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VGC Ask a Simple Question, Get a Simple Answer - Mark II

Discussion in 'VGC' started by Solace, Aug 11, 2012.

  1. Sidfrid

    Sidfrid

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    Sup guys!
    I've been wondering about make my self a new team and been trying out a few things (that really haven't worked as nice as I want). I have found myself using a word that I may don't fully understands: Synergy.

    So let me make a simple question with a complex answer: what is synergy? how do you achieve synergy? are there a middle point between defensive and offensive synergy (i'm reffering at the bulky offensive playstlyle that've been dominating VGC for a few years)?

    .....ok definitely not one question, but the answer may come while answering all those questions.

    (Is in times like this that I want VGC to have a np: thread)
  2. tlyee61

    tlyee61

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    Synergy to me is basically how well one Pokemon works with another. Common knowledge of this is having 2 Fire types on 1 team. Your team will obviously have a glaring weakness to Water, rock and ground. Picking Pokemon that work well together is an example of synergy. Virizion and Heatran are a great example of defensive synergy. They resist all of eachother's types. An example of offensive synergy is Latios and Heatran. Dragon and Fire have perfect neutral coverage on everything. Building a team with synergy is extremely beneficial so that you can switch and resist, even if it's not that common in VGC. I think there is a "balance" between offensive and defensive synergy. It's like Rotom-W or Latios paired with Metagross. Even though they have great offensive synergy, they resist eachother's weaknesses too. Hope you can understand this and that it helps! *might add more once I'm off my phone*
  3. callforjudgement

    callforjudgement

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    To me, synergy is "if I have these Pokémon out together, do they form more than the sum of their parts"? In the team I ran back in VGC'11 (to a top-8 at UK nationals), that was true of basically every pair in one way or another (with the exception of one mon, who I disliked using as a result). It could be something like a direct combo (fake out + setup move, surf + water absorb, or the like), or just simply offensive synergy (what sweeper A doesn't deal with, sweeper B can take out). Defensive synergy doesn't really exist so much in doubles, because you can't choose where the enemies aim their attacks and it's unlikely that you'll have two mons that both resist both the active enemies, although there's a sort of "support synergy" where support mon A prevents sweeper B from getting damaged (either by crippling the opponents, or directly with moves like Rage Powder). Resisting each other's weaknesses helps, but only on common spread moves, and only to make sure you don't both get hurt at the same time.
  4. TheMantyke

    TheMantyke ᴵ ᶰᵉᵉᵈ ᵃ ᵐᵒᶰˢᵗᵉʳ ᵗᵒ ᶜᶫᵒᵇᵇᵉʳ ᵗʰᵃᵗ ᵗʰᵉʳᵉ ᴷᶦʳᵇʸ
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnus
    VGC Leader

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    This really doesn't need three answers, but it couldn't hurt to elaborate more on a pretty critical aspect of team building.

    Synergy is how well your Pokemon work together. Each Pokemon plays off each others strengths and weaknesses. There are two main types of synergy: offensive synergy and defensive synergy. Pokemon have offensive synergy when, while together, they can hit most Pokemon for strong neutral or super-effective damage. Pokemon have defensive synergy when, while together, they don't share vulnerabilities to any one type and force the opponent to use single target attacks to deal with them.

    Achieving synergy is simple: Look at your Pokemon of choice, look at its weaknesses both in terms of type weaknesses and vulnerabilities to specific Pokemon, and look for a Pokemon that can deal with those weaknesses while your first Pokemon does so for it. A good example would be a core like Metagross and Rotom-W: Metagross can deal strong physical hits to Pokemon like Amoonguss that Rotom-W dislikes while Rotom-W can fry bulky waters for Metagross. Between the two of them, they share no weaknesses; infact, each of their weaknesses is a resistance or immunity for the other. Additionally, they're not very vulnerable to any particular spread moves.

    As for the middle ground, it's not too difficult to find Pokemon with great offensive or defensive synergy that happen to share okay synergy on the other side. Sticking Hitmontop with anything that appreciates Fighting-type coverage will usually make a nice core with good offensive and moderate defensive synergy. Some cores, particularly ones involving Steel-types like Metagross, Scizor, and Heatran, can have phenomenal synergy on both sides of the spectrum.

    Muffinhead has uploaded a series of tutorials on team building and the basics of VGC. In this particular video, he gives a pretty solid introduction to synergy and some decent examples. I'd recommend checking it out (and the rest of his videos too since muffinhead is amazing).

    [youtube]zjLrN5U_fvg[/youtube]
  5. hathater

    hathater

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    if i had two pokemon using super fang on the same pokemon, would it ko?
  6. Sidfrid

    Sidfrid

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    Super Fang only takes half the actual HP, so if both of your pokemons use Super fang on a single enemy, the opposing pokemon is left with 1/4th of it total HP.
  7. Fantom0

    Fantom0

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    Hey guys, I've been using pokecheck to test a few pokemon and I've been wondering: do pokemon from pokecheck show up as hacked on Nintendo's hack checks? I'm able to use them on GBU, battle videos etc. but they have a ribbon that they shouldn't have. On the site, they say they, 'discourage' using them in official tournaments, but in the case where I cannot obtain these pokemon otherwise, would they be fine?
  8. Chenkovsky

    Chenkovsky

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    When you upload them to this site they won't have the ribbon.
  9. Fantom0

    Fantom0

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    Thanks! That is really helpful!
  10. AngryHan

    AngryHan

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    I thought the Pokemon only get the ribbon if you download them from Pokecheck. I only use Pokecheck for its legality checker
  11. Pokemondothon

    Pokemondothon

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    Okay, so I'm kind of new to Double Battling (after having been a competitive Singles player for about 5 years now), and what got me into it was the March International Wi-Fi tournament... so after reading the 5th Gen Double Battle guide, I realized that the order in which Pokemon use their moves is decided before the turn begins; for example, things like Icy Wind, Bulldoze, and other attacks that modify Speed don't take effect until the next turn.

    Case in point, my question is this: if one or more Pokemon were to switch - causing certain Abilities to be activated - would that affect turn order?

    In a hypothetical situation: I have a Sawsbuck out, who would normally be outspeed by Terrakion. My partner is Sableye, and I switch to Ninetales for Sableye's turn, and have Sawsbuck use Horn Leech on Terrakion. Now, both players have confirmed their moves and the turn begins. Since the switch happens before the first Pokemon makes its move, would Ninetales' Drought cause Sawsbuck's Chlorophyll to kick in right away, allowing it to outspeed Terrakion on that turn?... or does my poor Sawsbuck get Close Combat'ed to death before it has a chance to move?


    Thanks!
  12. Baz Anderson

    Baz Anderson

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    No, in this case Sawsbuck would still be slower on that turn. You would need to Protect with Sawsbuck and wait for the next turn (the first turn selecting moves while the weather is in effect) for it to be faster.
  13. Pokemondothon

    Pokemondothon

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    Okay, I kinda thought so, but I wasn't completely sure... thank you very much!
  14. The Last Sheikah

    The Last Sheikah

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    It's worth saying though that speed changes are the only things that take until next turn to come into effect. So for example if your Sawsbuck used Solarbeam on the turn Ninetales switches in, it would get charged up straight away.
  15. hathater

    hathater

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    Does vgc have nickname clause? im having a strategy up my sleeve
  16. Sidfrid

    Sidfrid

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    in Random matchup and VGC tournamanents, the pokemons appaer with their default names. So yes there is a "nickname" clause.
  17. Anas2k7

    Anas2k7

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    you're not allowed to nickname a pokemon the name of another pokemon
  18. Golden Piloswine

    Golden Piloswine

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    He could mean he wants to do this.

    Pokemon: Hitmontop
    Nickname: Metagros

    Still that's not really good sportsmanship, but there is no rule saying you can't have the name close.
  19. hathater

    hathater

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    I meant I named two pokemon of the same name. Eg hitmontop=poo magikarp= poo
  20. Golden Piloswine

    Golden Piloswine

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    That's also against the rules. -_-
  21. Agonist

    Agonist You were my last great war, you were my heaven ablaze
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    Even if you did, any nicknames are changed to their default species name for the length of the battle.
  22. Aslan07

    Aslan07

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    How exactly would I go about building a VGC team?
  23. Golden Piloswine

    Golden Piloswine

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    Try to take pointers from some other good teams, and read how that team has synergy. Try some basic teams at first, then once your comfterable you can move on to implementing some of your own strategy and creative move sets. Good luck!
  24. tlyee61

    tlyee61

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    either try building a simple team (read: 252 / 252 spreads and something like ttar, meta, cress, hitmontop, thundurus etc. with thundy and cress knowing swagger and swagger boosting the rest of your team) or you could copy a well known team such as ray's worlds team, cybertron's team that he uses for every event, etc.
  25. Oyster

    Oyster

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    Is Gardevoir viable on a Trick Room team, or is it simply too fast?

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