CAP 14 CAP 3 - Concept Submissions

[BulkyMcBulkerson]

This is my first CAP concept submission, and I hope you like it.

Name: Stall Wars
General Description: A considerably bulky pokemon with neutal typing weaknesses and a wide offensive/moderate supportive move pool.
Justification: Many walls of the current metagame are usually countered by a pokemon with the same type as it's weakness or a pokemon with a moderate/powerful move from that weakness. But what if there was a defensive wall that not only has neutral coverage to almost all types but also capatalizes on the fact that its few/one weakness is almost never seen in the OU metagame?
Questions To Be Answered:

• Would there be a jump in pokemon from lower tiers to the OU meta just to counter this new threat?
• Would the current viable counters in OU be used more often?
• Would this pokemon become the core around which a stall team basis itself?
• How would this pokemon handle itself against the current stallers?

Explanation: While stall is a great tactic in the current metagame, it can be easily thwarted by an unfavorable type matchup. When I thought of this concept, I thought how awesome it would be to capitalize the shortage of Bug-type coverage with a Psychic-Dark type pokemon. Currently, there are 35 pokemon in the OU metagame that can use bug type attacks (not including Hidden Power Bug); only 3 of which would get STAB. 22 of these pokemon have access to decent attacks like U-turn or Signal Beam but most would rather run better moves or have unfavorable stat conflicts (such as Heatran, a prodominately Special Attacker, running Bug Bite). Finally, 10 of these pokemon have abosutely horrid moves such as Fury Cutter and can't seriously be expected to counter this typing. As for an ability, I was thinking something like Magic Guard, Overcoat, or Natual Cure to prevent it from being overtaken by risidual damage. As for designs, I was thinking its could look remind you of a mafia boss; dark, patient, and willing to wait to get what it wants.

 

[Juicy]

Name:

Sleeping Beauty

Description:

A pokemon that takes advantage of the new sleep mechanic either by inflicting or receiving.

Justification:

One pokemon asleep and that pokemon could effectively be immobilised for the entire game. A pokemon that either capitalises on that or counters such a tactic would, either way, switch the power of play in the game. This 'sleep niche' pokemon could either provide a status absorber or allow the time to create a strategy in a metagame where every turn is critical.

Questions to be answered:

- Just how far does a sleeping pokemon effect a players strategy?
- How far can sleep be abused in a metagame where only one pokemon can be put to sleep?
- Is there a way to abuse sleep further than already present in the metagame?
- Could Dream Eater/Nightmare become a Viable move?
- Is there a way to counter an 'effective sleeping pokemon'

Explanation:

Oh that notorious Breloom. In it comes and you likely have to sacrifice a pokemon or two in order to take it down. One asleep the other taken down by a leech seed/focus punch combo while you tackle it's substitute. Not to mention the plethora of other sleep induces that come out to send you asleep then set up. This pokemon could either counter that sleep mechanic by working effectively (or better) when asleep or utilise the sleep mechanic itself and capitalise on it. With a fast paced metagame this sleep inducer or sleep absorber would slow it down and allow the time for more complex strategies to emerge in tune with pokemon that can already utilise effectively trick room or gravity, if just given the time. And after all, lets not forget how absolutely horrid that gimmick Crobat would have been holding swimming goggles with roost, sleeptalk and whirlwind. It's a concept to see what a competitively effective 'sleep master' could do as apposed to the gimmick sleeping pokemon or the pokemon who use sleep but not a central point to its strategic play.

Here is our chance to do what game freak tried to do with Hypno and Musharna. Make way for the sleep master.

 

[capefeather]

I want to talk about Double Team and Boost Thief.

I think that the timing is wrong for Double Team. Firstly, we're already rolling out a major change in the CAP process (TLs not necessarily making OPs), and another, really major change in the process of the kind that this would demand might not be healthy for exploration of the concept. Furthermore, CAP 2 ran for quite a long time. What I fear from a concept like Double Team right now is that there may be a struggle between fully exploring the concept and deciding the same, say, typing for both Pokémon solely to save time. I think that, even with all the talk of ambition that our TL professes to have, efforts to save time on CAP 3, consciously or not, will sell the concept short.

With Boost Thief, I'm not sure on the possibilities. It seems rather limited. Heart Swap is a legendary signature move, which is going to become a controversy in itself if not outright rejected. This leaves Snatch and maybe Psych Up. I'm not sure this can work with basically one or two normally bad moves being the focus.

 

[LouisCyphre]

I can resubmit this, because computer.

Name: Fatal Flaw

General Description: A Pokémon burdened by one or more "irredeemable" weaknesses or issues that would, more often than not, doom it to RU or below. However, with the correct support and just the right set of moves, it becomes an engine of destruction.

Justification: Often, Pokémon are overlooked for months before being brought to the forefront of competative play. Volcarona was overlooked for its Rock weakness, Reuniclus was set aside for its forgettable typing, Heatran was deemed "weak to everything and its mother", the list goes on.

By investigating how a Pokémon receives support from its teammates, and what burdens it sets upon them, a more accurate measure of a Pokémon's worth and viability can be attained. By deconstructing and reverse-engineering flaws such as this, the skills of supporting fatal flaws and even building synergistic teams can be analyzed in great detail.

Questions To Be Answered: How does a Pokémon with a Fatal Flaw...

• ...burden its teammates? The rest of the team has to carry the weight of the ball that this CAP drops; what does that entail?
• ...encourage or discourage certain teammates? How does its weakness aggravate certain matchups, and which matchups does it go unnoticed?
• ...make up for its Flaw? This CAP should be competent at its role, but not so overwhelmingly so that its flaw is justified. The Flaw must be truly fatal for it to impact the design of the Pokémon.
• ...overcome its Flaw? What makes this CAP stand out when side-by-side with similar, but less crippled, Pokémon? What reasons would a player have to choose this CAP over another user of the same advantages?

Explanation: For the most part, this concept should avoid issues of typing unless deemed necessary for another end, rather than being an end unto itself. I envision a CAP cripplingly weak to Taunt, or walled by common defensive staples, or utterly useless if there is a Ghost-type still alive on the enemy team.

Such a mon might be a defensive behemoth while allowed access to support moves; might be capable of dismantling anything not named Ferrothorn or Blissey, or might bring incredibly destructive (for both parties) Normal or Fighting STAB to bear. The idea is not to craft a Salamence or a Gengar - a mon with a slim list of checks and little to no true counters - and not a Volcarona or a Dragonite - a mon horribly weak to a common implement of most teams but manages to be a force despite it - but instead one that is shut down by a common and often-deemed-essential force in the metagame. However, once this force, whatever it may be, is removed, this CAP begins to contribute to its teammates in a way that validates the work done to support it.

This mon should be all take and no give until its weakness is nullified, at which point this mon should become a powerful (but not overwhelmingly so) player that will have opponents wishing that they had done a better job at keeping the flaw fatal.

 

[Deck Knight]

I want to talk about Double Team and Boost Thief.

I think that the timing is wrong for Double Team. Firstly, we're already rolling out a major change in the CAP process (TLs not necessarily making OPs), and another, really major change in the process of the kind that this would demand might not be healthy for exploration of the concept. Furthermore, CAP 2 ran for quite a long time. What I fear from a concept like Double Team right now is that there may be a struggle between fully exploring the concept and deciding the same, say, typing for both Pokémon solely to save time. I think that, even with all the talk of ambition that our TL professes to have, efforts to save time on CAP 3, consciously or not, will sell the concept short.

The only thing that's changed is who authors the OP. Mods and the TL are supposed to have a tight relationship, and being that I'm both, I'm actually one of the most solid people to try and pull this off. I don't mean to toot my own horn, but the chances of me fading off into the distance for even 36 hours is almost nil (24 hours *might* happen, 36 is unlikely). I'll discuss what I need with the other CAP Mods. In general I think going through with something like this that requires a tight-knit moderator-TL collaboration will ultimately serve to show future TL's how to interact with the staff and furthermore, illustrate the flexibility potential of the CAP project. For me this is really an "if not now, when?" moment, as you're unlikely to get a TL in the future who can make the kind of guarantees of close collaboration and constant presence that I can, along with the institutional knowledge, memory, and organization that I bring. My experience is that when you put things off to "tomorrow," "tomorrow" never comes, heh.

As for time, that's never been a huge thing for me, especially if it would affect quality. I like to wrap things up quickly, which is why tomorrow probably around 10 PM I'll post a 24 hour warning with my slate intentions and allow people to finish up.

Though most of this particular talk should be reserved for Concept Assessment. The most important thing is going to be establishing a control group. Basically we want our two Double Team Pokemon to be as similar as possible, except in their designated roles of Defense (the pre-vo due to eviolite) and Offense (the FE). Oh yeah, and it actually has to get slated and win a popular vote first. The latter is a significant hurdle, especially if people are having doubts about it. I still intend to put it through on the slate, though.

 

[Aerodactyl Legend]

The submissions that stand out to me most are Rising_Dusk's and bugmaniacbob's.

Rising_Dusk

Concept: The Deceiver

Description: A Pokemon that is built around concealing information from the opponent or misinforming the opponent in a generation where information is more readily available than ever.

Justification: Information became very difficult to hide from your opponent in the generation shift for many reasons. The most eminent reason of the lot is team preview. Now you get to see your opponent's pinch sweeper Lucario, or the Electivire to your opponent's Gyarados, or whether they're running stall or offense, or which weather they're running. These things were all concealed from us prior to BW. Additionally, with being able to choose a lead, the concept of a no-lead metagame has made BW even more about team synergy and less about concealing information.

I'm not convinced, however. There are still many ways to hide information, just nothing serious in the metagame that takes advantage of it. I think exploring the idea of information as a concept driver would result in a very unique, diverse, and productive experience for a BW CAP both in the process and in the result.






Questions To Be Answered:

• Can information be concealed effectively from your opponent to give you the upper hand when you finally "reveal your hand" as it were?
• What sort of information is the most feasible to conceal from your opponent? The least feasible?
• What methods best facilitate the obfuscation of information?
• Which is more viable, misleading your opponent or simply leaving them guessing entirely?
• Which items and styles of play best suit a Pokemon that focuses on concealing information? Would defensive, offensive, or balanced be more appropriate?
• Does the threat of a lack of information require a diverse movepool, or can it be achieved through other means?

Explanation: CAP is where we explore concepts that don't get much or any gametime in real Pokemon. This concept came to me as soon as BW was introduced and the changes were made that included team preview and choosing a lead. I immediately asked myself: "But wait, what if you could still hide all of this information from your opponent? Would that put the fear back into the players?" Hiding information was something so pivotal for DPP OU, and I think being able to bring it back to BW OU would change the way we look at an otherwise predictable metagame.

There are many obvious ways to hide information. We employ a few of these strategies still, such as Expert Belt to hide under the guise of being choice-locked. This is based in misdirection, not obfuscation. The difference between these two types of information will need to be discussed at length by the community, but forms the basic principle of the flow of information to and from players. Obfuscation is something like having a diverse movepool such that an opponent cannot predict your set. Perhaps having diverse coverage, or diverse support options. Perhaps, even, having a diverse typing through the use of Multitype. On the other hand, the epitome of misdirection might be Illusion; your opponent thinks you're a completely different Pokemon altogether! What then if you have both Zoroark and CAP 3 on your team? Complete anarchy! As you can see, there are a wide variety of ways that we can handle a CAP based on deception and hiding information. I hope that this has piqued your all's interest as much as it has captivated me for countless months as I waited for the opportunity to present this concept to you.

Enter the deceiver.

I think that's why I lost so much interest in the game. The predictability. To me, playing an OU match is like watching a movie you've already seen before. You know what'll happen (not strictly, but you know what I mean) before it happens. Team Preview is a huge component to this, but there are probably other factors as well.

In DP, though there were a bunch of threats you always saw, the task of gaining enough information to "secure" a win was always something you had to work hard for.

The emphasis on synergy this Generation is good, but it seems far less interesting without the concealment of information.

bugmaniacbob

Name: Psychological Warfare MkII

General Description: A Pokemon whose strength in battle comes from its ability to force the opponent to make mistakes or to believe that they have no chance of winning - in short, by forcing the opponent to be defeated by their own stress.

Justification: The nerve and good judgement of a battler, as well as their capacity to handle stressful situations, is a well-documented factor in the outcome of a competitive Pokemon battle, but is relatively unexplored in terms of the assessment of Pokemon that currently exist and, in this case, for those that are created. Lord knows that a battle can be a stressful time, and a particular Pokemon can exacerbate this situation by itself. So, then, CAP offers us an excellent opportunity to investigate this ill-explored area of competitive Pokemon, by designing a CAP specifically for the purpose of forcing your opponent to make mistakes, bad judgements, or simply peculiar plays to alleviate the stress. This is, to my knowledge, something that has not been attempted before, and would no doubt be of great value both as a learning experience and a test for the CAP community.






Questions To Be Answered:

• To what extent will a Pokemon that relies primarily on the strength of the enemy controller be effective and viable in the BW metagame?
• Is the ability to manipulate the opponent to such an extent indeed a large factor in the outcome of a competitive Pokemon battle, as is currently thought?
• To what extent will this Pokemon's viability differ from battle to battle? Will it be more effective against different opponents? If so, which ones will it be more effective against?
• How strong and/or viable is "psychological warfare" as a strategy against more traditional, well-developed team strategies?

Explanation: Alright, I was pretty vague about it the last time, so I'll be blunt and to the point this time. Indicators of what might make a good stress-related Pokemon can be found in this guide by obi. The big point in this guide is that deceptiveness is key, and thus it is so for this Pokemon. Ideally this Pokemon would be able to suggest the illusion of invincibility, by being able to come into and switch out of his Pokemon for little to no consequence, and be able to continue this strategy until the opponent makes a mistake; and then, crucially, be able to capitalise on it. Recovery abilities such as Recover and Regenerator come to mind here, as well as typings that do not leave many exploitable weaknesses. In addition, it should be able to act in a convincingly predictable manner against certain opponents, and to act unpredictably against others, in order to encourage complacency and overprediction, respectively. Crucially, it should be able to switch between one and the other as the situation demands it. A wide movepool is thus important.

However, for my own part I do not want our CAP to take the easy way out. This is chiefly directed at people who last time said "give it Illusion and be done with it". Yes, this encourages stress to a great extent and would fulfil the concept admirably, I'm sure, but much like with Krilowatt and Multitype, I feel that this would be to take the easy way out. I'd rather see clever shenanigans with recovery and typing than make a CAP that is simply "unpredictable". Unpredictability is a large part of the concept, but it should not be the focus. Similarly, "theoretical threat" should play a part, but not the whole part. My ideal CAP for this purpose would be something along the lines of Ghost/Dark (ie. few weaknesses), with Regenerator or Poison Heal, a recovery move, and considerable bulk, below average offensive stats, and the potential to execute any number of strategies. But this is only what I have thought of on the spur of the moment. There are any number of ways this CAP could go if we wanted it to, so don't take this as gospel by any stretch.

---------------

This was brought up before (though, obviously updated now) and I still think that concepts based off of the player's "train of thought" hasn't been explored enough. There are some interesting routes we could take with this, as there are a bunch of Pokemon/Moves/etc that bring a lot of pressure upon the opponent, breaking their stride even further and forcing them take drastic actions that often make the situation worse.

 

[Juicy]

Name: Decentralizer Revisited

- Birkal

With the Top 6 pokemon involving weather inducers (Namely Politoad and Tyranitar) would this pokemon not effectively be another anti-weather pokemon which would effectively give rise to a CAP full of sun-based-teams with ninetales not being in that top 6? Just a matter of question.

Name: Ultimate Technician

-Pokethan

I think this has already been explored quite well with scizor, breloom and ambipom and to a further extent nasty plot persian.

 

[Pokethan]

-Pokethan

I think this has already been explored quite well with scizor, breloom and ambipom and to a further extent nasty plot persian.

If you read the notes i put I didn't necesarily mean that we would only use Technician but a pokemon that uses lower base moves that most pokemon don't use or boosting moves that are limited to only a few pokemon. Maybe my title is too centralizing but I couldn't think of anything else. Scizor does fill a role of that but it only has a few attacks it actually uses with this ability. I was thinking more along the lines of the pokemon having a huge movepool of moves like Flame Charge and others not only a few it could use with this ability or not with the ability.

 

[Juicy]

Hide

If you read the notes i put I didn't necesarily mean that we would only use Technician but a pokemon that uses lower base moves that most pokemon don't use or boosting moves that are limited to only a few pokemon. Maybe my title is too centralizing but I couldn't think of anything else. Scizor does fill a role of that but it only has a few attacks it actually uses with this ability. I was thinking more along the lines of the pokemon having a huge movepool of moves like Flame Charge and others not only a few it could use with this ability or not with the ability.

Just looked back at your post to make sure I didn't trip up and miss something. I understand what you are communicating but I'm unsure as to how such moves would become viable if not powered up in some way which is, as you say, indicated strongly in your title. Simple Bibarel has already shown us the extent of boosting attacking options in charge beam... I guess I don't really see a strong direction to explore that can't already be done by existing pokemon.

 

[jas61292]

What I fear from a concept like Double Team right now is that there may be a struggle between fully exploring the concept and deciding the same, say, typing for both Pokémon solely to save time. I think that, even with all the talk of ambition that our TL professes to have, efforts to save time on CAP 3, consciously or not, will sell the concept short.

SubwayJ can feel free to correct me if I am getting this wrong, but from what I understand of the concept, the two Pokemon would indeed have the same typing, and most likely a similar movepool, so making them as such would not be cutting things short, but actually following how the concept was intended. The only major change between the two would be in the stats, and even there, as one is a prevo, it will most likely be just a scaled back version of the evolution, making sure its defenses stay high enough to work well in its role. I think the way the concept is supposed to work is for us to see how two Pokemon, similar in most other ways, can work differently solely do to stat spread and eviolite, and as such, many of your fears wouldn't really be a problem.

 

[Camisado]

Name: Two-Faced

General Description: A Pokémon that has two main roles that comparatively compliment each other, but cannot utilize both roles at the same time effectively.

Justification: Gen V, there seems to be a lot of healthy, competitive cores and partnerships that are very easy to utilize, 'Two-Faced' tries to explore which half of the team, or which part of the Pokémon leads to the biggest portion of the synergy created. or which part of an under-exploited combination would need more support to be more usable.


Questions to be Answered:
- When examining aspects of a competitive Pokémon or group of Pokémon, which part leads the most towards this success?
- In partnerships that include one Pokémon that sets up a condition, and another that exploits the created condition, which one is more important?
- What aspects of a Pokemon should be looked at first when determining if it's overpowered?
- When a Pokémon is designed to fill one of two complimentary roles without being designed to effectively do both at the same time, it's only to be assumed some would attempt to fill both roles simultaneously. How does this compare to the designed sets?

Explanation:With each new generation and significant metagame change, it seems that many things have always gone in and out of style. However, there have been multiple occasions in which something was deemed overpowered, but maybe not clearly noted why. In Gen IV, Garchomp was deemed Uber. However, there was never a clear-cut answer if it was because of it's stats, it's ability, or a combination of the two. In Gen V, the biggest comparative is if weather abusers or weather inducers were the culprit- Aldaron's proposal tried to resolve what part of the weather war is a bigger issue by creating, say, a weather user, that has a "increase speed in weather" as the other ability. This could do that. In another aspect, we could create a Trick Room abuser that, due to legality issues, can't use powerful STAB and Trick Room on the same set. With Dream World abilities and egg moves, it would be very easy to create a Pokémon that could run totally different sets, but not at the same time well. If done correctly, I'd imagine this CAP would want itself as one of it's best partners, outside of maybe type synergy.

 

[DarkBlazeR]

Name: The Great Wall

Description: A Pokemon designed to be a dedicated wall.

Justification: The level of attacking power available this generation has far exceeded any before it. The concept of a "wall" has almost completely disappeared from player vocabulary as some threats are simply too powerful to be countered with traditional walls, and instead are countered using specific resistances of Pokemon which aren't typically considered walls.

In past generations, walls were common on every team. Nowadays, walls such as Cresselia and Blissey are normally only seen on stall teams. This CAP concept attempts to create a new dedicated wall, which is capable shrugging hits from even the mightiest of attackers by virtue of a fantastic defensive typing, exceptionally high base defensive stats, or a combination of both.

Questions To Be Answered:

• Could dedicated walls still have a place in BW outside of stall teams?
• To what extent is having a defensive typing more important than having incredible defensive stats or vice versa? What will be the keystone to this Pokemon's success in its role?
• To what extent will a dedicated wall to deal with BW's top heavy hitters be necessary?
• Will this Pokemon require certain support roles in order to fit on bulky offense/balanced teams? How will players fit a generic wall on to their team without it simply being slapped on by default?
• How will stall benefit from this new Pokemon? What niches will it provide, e.g. setting up hazards, phazing, spinning, spin blocking, cleric, Wish support, other?
  

Explanation: Essentially a revival of the days when Skarmory + Blissey would hard-counter almost the entire metagame, except in miniature. Obviously this Pokemon will not be able to wall every threat BW has to offer, but a proportion large enough to justify its use. When building teams, the presence of threats such as Terrakion and Dragonite forces people to run particular checks in order to not lose to them. This Pokemon would be able to switch almost completely freely into threats such as (but not necessarily) those and force them out. This heavily neuters their dominance, and may result in a more diverse metagame, where Pokemon that can break through this new wall could become more popular. It could also decrease the gap between the number of offensive and defensive teams being run.

À la SkarmBliss in Gen 2, the wall could be designed to combine with an existing wall to form a solid core. Perhaps it could also have a specific niche role as highlighted in the questions, which would give people more reason to use it than simply sitting there and taking hits. As there is such a huge catalogue of options in the BW metagame, each team member needs to have a definite role in order to be worthwhile.

Seeing how much of a boost offense has had over the last two generations and how little has happened in the way of helping defense, I think it would be a logical step to add some "extreme defense" into the game. I'm aware this is a relatively simplistic concept, but it's easy to execute and has a lot of different possibilities. It's at least a breath of fresh air from previous CAP concepts which were mostly based around offensive concepts.

 

[Pokethan]

Just looked back at your post to make sure I didn't trip up and miss something. I understand what you are communicating but I'm unsure as to how such moves would become viable if not powered up in some way which is, as you say, indicated strongly in your title. Simple Bibarel has already shown us the extent of boosting attacking options in charge beam... I guess I don't really see a strong direction to explore that can't already be done by existing pokemon.

The idea was that this pokemon uses the less commonly used moves effectively not just moves that are low power but also moves that are poorly distributed like Change Gear, Vacuum Wave and others that aren't exclusive to legendary pokemon. I thought it would give a nice change of pace because even though Scizor and Breelom both use that ability I don't think that they use that ability to its full potential because they only use like 2 to 3 moves that use it. The idea would be to create a pokemon that can make multiple movesets with moves that use Technician or are just badly distributed.

Once again I think I should change the title or maybe my idea is stretching too far in two directions. The whole idea i wanted was a pokemon that uses uncommonly used moves effectively while also having access to poorly distributed because they are also at the same time uncommonly used.

 

[Jellicent]

Name: One for One
General Description: A Pokemon that can reliably, effectively remove one of its opponent's Pokemon at the cost of its own life
Justification: Essentially, this Pokemon would be able to consistently turn battles into more or less a 5 on 5 fight. Similar to how Wobbuffet can take out an opponent with Encore + Counter / Mirror Coat, but is crippled for the rest of the match. Or, how Choice Band Lickilicky in Gen 4 could use Explosion to essentially neuter anything that wasn't a Ghost or Rock / Steel. However, this would aim to be more reliable than Lickilicky could ever hope to be, and less of a team player than Wobbuffet. Its top purpose would be removing one threat, ideally a key threat to the rest of one's team.
Questions To Be Answered:
- Is the ability to remove one opponent's Pokemon at essentially the cost of one of your own teamslots overpowered?
- How will teams be able to stand against each other 5 vs 5, or even 4 vs 4 should both players carry this Pokemon?
- Will the easy removal of a top tier threat's check result in a much faster paced metagame, or will it force people to carry multiple checks to various threats and result in a slower, more defensive metagame?
- Is it reasonable for a Pokemon to be able to consistently net one, and just one, KO every battle?
- Will weather based teams be forced to carry moves such as Rain Dance or Sunny Day to make up for the easy removal of their weather starter?
- Can stall teams effectively use a 1 for 1 strategy to keep opposing stallbreakers at bay, or will the loss of a teamslot be too large of a sacrifice for them to work effectively?
- How will this Pokemon's mere presence on Team Preview affect the way a player battles?
Explanation: Teams often seek to remove a key counter to open up for a sweep with their sweeper of choice. This Pokemon could effectively do just that, allowing a key sweeper to begin its rampage. However, the opponent could just as easily carry this to remove your sweeper before a proper sweep could be pulled off, forcing you to carry a backup plan. In many strategy card games, simple 1 for 1 cards are usually considered fair. For instance, Yugioh uses 40 card decks, and the spell card Mystical Space Typhoon can quickly remove an opponent's spell or trap, essentially fairly reducing both players' hands / field presence by one. While this is perfectly acceptable in a card game with 40+ card decks, how would this concept fare in a more limiting 6 on 6 atmosphere?

 

[Scorpio]

Name: Backfire II

General Description: A Pokemon that uses the opponent's abilities/items/moves against them.

Justification:

Many pokemon (but not all) in the OU metagame would not be there if it weren't for a great ability and/or a good movepool (especially boosting moves on a sweeper). Abilities like Chlorophyll, Sand Rush, Magic Bounce, and Storm Drain have boosted Pokemon to the top of their tiers or have boosted previously lackluster Pokemon to OU, and have even resulted in a few bans. And even without a good ability, Pokemon with boosting moves like Shell Smash and Quiver Dance, or even old favorites such as Swords Dance and Calm Mind have still made it to OU. These Pokemon (and many others) have their power boosted even further through the use of items such as Choice items, Life Orb, or Leftovers.

My question to you is: what if there was a Pokemon that could use these good traits and helpful items and turn them against the opponent? This Pokemon would be an epic-level decentralizer, since these Pokemon can no longer rely on what made them so good in the first place. This would also allow less used Pokes a chance to shine, since the stuff that's out to beat them is being handled by this Pokemon.

Questions To Be Answered:

-Is this way too gimmicky?
-Does the Pokemon need support to be effective?
-Is the Pokemon too powerful/broken?
-Will this Pokemon be way too hard to come up with a concept for?
-Could this Pokemon unbalance the metagame by making OU status based off BST alone, or even cetralize the metagame around itself?
-This Pokemon may be too similar to Arcticblast's Boost Thief it its execution.
-The justification may be way too long :P

Explanation:

-This Pokemon could serve as a hard counter to top threats and set-up sweepers.
-This Pokemon could effectively utilize moves like Psych Up, Snatch, or Punishment.
-This Pokemon could use different sets to counter different strategies

 

[Juicebox 001]

Name: Emo Fighter

General Description: This Pokemon makes brilliant use of moves/items that deal damage to the user without negating the negative effects to make room for things that boost damage.

Justification: A lot of moves are generally powerful or have good effects but come at a price. Because of this, these moves are not used often and not to their full potential. This Pokemon is designed to take full advantage of these moves/items and not be affected greatly by the deprivations. We will learn how these moves can be used to devastating effect in the OU metagame and how they are best implemented.

Questions To Be Answered:

• Would this pokemon be a burden to its team-mates by hurting itself?
• Would this pokemon be better in the early game or the late game?
• Does a pokemon that hurts itself faint too quickly to be effective in the OU metagame?
• What pokemon could help this pokemon set up to use recoil moves to their greatest effectiveness?

Explanation: When I originally thought of this concept, I wanted to give a unique twist on the concept of recoil moves. I thought "What would happen if a pokemon could benefit from hurting itself?" Because of this, abilities like rock head were out of my head from the very beginning. I decided in my head on this pokemon being high HP and high Attack, although that's just me. Ideally, this pokemon would have few weaknesses in order to stay battling for a long time. I thought it would be interesting to see how these things play out without the protection of such abilities.

I would think that this pokemon would be more of a late game sweeper so that the rest of its team has the opportunity to remove the few threats that could take it down. The combination of items like choice scarf along with the power of moves like Double-Edge could make for a devastating sweep. I also thought that it could go out with explosion if there is nothing to stop it from dying. Hence 'Emo' Fighter.

 

[zyrefredric]

I'd like to give my support for SubwayJ's Double Team. So far, this is the most exciting concept in this thread so far, exciting enough to make me post about it! (Usually I just lurk ^^). I like it for the following reasons:

• Having this concept may be a challenge, in that it may seem that we'll be running two CAPs at the same time. But I think we as a community can rise up to the challenge and accomplish something great.
• The fact that we are doing the NFE and FE at the same time somehow saves us time, in that we won't have to do the pre-evo threads.
• Designing the NFE gives as an opportunity to explore one of the best items BW brought for us: Eviolite.
• Two Pokemon, of the exact typing, doing completely opposite roles, is an interesting thing. The fact that one is an evolution of the other is so great from a flavor perspective.

Also,

Hide

Putting this in hidetags cause it may be a bit of poll jumping, but IF we do use this concept, wouldn't it be best if the NFE and FE are exactly the same except only for their stat distribution? They should have the same movepool, same typing and even the same BST (ala Scyther and Scizor). That means the process would actually go faster than first expected, because if this is the case, only the Stat Distribution needs to be separated processes. (I'd even say it would also be great if we choose a unique typing for this CAP, so we can objectively compare the two Pokemon in isolation, not to be compared with already existing Pokemon of the same type.)

 

[phoopes]

Name: Hyper Offense Revival

General Description: Many say that stall is dead. However, another style of play has been dying recently too: Hyper Offense. This CAPmon would attempt to bring back the playability that Hyper Offense once had before the ban of key players in the Hyper Offense playstyle.

Justification: By making a CAPmon that supports Hyper Offense, we would be bringing a style of play back into the fold. Rather than seeing weather on every other team, more variety would be introduced to the OU metagame. As someone previous said, the Top 6 Pokemon used rarely change, and all of the Top 6 are consistently used on weather teams, with two even being weather starters. With the reintroduction of a playstlye, this could again add variety to the OU metagame, by changing the types of Pokemon that you would see on a regular basis.

Questions to be Answered:

• Can the Hyper Offense playstyle become viable again?
• Can the dominance of the weather and VolTurn playstyles be usurped?
• Can the roles of banned Pokemon be played just as well by a new Pokemon?
• Will there be more variety in the Pokemon that one would see in the OU metagame if Hyper Offense regains popularity?
• Will other playstyles become more popular as well to act as a counter to Hyper Offense?
• Which lesser-used Pokemon can benefit from the new buffer to Hyper Offense?
• Which OU Pokemon can most effectively take advantage of the Hyper Offense playstyle?

Explanation: Ever since the ban of key Hyper Offense Pokemon such as Deoxys-S and Thundurrus, there has been a decline in the use of that playstyle, while other playstyles like weather and VolTurn have gained even more popularity. The goal of this CAPmon would be to create a Pokemon that can effectively bring this style of play back into the fold.

What makes this concept even more intriguing is that it the created Pokemon could become multiple things. The new Pokemon could be similar to the great double screens lead that Deoxys-S used to be, or it could be created as the fearsome set-up sweeper that Thundurrus was. As a double screens lead, the CAP could benefit the set-up sweepers that Hyper Offense was renowned for, such as Terrakion or Dragonite. As a set-up sweeper, it could fulfill the roll as a must-have on a Hyper Offense team that Thundurrus was, which nothing has truly replaced since.

If Hyper Offense would return to its former glory, how would that effect the usage of the current most popular playstyles, weather and VolTurn? This is yet another reason why the reintroduction of Hyper Offense could be intriguing. It would create a wider variety in what Pokemon you would normally see, and shake things up in the playstyle department, because other playstyles might see use to try and counter Hyper Offense.

Seeing which OU Pokemon can take advantage most, and what lesser-used Pokemon could benefit the most from the Hyper Offense CAP would also be interesting. If the CAP would be a double screens lead, which would benefit more, Infernape or Lucario? And would Shell Smash Omastar suddenly become viable? If the CAP were a set-up sweeper, would Espeon or Alakazam see more use as a double screen lead? Or would Uxie have its time to shine?

In conclusion, reviving the Hyper Offense playstyle could teach us so much about the OU metagame. Instead of this CAP being a Pokemon that fulfills a certain role in the current metagame, it could expand the metagame into a larger playing field, where more Pokemon could see consistent use. The very OU metagame itself could be shaken up by the introduction of a Hyper Offense-related CAP. Thank you for the consideration.

 

[Master of the Six Kings]

Name: Something to Write Home About

General Description: This Pokemon uses a single very high stat to get all of it's work done. It will be able to function through meager stats outside of the one chosen and predictability.

Justification: Looking at what Pokemon have the highest of any one stat, you'll be hard pressed to find anything too close to the top in our BW OU metagame. Pokemon who specialize in using one stat to get all of their work done have become less prevelant, falling to only a few household names, such as Blissey (who still has a phenomenal second stat in its Sp. def), Haxorus, and Cloyster (although Cloyster's stat isn't the focus of its success). Looking into what could make Pokemon like Ramparods and Shuckle into top tiering OU mon without making them Uber bait would provide a lot of careful attention with a lot of possibility.


Questions To Be Answered:

• What stat is best to focus on for this Pokemon?
• What is needed to make a Pokemon with one centralizing stat good in the OU metagame?
• What kind of team support will be needed to make a one stat Pokemon useful?
• What typing, moves and ability will allow this Pokemon to make the most of it's beefiest stat without becoming broken?

Explination: Looking at the last concept, we took a very powerful gimmick move, Sketch and tried to work limits around it. Gen 5 has done a lot of that, with moves like Quiver Dance, Shell Smash and Scald, and abilities like Magic Bounce and Prankster that almost make the Pokemon using them irrelevant. I came up with this concept trying to refine the idea of looking at the Pokemon itself in a straight froward manner. Haxorus, the best example of such a Pokemon, is entirely successful because of it's amazing typing in mono-dragon moreso than its monster attack stat. I'd like to see us come up with a variation of that that isn't clutched to the best single offensive type in the game. The typing chosen will also be important to reflect the stat, and the movepool will have to make use of the stat without desiging Mewthree in the process.

 

[Pallas Athena]

Flarepheonix332:

Yes, it would be a glass cannon. However, I think there's a bit more to learn than meets the eye. Many "glass cannons" proved to have too much power and speed and were deemed broken. These include Thundurus, the offensive Deoxys forms, Blaziken, Darkrai, and Shaymin-S. Others proved to have two little, and fell into UU. The only surviving "glass cannon" sweepers that don't really try to boost their bulk are Jolteon and Infernape, who are used for rain abuse and dismantling SkarmBliss respectively.

The truth is, we still don't know what the "ideal" blend of speed, power, typing, and coverage is to create a glass cannon capable of success in a metagame dominated by priority and bulky offense. I think it could be interesting to explore.

 

[Cretacerus]

Name: Emo Fighter

This one is actually a great idea for CAP3 in my opinion.
It would be really nice to have a Pokemon capable of powering through problematic walls that otherwise completely wall youre team.
Equipped with choice items and high powered moves "Emo Fighter" could be very useful to destroy seemingly unbrakable cores at the cost of its own life.

I've used things like Choice Band Aggron in a similar way, getting past the annoying BlisseySkarmony core in genIV with brute force, but it was easily stopped by others.
CAP3 could be perfectionated in its wallbraker role, while recoil would prevent it from becoming too unstoppable.

And then again, giving CAP3 a band ist just one of its possibilities

 

[bubbly]

Supporting DarkBlazeR's Great Wall concept. It's simple but you see close to zero effective pure stall teams on the ladder, and it's mainly because there are just so many different ridiculous offensive threats. Something simple like a bulky Ghost/Steel levitator is what I'd be looking at.

 

[paintseagull]

Just have to give brief thoughts on this.

My general feeling on weather is that it's so dominant in so many tiers that it's been done to death. I want something a little bit more ambitious than trying to find the perfect Snow Warning Pokemon, which is what any Hail-based concept is going to become. There are plenty of good Pokemon with access to Hail. None of them use it, because temporary weather is almost useless. So it's one of the more restricting concepts, and my taste this CAP is for something a little bit more ambitious. Nothing against Hail, the concepts are perfectly good and legal, it's just it's perennially brought up and perennially shot down as the direction the CAP community wants to go.

This type of argument I find very problematic. How is determining whether or not we need a Snow Warning pokemon and then figuring out how to make that pokemon optimal in hail not ambitious? I keep hearing people claim that they *KNOW* a pokemon would have to have Snow Warning for this to work, but I'm not sure that everyone agrees with that. Even if it did need Snow Warning, so what? There are still plenty of things that need to be dealt with, and lots of hail effects that could be put to use. It's not the same as other weather - different pokemon use it, different pokemon resist it. If other forms of weather are so powerful, how can we just shrug off the underused kinds?

The main argument against this concept that I keep hearing is that people know it wouldn't work, or that other weather is better. How is this something we know and can't change moreso than any of the other more abstract concepts?

The question I really want everyone to think about is (with respect to all concepts): Do you like a concept because it's ambitious or are you confusing abstractness and complexity for ambitiousness? Why toss aside a straightforward, clear, well-defined concept that hasn't been done and instead do something complicated?

Deck Knight, I know you already had your last say on Hail, that's fine, you've heard me talk about this in #cap. This is for the benefit of others, and also a general point for all concepts.

 

[Argorine]

I would like to say that if a few of these concepts are combined we could see a unique and useful Pokemon. For example, a Pokemon that could shrug off burns could be a fire/rock type with water absorb. Just an idea, we could combine some of these suggestions. My own submission is very broad and could be difficult to agree on its typing and ability AND if it fills any other role. Many of these concepts are move based, and some are typing based.

 

[lisalo]

Name: Half-life

Generasl Description:Make a pokemon that gives another pokemon a chance for a pokemon to be useful twice in return for its own life.

Justification: In every metagame, there are pokemon that heavily damage its counters before having to die (ie. stronger dragon type users with Outrage). It would be interesting to see whether these pokemon can sweep twice when given the opportunity.

Quesstions:
- Will a pokemon that's useless by itself be used in the metagame?
- Can players counter strong threats twice?
- Will this hurt offensive teams (due to multiple walls) or deffenssive teams (due to multiple sweepers) the most?
- SWhat is neede to give a sweeper a second chance?
- Can the second opportunities make previously UU pokemon rise (due to being able to break their counters)

Explanation: Many threats only have a counter for a specific threat, which means that said threat can wreck the team once eliminating said threat. Thiss pokemon aims to suicide itself in return for being able to give this threat a seconsd chance.

This pokemon should carry moves that benefit its teammates. Lunar dance and healing wish are the most obvious, but memento and grudge could also be interesting options in order to allow for a weakened pokemon to heal/set up. If done right, wish and possibly screens could be used for thiss concept.

It must be noted that this pokemon should not be aimed sas a general team supporter (ie. Fortress). Rather, it must be used once for a specific purpose. Therefore, I would like to propose no hazard access whatsoever, or Rapid spin (as that would mean it is useful to actually keep it alive). It should not have the capacity to sweep, which can be achieved through bland typing and low stats.

Its ability would allow it to support the team. Abilities such as prankster or (probably not) Wonder guard might be useful, as could weak armour if he actually has the bulk to take one hit. Static and flame body could alsso benefit this concept by giving the ssetuper a weaker pokemon to set up againsst.

I hope you like my submission. Also, noob here, so I hope not to have broken CAP rules.