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All Gens Past Gens Research Thread

Discussion in 'Ruins of Alph' started by Jellicent, May 15, 2014.

  1. Sergi

    Sergi

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    don't know if this is the right place to say this, but whatever: lunar dance for some reason is not working properly on smogtours (i've tested in main and it works well).
    Here is the example. Actually it works that ways: lunar dance, user faints, pokemon is sent out, hazards damage, healing, opponents turn (if slower). That's the DPP mechanic.

    Same above applies to Healing Wish, but this one is working well: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen4ou-60564
  2. WreckDra

    WreckDra He came home from the war with a party in his head...
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    For ADV doubles: Stuff I know based on observation from XD:

    Switching in is proced directly after a Pokemon faints even if it is in the middle of a turn. If the Pokemon was KOed by a spread move, the spread move will run its course before the player if forced to switch in. The turn will continue as normal after the player has replaced the Fainted Pokemon. (this one has been known for a long time but I figured I would put it here)

    here are the interesting bits:

    When multiple Pokemon are KOed with a single move, the Speed at which the replacement Pokemon are switched in is based on the original turn order, not just Speed (this includes priority). This is the best example I could find:
    @about 4:18
    Because Clefable used Priority Follow Me, the order of switching in after Metagross's Explosion was Clefable -> Snorlax, Metagross -> Aerodactyl (Meta used Agility the turn before in order faster than Heracross), and Heracross -> Charizard, instead of Meta -> Aero, Hera -> Zard, Clef -> Lax. This is one I haven't heard of before, but could have very well been know.

    I am leaving this post primarily for myself as I try and get this to an implementable state(this will be rough). Anything else I notice while playing I will put here. I cannot check actual game code though due to lack of capturing hardware and dumping software, so I may need to call upon help for this as in game observation sometimes isn't enough.
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  3. Marty

    Marty Always more to find
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    Turn order doesn't actually have anything to do with it (and doesn't in any generation). In Gen 3 specifically, the host always switches Pokemon in/out first, regardless of the Speed of the Pokemon switching out, and this applies to switching in from fainted Pokemon as well. In Doubles the order is always host's left, other player's left, host's right, other player's right.

    In that video, the player character is the host (a battle's host switches in their lead Pokemon last), and since his left Pokemon didn't faint during that Explosion, the switching order was the AI's left first, then the player's right, then the AI's right. I don't actually know anything about Colosseum or XD's mechanics, having never played them, but the switching business looks to be exactly the same as the main series games.
  4. WreckDra

    WreckDra He came home from the war with a party in his head...
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    Yes, this is correct, I ended up moving my Helping Hand Minun I was using to test this to the right and yeah, it confirmed this (Minun Helping Hand boosted Electrode's Explosion and the Minun replacement Dragonite came in after the Electrode replacement Flareon). I guess I should have done this earlier, but good catch, thanks. This pattern probably appears in residual order and order of taking damage from spread attacks too, I will have to check.
  5. StarGengar

    StarGengar

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    This is something that has bugged me for years now, I searched for an answer and could not find it so I hope it's not a dumb question.

    Back in the day I abused the sheez out of the Box tricks in my pokemon gold cartridge, specifically the fusion glitch.

    This involved no glitch pokemon, neither eggs, so its not the unstable hybrids bulbapedia has documented. The closest I could find is this but 1) In my case, only 1 pokemon survives and more importantly 2) The daycare wont "cure" it (I remember triyng with mewtwo and not succeding, at least, but I could be wrong in the last point. Also, maybe the timing had to do with one dying or not, but that's not the point).

    In short it's the clone glitch but instead of swaping boxed pokemon with the party ones (like you would when cloning), you would swap places of 2 pokemon in the box. If you had the right timing when turning off the system, the result was one pokemon dissapearing from the box, whith the other "absorbing" his data like EVs, genes, moveset and the like. I used it to get stuff like shinny graveler with surf and sacred fire and the like.

    The joke was that the recipent pokemon also absorbed the donor's sprite. The fix was to do this on a pokemon that could evolve, as evolvining changed its sprite.

    Even then I assumed the donor was giving all his unique data to the recipent, while the recipent mantained it's species since it retained it's type(s), could still learn its regular lvl up moves, evolve normaly... but the sprite is the thing I can't wrap my head around. Why would the sprite be corrupted when clearly the pokemon species/ID/whatever is intact?

    Since all stats and stuff are recalculated when taken outside of the box, I'd assume storing individual sprites for each pokemon would be out of the quesion. I looked up on bulbapedia an it also says the sprite is linked to the species, and from a database design standpoint it's also the logical choice unless you plan on giving at least 2 pokemon of the same species 2 different sprites, like with event pokemon a la star-eared pichu. But there is no such thing in gen II as far as I know.

    What was happening?

    EDIT: Nvm, I learned from one of crystal_'s videos that the game actually stores the pokemon species in 2 different places at the same time; so probably I never tried with the daycare at all.
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2015
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  6. Crystal_

    Crystal_
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    It all has to do with timing. When you save the game, your active box data is written to the save memory, but not every single byte or chunk of data is saved in the same exact point of time. A span of a few miliseconds is probably what the game takes to save the whole state of a box. Probably, the array of species identifiers of the box Pokemon are first updated, and then, not immediately, the rest of the data is updated. It looks like you ended up with a Pokemon with its two species identifiers differing from each other, which can be fixed by leaving the mon in the daycare, or by evolving it if possible.
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  7. Xycc

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    I'm not 100% sure if this is the right place to post it, but here we go anyways: Since the last update there is a bug in GSC. The Attack-Stat rolls over at +2 on Marowak, even if you use 13 Attack IV. Also if you create a pokemon with a certain HP it gets resetted in Matches (to HP Dark (-> 15IV); which leds to the same trace). Here is a replay showing it: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen2ou-311729396

    Have a nice day and a happy new year!
  8. AJC

    AJC

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    has it been checked to see if these recently discovered and better defined gen 1 glitches exist in stadium 1 as well?
  9. Zowayix

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    Which ones specifically are you referring to? I believe the "Body Slam can't paralyze Normal-types" thing exists in Stadium, but the glitches involving stacking of paralysis/burn drops do not.
  10. Iris

    Iris

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  11. Marty

    Marty Always more to find
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    Both fixed next update! I didn't see this post until today, so yeah, there probably should be a bug report thread for Gen 4.
  12. Crystal_

    Crystal_
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    APRIL FOOLS!

    Another gamebreaking (and hilarious) RBY glitch!

    If the Bide sequence is interrupted (due to the Bide user fainting before unleashing energy), the next double-hit move used by the player who used Bide, will hit as many times as the least significant byte of the damage accumulated by Bide. Double-hit moves are Double Kick, Bonemerang, and Twineedle.

    Basically, the number of hits of a multi-hit move and the least significant byte of the Bide stored damage share the memory address. Double-hit moves assume that this address contains 2 when they're used, but while 2 is succesfully loaded after Bide energy is unleashed (as well as after the use of any double hit or variable-hit move), interrupting its sequence will leave the accumulated damage there. Variable-hit moves require a random number to be generated, which overwrites whatever value this address had, meaning that this glitch does not apply to these kind of moves. For more in-depth information, read the description of the video shown below.

    Some clarifications:
    - If the Pokemon not using Bide faints (e.g. due to Poison), or if any multi hit move is used by the player who used Bide, including 2-5 hit moves, the glitch is disrupted due to the accumulated damage being cleared.
    - The double strike move can't hit more than 255 times this way. If Bide accumulated 260 damage, it will hit 260 - 256 = 4 times. Obviously, the attack will stop when/if the target faints.
    - Breaking a Substitute doesn't let some of the move effects finish (see Explosion, Hyper Beam...). This also applies here, as in the event that Bide damage is unleashed and it breaks a substitute, it will count as if the sequence was interrupted instead.

    Last edited: Apr 2, 2016
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  13. Crestfall

    Crestfall levitate, levitate, levitate, levitate
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    How do you do it over and over on the most obscure things is beyond me. Interesting find.
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  14. Isa

    Isa CHINGUYA
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    is this an april fools joke or not i cant tell

    i hope it isnt because this is hilarious

    if you use double kick and hit a ghost type, does the counter still get set to 2? i assume as much but just making sure

    youre evil

    edit: solid 1k post
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2016
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  15. Nails

    Nails Nuke the Weebs
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  16. Crystal_

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    I actually didn't genuinely think about that so I didn't test it, but looking at the code it looks like the address won't be set to two in that case. The execution of a move being immune to the target is halted before the side effects occur, and the side effect of a double hit move includes setting the numhits address to 2.
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  17. Marty

    Marty Always more to find
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    Haha this actually works! I don't have an amazing setup for testing in Gen 1, but I managed to do it with Twineedle in a link battle. I first tried in a wild battle and it didn't work so I was confused, but then I read the video description which makes it clear it only works in link battles.

    I'm not even surprised it took this long to find since no one uses Bide seriously. Crystal_ never disappoints with the details!
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  18. Golden Gyarados

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    Can you clarify this a bit more? Does this essentially mean you cant hold the double-hit user in your back pocket all match - if ANY of your Pokemon faint in the interim between your Bide user fainting and your double-hit move getting play, it clears the value?

    This is fairly useful if you can keep it in your back pocket all match until you need it, but if there's essentially a time limit (ie, you have to activate it before any of your other Pokemon faint) where it's "use it or lose it" it gets much, much less valuable.
  19. Crystal_

    Crystal_
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    When a Pokemon faints, 2 is loaded into the other player's numhits/bide address. Whenever a player uses a double hit move, it will hit the amount of times indicated by its own address. In short, you can "keep it" until one of your opponent's Pokemon faints, unless you use a variable-hit move or Bide again before that.
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  20. Jellicent

    Jellicent
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    So if you do this, try not to Pin Missile with Jolt while you still have a super Double Kick...

    What happens if P2 pulls it off after P1? Would both have a crazy double-hit in the back pocket, or would P2's load 2 over P1's multi-hit address?
  21. Crystal_

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    Both will have the crazy double-hit as player and enemy addresses are independent. If one player uses the double hit move, the other player still keeps his own crazy double-hit in the pack. If one Pokemon faints, the other player's address becomes 2, disrupting that player's crazy double hit.
  22. xJoelituh

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    This is just hilarious, this made April Fools worth for me lol
  23. Not Troller

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  24. Slimmer

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    Ban Bide y/y
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  25. Isa

    Isa CHINGUYA
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    am i the only one excited for this, i think it'll be really interesting to see what comes out of this
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