Im not following. You basically make a wonderful post detailing how Deoxys-D is not broken but then finishes its saying ''it ruins stall, lets ban it''. Since when is that an argument? Rain ruins sand, sun and rain ruin each other, hail ruins rain, offensive ruins stall. This is how things work. If stall inst viable anymore is cause the metagame has become more offensive. Deoxys-D is one of the many contributors to this. Times change, everything is so ridiculous strong nowadays that offensive is usually the best way to play. HOWEVER saying stall is completely useless is not true, it can still be used effectively but its harder of course.
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np: BW OU Suspect Testing Round 10 - Hazard
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Except you don't know what set its running and thats half the problem. For example you can taunt it if you like, its o.k, ill reveal Mental Herb and get 2 layers down.
Or you can hit my Deoxys-D with a SPecs Hydro Pump if you want, if im running the standard set ill still get down 2 (3 if Hydro Pump misses) layers, and cut the PP of your Hydro Pump by half.
Again, noone is saying its unbeatable, its just very hard to consistently win against it (outside of perhapes Magic Bounce) due to it being able to change its item and free moveslot around to fuck over a counter.
>Not using Surf
Also anyone ever try out midgame Deo-D? That's Defensively EV'd Deo-D with Leftovers and Recover so it can come in and put down some layers whenever it wants and doesn't become fodder in the first 3 turns. It's pretty good if you can take out the spinner and you can get your hazards up easily. I don't know if its better than the lead since that can almost 100% get SR and a layer of Spikes up barring Espeon/Xatu but having them spun after Deo-D dies sucks.
That said, I think Deo-D is super annoying for the same reasons Deo-S was, but I'm unsure if that means it's broken. I think Jirachi in the Rain is the most annoying shit in OU, but that doesn't make it broken.
You must not play very much OU or are lucky because I see it all the time lol.
I thought the same. I was under the impression that smogon's policy entailed staying as close to the game as possible while attempting to create an ideal metagame, which means only banning when things are truly overpowering.
Deo d certainly is not a major contributer to any shittiness in the meta right now. It is hardly even used! It has a relatively small impact on anything really, not to mention that its job can be performed comparitively by other pokes.
And to deo being banned making weatherless completely godawful: about 60% of the matches i play are against weatherless and I have come across maybe 1 deo d in the last week. Acting as if not using a weather is having an utter disadvantage is not only very much undermining the ideology that we must try to be creative or w/e, but it is also completely glorifying weather.
It seems to me that the stale meta isn't a result of stale pokes, it's the result of "oh, well apparently weather is super good so not using it would be an injustice" ideologies. You don't HAVE to use these things, you know? All of the standard (weather) cores aren't used because they are amazing, they are used because people say they are good, and then refuse to branch out into any other playstyle
Just chiming in here to say that defensive oriented teams are still effective and used by some good players (example: MarceloDK in SPL!) and Deo-D is one of their lesser worries!
Otherwise i completely agree with the detailed post made by alexwolf which depicts pretty good why Deo-D is a top pokemon but no broken.
Otherwise i completely agree with the detailed post made by alexwolf which depicts pretty good why Deo-D is a top pokemon but no broken.
But isn't that true of all pokemon?
"Oh terrakion I'll just send in scizor as it sds"
Sets up aub
"Oh scarf keldeo. Go ferrothorn!"
Subcm
Or in the spirit of these deoxy-d debates:
"Oh jellicent. Go gastrodon!"
Uses energy ball
The fact of the matter is, deoxys d can't run EVERYTHING at once. Running mental herb? You can spin. Not running heb, you can taunt. Runming thunder+gem (which is a complete gimmick by definition and has no place in discussion)? 1hko with lots, 2hko with more.
Etc etc
If Deoxys-D doesn't carry Red Card, and your opponents discover this, you have to insta-switch our or prepare yourself for anything will want to sweep your team on the free turn. While if Deoxys-D doesn't carry Mental Herb, it's Taunt bait, that's pretty much similar, but worst as you can't even setup the rocks. Any other item is a gimnnicky (every Pokémon can user gimnnicky sets, but that doesn't mean they actually are doing good by using them). So, your opponent can just attack it, test if he doest have Red Card or not, and from there know what exactly set is running Deoxys-D, it will still guarantee SR + 1 layers of spikes, most probably, but not more.
As for the last move comes, it's really hard to tell, but Deoxys-D almost never use other move than Taunt + Stealth Rock + Spikes, as you don't need to run anything else at all, and any other counter move will just allow you to anti-counter just few Pokémon.
But, anyway, that's pretty much the same true of almost any hazard setter apart from Forrestress, Stealth Rock + Taunt/Magic Coat + Toxic Spikes/Spikes/Utility Move + Anti-Counters Move. Offensive sets of Deoxys-D are easy to broke, Dual Screens Deoxys-D is by other hand nice, but he's not the unique or flawless best option of that, if we ban him for it's Dual Screens, then we have to ban a lot of the metagame, lol.
As for the last move comes, it's really hard to tell, but Deoxys-D almost never use other move than Taunt + Stealth Rock + Spikes, as you don't need to run anything else at all, and any other counter move will just allow you to anti-counter just few Pokémon.
But, anyway, that's pretty much the same true of almost any hazard setter apart from Forrestress, Stealth Rock + Taunt/Magic Coat + Toxic Spikes/Spikes/Utility Move + Anti-Counters Move. Offensive sets of Deoxys-D are easy to broke, Dual Screens Deoxys-D is by other hand nice, but he's not the unique or flawless best option of that, if we ban him for it's Dual Screens, then we have to ban a lot of the metagame, lol.
Why would anyone blindly send in Ferro or Scizor on those pokemon without knowing their sets first. That's how you lose pokemon games lol, making reckless decisions that give you little to no benefit.
You dont, but you cant let threats like those alone without a check. If terrakion is in you send in scizor at the first opportunity cause its the best check available. Its not a reckless decision, its common sense that most terrakion dont have sub and can be defeated by scizor easily. With Deoxys-D its the same thing, you send in something like ttar and get surprised by superpower. As it has been said before, this applies to any pokemon.
The difference between energy ball jellicent and magic coat/thunder wave/skill swap on deoxys is that they are all actually viable and can beat an entire style of shutting down deoxys instead of just a single pokemon. However, I will agree that the gems are really gimmicks and should be treated as such.
Exactly, its a check, not a counter lol. I would never send in Scizor against Terrakion because at worst it will 2hko Scizor and at best it will OHKO with band. What a stupid way to kill your best check with reckless play. Keep Scizor healthy and send in a pokemon to take the Close Combat/Stone Miss. If it ends up having Sub, well thankfully your Scizor will be healthy and able to revenge the +1 Speed Terrakion! Moronic decisions can apply to every pokemon, I agree with that.
Okay I played some battles on the suspect ladder earlier and have a few things I noticed.
First of all, this suspect metagame is even worse than the last one. Deoxys-D teams are fine, imo, but every single battle I've played has been against rain. It's not even a matter of whether rain is broken or not; it's that everyone is using these easy teams. Of COURSE rain is going to be centralizing if everyone uses it. I've seen a million Politoed / Ferrothorn / Latios / Keldeo / 2 fillers teams.
Rant about the suspect ladder aside, I suppose I'll address Deoxys-D.
You proved how Deoxys-D is not broken in the rest of your post, so I won't get into that, as you state pretty much everything I'd want to say nice and clearly.
Ban things because they're broken, not because you don't like them.
EDIT: Just to clarify, I'm not suggesting that you think stall is unviable, I'm saying that you're overblowing Deoxys-D's effect on stall.
First of all, this suspect metagame is even worse than the last one. Deoxys-D teams are fine, imo, but every single battle I've played has been against rain. It's not even a matter of whether rain is broken or not; it's that everyone is using these easy teams. Of COURSE rain is going to be centralizing if everyone uses it. I've seen a million Politoed / Ferrothorn / Latios / Keldeo / 2 fillers teams.
Rant about the suspect ladder aside, I suppose I'll address Deoxys-D.
We might disagree on banning philosophies, I don't know, but this argument troubles me; specifically the first part. Pokemon are banned because they are broken. Also, why is making the metagame more offensive necessarily a bad thing? Stall IS viable in this metagame, I don't understand why you pretend it isn't. Deoxys-D dies very quickly. Stall teams usually have the proper means with which to stay healthy and spin away hazards. If anything, I'd say Deoxys-D is going to have trouble keeping hazards up against a well-built stall team. Even if limits stall, why does that matter? It's almost as if you're fighting a battle to make stall good, but it is already. Stall will never be as popular in BW no matter what we ban. A stall-dominated metagame has long battles and still has centralizing strategies. No matter what we ban, there will always be centralizing strategies.alexwolf said:
You proved how Deoxys-D is not broken in the rest of your post, so I won't get into that, as you state pretty much everything I'd want to say nice and clearly.
Ban things because they're broken, not because you don't like them.
EDIT: Just to clarify, I'm not suggesting that you think stall is unviable, I'm saying that you're overblowing Deoxys-D's effect on stall.
Finally someone gets it!
Sending in starmie against deo d is just asking to get thunder'd
Sending in forry is just asking for an hp fire
Oh and dont even think about xati because you can get skill swapped (or ghost gem sballed or something)
Therefore deoxys has no checks at all and nothing can stop it fron getting 4 layers
#oops
/sarcasm(ifyoucouldn'ttell)
I could tell lol. It doesn't really help prove your point though, because Deo-D is relied on for SR and Spikes and that's it. After that anything else it gets is just a bonus. There's nothing stopping Deo-D from switching out until it gets a favorable matchup, and it can Taunt Forry to prevent it from laying its own hazards. To say those are counters is foolish because they haven't fully stopped Deo-D from doing its job, they just temporarily postponed it.
In my personal opinion, I honestly don't think Deoxys-D should go. I mean, Deoxys has pretty much invented the hyper offense playstyle, and it's like any other playstyle, you have to play around it. What do you do with rain? You run something to check the rain abusers, and kill their weather. Everybody says that Deo-D is always guaranteed 2 layers. Well, maybe it gets 4, but still, there are ways to beat it. Namely foresight hitmontop, who can take any hit from the spin blockers (Gengar, Jellicent, etc), nail them with a foresight on the switch, and if Deo is dead, then you've pretty much won the game right there. Now, I realize that this only works if you're running a certain pokemon, but, isn't the whole reason for this suspect test because of the hazards Deo gets down, and not itself? And hitmontop isn't all that garbage either, close combat with it's respectable attack stat can still do good damage, not to mention it having such a wide array of priority.
Bottom line: the hazards it sets up are the problem, not Deoxys-D. And hazards can always be spun.
Bottom line: the hazards it sets up are the problem, not Deoxys-D. And hazards can always be spun.
Dark Fallen Angel
FIDDLESTICKS IS ALSO GOOD ON MID!
Yes but... Try to do this when your opponent is keeping so much pressure on you that you are hard PRESSED to find an opportunity to spin?
This itself is a problem, actually. Lets say that you opt to remove Deoxys-D with Banded TTar and remove the hazards with, say, Starmie. So you lead with TTar as they lead with Deoxys, they SR, and you Crunch them for the OHKO.
Now they send out Terrakion. You switch out as they start setting up. Turns out that they're SubSalac. You have to take it out immediately, or it will get too many boosts and wreck your team, so you wipe it out.
Then they switch in another sweeper, one that wrecks your Terrakion counter/check that you have in right now. Gotta stop that one, too. And this continues until your team is worn down and you can't handle the next threat, at which point it plows you over.
When were you planning on Spinning, during that battle? On Terrakion? Salamence? Gengar? It isn't happening, unless your opponent doesn't really know what's going on. Each time you revenge a threat, you open yourself up to being set up on by another. That's HO for ya.
And this wasn't really a problem back when HO typically used dual screens. They wore off after 8 turns at the most, which weren't too difficult to stall out if done properly. But of course hazards don't go away, and Deoxys is literally the perfect 'mon for the job, requiring that the opponent rely on Choiced Pokemon to take it out, and giving the HO team the opportunities it needs to get going.
TLDR; Ban Deo-D, reasons.
You're gonna have to explain to me why you're saying this.
There was a post slightly above me in which the user said: I don't like Deo-D in this metagame but I'm worried banning it would not let weatherless teams keep up.
If I have to reword what I said for you, what I said to him was "If Deo-D is broken, just ban it. Here is why it is OK if you do that and why it isn't OK if you don't ban it."
I really hope you just read that wrong, and I'd still like to know where you get this "logic is flawed" stuff. That isn't a 2 sided argument, that's how you vote on Smogon.
yee you are right i misunderstood you my bad. I though that you meant that weather is broken anyway so don't worry if Deo-D leaves and weatherless suffers as weather will leave too. But what you said was that if Deo-D leaves and then weather is overwhelming, then this will mean that weather is broken. So once again i am sorry, wrong interpretation.
To everyone that asks me how can i say that Deo-D is not broken but i still want it banned i have to say this: NOT ONLY BROKEN THINGS GET BANNED. This mindset has long ago been dispelled, as clearly evidenced by the recent Sand Veil and Snow Cloak bans, as well as the older Evasion, and OHKO clause. You can even look to other metagames such as UU, were sand was banned because it made the metagame significantly worse (at least this is what i understood after reading the senate's reasoning as to why they banned it). Even Genesect wasn't found to be broken by many people (with which i have talked to) but they wanted it gone because it made the metagame unhealthy. Of 'course not everyone believed this but a large amount of people i talked with or read their posts shared this opinion.
So now you can see where i am coming from. While defensive teams in general are still viable, they are not as viable as offensive or weather teams (be it offense, or balance, or even stall for sand). And when i say they are not as viable i don't mean that defensive teams are a little bit less viable than other popular styles. I mean that they are way less viable, in a way that their variety has been reduced to smithereens. And this is not how the things should be in a balanced metagame. Of 'course each playstyle can't be equally viable even in the perfect meta, but they can be very close in viability so we should aim for this. Atm i feel like defensive teams are way beyond in terms of viability than any othe playstyle and Deo-D is one of the main reasons why this happens. So by banning it the gap of viability between stall and other more offensive minded playstyles will become somewhat smaller, which is something nice. After all it's not like this will kill HO offense teams, as there are still many viable suicide leads that can keep it viable.
Also Conflict i would love to hear about a stall team that isn't worried about Deo-D, as it has always been one of my stall team's problems.
To everyone that asks me how can i say that Deo-D is not broken but i still want it banned i have to say this: NOT ONLY BROKEN THINGS GET BANNED. This mindset has long ago been dispelled, as clearly evidenced by the recent Sand Veil and Snow Cloak bans, as well as the older Evasion, and OHKO clause. You can even look to other metagames such as UU, were sand was banned because it made the metagame significantly worse (at least this is what i understood after reading the senate's reasoning as to why they banned it). Even Genesect wasn't found to be broken by many people (with which i have talked to) but they wanted it gone because it made the metagame unhealthy. Of 'course not everyone believed this but a large amount of people i talked with or read their posts shared this opinion.
So now you can see where i am coming from. While defensive teams in general are still viable, they are not as viable as offensive or weather teams (be it offense, or balance, or even stall for sand). And when i say they are not as viable i don't mean that defensive teams are a little bit less viable than other popular styles. I mean that they are way less viable, in a way that their variety has been reduced to smithereens. And this is not how the things should be in a balanced metagame. Of 'course each playstyle can't be equally viable even in the perfect meta, but they can be very close in viability so we should aim for this. Atm i feel like defensive teams are way beyond in terms of viability than any othe playstyle and Deo-D is one of the main reasons why this happens. So by banning it the gap of viability between stall and other more offensive minded playstyles will become somewhat smaller, which is something nice. After all it's not like this will kill HO offense teams, as there are still many viable suicide leads that can keep it viable.
Also Conflict i would love to hear about a stall team that isn't worried about Deo-D, as it has always been one of my stall team's problems.
Deoxys-D is actually the biggest threat to stall, and the reasons are that it is bulky, can stop walls from setting up hazards, stops walls from using recovery moves, and sets up hazards itself. The easy hazards compliment the many huge offensive threats of BW that attack with their powerful STAB and/or high Base Power moves. It (Deo-D) is more threatening to stall than any individual offensive Pokemon. To say it is one of stall's lesser worries is just incorrect.
Evasion Clause was banned because it was broken:
Chansey used Minimize!
And that's pretty much good game unless you carry something that can OHKO Chansey, Aura Sphere, phazing, or you get really lucky with a critical hit or with status, the same, but at lessen degree can be said of any minimize user, and the best part is even if you phaze her, she can just comeback once the phazer was defeated and repeat the same with total impunity. On ubers it was unbanned because it was tested and the results said it was not really broken at all on ubers, as Kyogre's omnipresense and perfect accuracy Thunder, Aura Sphere, Ho-oh's/Lugia's phazing, and the general higher power of normal Pokémon on the tier and the really low power of the evasion users made it really unreliable, but in OU that's other history. The clause was carried more for legacy and for fear of previous monster with that, anyway, as Chansey/Shuckle on RBY and GSC were literally impossible to handle with Evasion Clause off, you can phaze them, yes, but nothing will stop them from come back, and repeat the same until you run out from PP's before them, your unique real option were Explode things and pray for the explosions hits.
OHKO's moves were banned because they were proveed broken, Articuno + Lock-On style moves = InstaK.O's per two turns to anything, and by other hand, you can't break a wall? Fissure was used! OHKO landed! End. People is already risking with Focus Blast, OHKO moves just have somewhat less of the half of accuracy, and those moves make stall, semi-stall, balanced, and offensive-balanced literaly impossible. That's far more powerful than anything else on OU, and with a really decent chance to land once you used it some turns.
Sand Veil was banned because Garchomp, people prefered to regain Garchomp in exchange to lost an ability, that's pretty much all, Snow Cloack was inserted on the ban just for... flavor wise, mostly. Literally the same did happen with the previous evasion bans like with Brightpowder, but people was also somewhat worried of other abussers, but not too much as of Garchomp. Genesect was voted for being broken, at least that's what the majority said, and if the majority doesn't think that, then it should be unbanned. Moddy was banned for mostly the same reason that Blaziken was banned, but with the OHKO and evasion clauses flavor incluided.
Doubles are other story.
Things should be banned from OU because they are broken, not really for other reason, as the idea is try to archive the lessen number of bans possible for the OU play.
Chansey used Minimize!
And that's pretty much good game unless you carry something that can OHKO Chansey, Aura Sphere, phazing, or you get really lucky with a critical hit or with status, the same, but at lessen degree can be said of any minimize user, and the best part is even if you phaze her, she can just comeback once the phazer was defeated and repeat the same with total impunity. On ubers it was unbanned because it was tested and the results said it was not really broken at all on ubers, as Kyogre's omnipresense and perfect accuracy Thunder, Aura Sphere, Ho-oh's/Lugia's phazing, and the general higher power of normal Pokémon on the tier and the really low power of the evasion users made it really unreliable, but in OU that's other history. The clause was carried more for legacy and for fear of previous monster with that, anyway, as Chansey/Shuckle on RBY and GSC were literally impossible to handle with Evasion Clause off, you can phaze them, yes, but nothing will stop them from come back, and repeat the same until you run out from PP's before them, your unique real option were Explode things and pray for the explosions hits.
OHKO's moves were banned because they were proveed broken, Articuno + Lock-On style moves = InstaK.O's per two turns to anything, and by other hand, you can't break a wall? Fissure was used! OHKO landed! End. People is already risking with Focus Blast, OHKO moves just have somewhat less of the half of accuracy, and those moves make stall, semi-stall, balanced, and offensive-balanced literaly impossible. That's far more powerful than anything else on OU, and with a really decent chance to land once you used it some turns.
Sand Veil was banned because Garchomp, people prefered to regain Garchomp in exchange to lost an ability, that's pretty much all, Snow Cloack was inserted on the ban just for... flavor wise, mostly. Literally the same did happen with the previous evasion bans like with Brightpowder, but people was also somewhat worried of other abussers, but not too much as of Garchomp. Genesect was voted for being broken, at least that's what the majority said, and if the majority doesn't think that, then it should be unbanned. Moddy was banned for mostly the same reason that Blaziken was banned, but with the OHKO and evasion clauses flavor incluided.
Doubles are other story.
Things should be banned from OU because they are broken, not really for other reason, as the idea is try to archive the lessen number of bans possible for the OU play.
I'm really concise on things. Basically, Deo-D needs too much support for a couple of hazards. You probably need a spinblocker if you don't use the Spikes+3 Attacks set and you still have to worry about Taunt if you use that not to mention you lose SR. Also, a lot of common good pokemon (i.e. Donphan/Volcarona in the sun) can wreck most HO. A lot of HO teams really need a way to keep weather in check making it a huge strain on teambuilding
A weird thing I'd like to comment on is the sudden popularity of Baton Pass teams; I've faced 4 in the past two days.
The argument that Deoxys-D threatens stall is not a sound one, imho. There are many ways for Stall teams to defeat Deo-D; all it really takes is a pokemon that can hit decently hard or a faster pokemon with Taunt, as shown in user Arcticblast's RMT. Also, Deo-D can't really pose as anything other than a defensive threat to Stall teams; its hazards can be easily spun away and its health chipped. Terrakion / Cobalion can both Taunt it. Espeon can reflect is hazards away. That being said, it is a hard counter to Stall teams without any of those top things; you are either able to handle it, or you're not.
Still, I disagree with the notion that Deo-D is stall's biggest problem and that is one of the main reasons it should be banned. The arrival of BW2 a couple months ago AS A WHOLE made Stall a lot less effective, and it was already facing a decline with the beginning of BW1. Game Freak has given powerful new attacks and setup moves for offensive sweepers and attackers- but it hasn't given much for Stall except the degradation of the effectiveness of Suicide leads and new abilities that can further counter Stall. Deo-D is definitely not the biggest reason why Stall isn't effective anymore, instead, it's the whole new offensively inclined metagame that makes it hard for stall teams to work. Don't point fingers at Deo-D.
Also, I really don't like the idea that we should ban Deo-D because it hinders Stall. Besides the fact that that isn't even 100% true, as I said before the popularity of defensive teams have fallen because of the increase in offense in the metagame. Banning Deo-D really isn't going to make stall any more viable; heck it might even threaten stall more since Deoxys-Defense is a very great support / hazard pokemon for Stall and defensive teams. It is one of the few pokemon that can ser hazards in the face of much of the metagame, and taking it away from stall will only make it even less popular.
The meta is more offensive now because of the new BW2 powerhouses, not because Deo-D on HO teams can beat stall.
The argument that Deoxys-D threatens stall is not a sound one, imho. There are many ways for Stall teams to defeat Deo-D; all it really takes is a pokemon that can hit decently hard or a faster pokemon with Taunt, as shown in user Arcticblast's RMT. Also, Deo-D can't really pose as anything other than a defensive threat to Stall teams; its hazards can be easily spun away and its health chipped. Terrakion / Cobalion can both Taunt it. Espeon can reflect is hazards away. That being said, it is a hard counter to Stall teams without any of those top things; you are either able to handle it, or you're not.
Still, I disagree with the notion that Deo-D is stall's biggest problem and that is one of the main reasons it should be banned. The arrival of BW2 a couple months ago AS A WHOLE made Stall a lot less effective, and it was already facing a decline with the beginning of BW1. Game Freak has given powerful new attacks and setup moves for offensive sweepers and attackers- but it hasn't given much for Stall except the degradation of the effectiveness of Suicide leads and new abilities that can further counter Stall. Deo-D is definitely not the biggest reason why Stall isn't effective anymore, instead, it's the whole new offensively inclined metagame that makes it hard for stall teams to work. Don't point fingers at Deo-D.
Also, I really don't like the idea that we should ban Deo-D because it hinders Stall. Besides the fact that that isn't even 100% true, as I said before the popularity of defensive teams have fallen because of the increase in offense in the metagame. Banning Deo-D really isn't going to make stall any more viable; heck it might even threaten stall more since Deoxys-Defense is a very great support / hazard pokemon for Stall and defensive teams. It is one of the few pokemon that can ser hazards in the face of much of the metagame, and taking it away from stall will only make it even less popular.
The meta is more offensive now because of the new BW2 powerhouses, not because Deo-D on HO teams can beat stall.
I disagree Electrolyte. Deo-D is one of stall's biggest problems, and this is why its departure would give to stall, and defensive teams in general, a lot of breathing room. I don't care if stall will still have other problems to worry about, all i care is that stall will become marginally more viable and will have more variety. This will be something good for the metagame.
You say that common stall teams can get past it. And i ask how much they must compromise in order to do so? Arcticblast is not run over by Deo-D because he uses Magic Coat Jellicent, not because he uses Crobat, which looses to almost any Deo-D (be it Mental Herb or Magic Coat). And if you consider Magic Coat a viable option that anyone should be running on random Pokemon on its stall team in order to surprise and hold back for a little amount of time Deo-D then to me it seems that your borders as to what fucks a playstyle are very wide. Not to mention that Magic Coat only solves the problem for a short period of time. Ok so you use Magic Coat as i use SR. Now i can either spam SR 'till you switch out, or simply bring a sweeper that can set-up on Jellicent and start gaining momentum, while going to Deo-D on the first chance i get to set-up my hazards.
You also mention Terrakion and Cobalion, which are never used in stall, and finally spinners and Espeon. Espeon is easily bypassed by Skill Swap, while the spinners are temporarily spinblocked by Gengar and are very pressed to spin later in the match due to the offensive pressure that the sweepers of the HO team put. And don't say to me that Skill Swap is uncommon or gimmick, it is one of the three best options that Deo-D has for its last slot (T-Wave, S-Toss, Skill Swap).
Finally, i have never seen a Deo-D used in a stall team, and i am 99% sure that the banning of Deo-D will do nothing else but help stall's viability in OU.
You say that common stall teams can get past it. And i ask how much they must compromise in order to do so? Arcticblast is not run over by Deo-D because he uses Magic Coat Jellicent, not because he uses Crobat, which looses to almost any Deo-D (be it Mental Herb or Magic Coat). And if you consider Magic Coat a viable option that anyone should be running on random Pokemon on its stall team in order to surprise and hold back for a little amount of time Deo-D then to me it seems that your borders as to what fucks a playstyle are very wide. Not to mention that Magic Coat only solves the problem for a short period of time. Ok so you use Magic Coat as i use SR. Now i can either spam SR 'till you switch out, or simply bring a sweeper that can set-up on Jellicent and start gaining momentum, while going to Deo-D on the first chance i get to set-up my hazards.
You also mention Terrakion and Cobalion, which are never used in stall, and finally spinners and Espeon. Espeon is easily bypassed by Skill Swap, while the spinners are temporarily spinblocked by Gengar and are very pressed to spin later in the match due to the offensive pressure that the sweepers of the HO team put. And don't say to me that Skill Swap is uncommon or gimmick, it is one of the three best options that Deo-D has for its last slot (T-Wave, S-Toss, Skill Swap).
Finally, i have never seen a Deo-D used in a stall team, and i am 99% sure that the banning of Deo-D will do nothing else but help stall's viability in OU.
This is a whole heap of wrong, so let me educate you.
Deoxys-D does nothing to stall teams because Starmie can spin on it all day. Even Tentacruel can barring that Psycho Boost set. You don't need Magic Coat or Taunt to beat Deoxys-D on a stall team, almost any common spinner nowadays beats it. When you have Gengar spinblocking for a lot of these HO teams, it becomes even simpler to spin away hazards. And don't give me "Sash Gengar" bullshit, sand teams have no problem with this and almost all Rain stall teams can get SR up as they proceed to kill Deoxys.
No one uses Skill Swap because you remove a moveslot that could be used for something else. If Deoxys-D doesn't have an attacking move like Seismic Toss, any HO team that decides to boost turn 1 wins (I forget what ST9 match I watched this in, but literally it was Deo-D versus Dragonite, and Dragonite DD'd twice and swept the entire Deo-D offensive team, and no two scrubs were not playing).
To your last point, I won a #pokemon challenge in BW using a rain stall team with Deoxys-D as the defensive spiker. Not only did I get to #1 on PO but I used the team in several key tournament games. While Deoxys-D might not be used on stall teams in BW2 yet, it is not outclassed by other spikers - having access to Taunt and Recover is amazing, and you can stall out so many things with the set.
The metagame is so offensive anyway that banning Deoxys-D won't hamper offensive teams. SR Terrakion leads will become more common, or suicide spikers or whatever. Deoxys-D doesn't define offense - the sweepers in the metagame define offense. I don't care whether it gets banned or not, but a lot of the "facts" you posted weren't correct.
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