, Raikou's main advantage over Jolteon is its higher bulk (and slightly higher SpA), so I personally would only use Raikou over Jolteon if the Raikou's more bulky and not holding focus sash. It does have ok defenses.
But in reality, I'd just use Jolteon since it's much easier to breed for one with good IVs.
Basically, if you are going to put focus sash, I'd say Jolteon will be better because of the higher speed (being able to at least tie Aerodactyl/Crobat might be useful, and also outspeeding Weavile / Adamant (Trick)Scarfgross also might come in handy.). Stat-wise, Raikou's main advantage over Jolteon is its higher bulk (and slightly higher SpA), so I personally would only use Raikou over Jolteon if the Raikou's more bulky and not holding focus sash. It does have ok defenses.
But in reality, I'd just use Jolteon since it's much easier to breed for one with good IVs.