firepon too please
firepon too please
But if Broken is checking Broken per this description, shouldn't that be more reason to vote ban on Volcarona who you already said you'd want to see go if not for checking Kyurem, which you also think is bad? Like if we're at a hypothetical deadlock of busted mons checking other busted mons, removing one would theoretically lead to a much stronger case for the ones they were checking in the subsequent meta (EX: If we remove Volc, Kyurem loses a common check and suddenly that 58% becomes a 70%).
Some people have this logic for checking mons that they think are extremely strong but not banworthy (like Kingambit as a Ghost check for Gholdengo and Dragapult), but if you think Volc and Kyurem are both unhealthy, it follows to remove Volc even if you think it's the less pressing of the two.
the post immediately before this: "hey lily gimme a list of bad ubers and we'll announce that we discussed them just to fuck with people lmao"
What would everyone’s thoughts be on a Hazards Clause? Wherein only a single unit, of a single hazard can be up at a time. So, a choice between Rocks, a layer of Spikes, a layer of Toxic Spikes, or Webs.
Defensive Pokemon are naturally punished more by hazards because of the flat HP cost, and especially in such a power crept metagame like SV.
You are constantly repositioning and addressing environmental changes like Speed Booster altering a game‘s Speed Tier, adapting to an unorthodox set, or really Tera but that is it’s own can of worms.
I've used meloetta, and meloetta-p isn't bad. Sure, it requires a turn to setup, but with the 20% chance to get a sleep proc, it can be threatening. Then you have a 128/128 monster that can cc so much of the tier. In that regard, its cc is better than zama. Going full physical or special on meleotta I think is a waste of time. However, going mixed is really good on it and allows it to decimate some teams.Its just a worse ZamaH/Physical Iron Valiant that has a useless moveslot and secondary typing that requires a turn to even exist.
I've used t-wave Gambit, so I'll talk about it.More Innovations & Concepts in SV OU
Note that a concept is something with promising feats on paper but not yet executed in a major ladder/tour game while innovations are proven to work.
Innovation
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Alomomola (Alomomola) @ Heavy-Duty Boots/Red Card
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 144 HP / 112 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Scald
- Flip Turn
- Wish
- Mirror Coat
Mirror Coat lures stuff like Darkrai, Hexpult, Kyurem, Enamorus, Deoxys, Moth, and Volcanion. Most of these matchup well vs Balance/Stall. The spread allows Mola to tank one Specs Freeze Dry from Kyurem which is fucking absurd.
252 SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Freeze-Dry vs. 144 HP / 252 SpD Alomomola: 428-506 (84.4 - 99.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
It also lets you Flip Turn on Prima clicking CM or Sub to get in Encore Grasspon for example. This does hinder Mola’s ability to check physical threats and also can’t scout with Protect, but it does improve Mola’s weaker matchups.
Edit: Mirror Coat doesn’t work on Darkrai because its a Psychic type move. My bad.
Innovation
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Clefable (Clefable) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Moonblast
- Knock Off/Stealth Rock/Thunder Wave
- Wish/Moonlight
- Protect/Knock Off/Stealth Rock/Thunder Wave/Ice Beam/Encore
SpD Clef is one of the best Kyurem checks on Balance. If you played early Gen 8 OU, you’d know this. Its avoids a 2HKO from Specs Ice Beam after Lefties.
252 SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Clefable: 169-201 (42.8 - 51%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
Boots (i.e the good Kyurem set) cannot even 3HKO Clef without Terastilizing.
252 SpA Kyurem Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Clefable: 114-135 (28.9 - 34.2%) -- 99.6% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
It also helps check other threats like Specs Pult, Deo-S, Mixed Val, AoA Darkrai, etc. Wishtect is preferable on this since you have more longevity vs Balance/Stall while its recovery doesn’t get nuked by Glowking’s Chilly Reception. Since its Clef, you can customize it to fill whatever other role. Knock, Rocks, T-Wave, etc. It performs worse as a Knock absorber, but that can be compensated with partners like Corv or Mola.
Innovation
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Darkrai (Darkrai) @ Heavy-Duty Boots/Focus Sash/Leftovers
Ability: Bad Dreams
Tera Type: Poison
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dark Pulse
- Sludge Bomb
- Ice Beam
- Will-O-Wisp
Huge fan of Wisp on Darkrai. The best check to it is Zama who gets destroyed by burn while Wisp also cripples most of the same targets as Focus Miss. Drifting made a really cool Balance rmt featuring Amoonguss and Wisp Rai you can check out. The set variety on it is huge. There’s a million ways to build Darkrai. I’ve even toyed with shit like Tera Steel Sub-CM Wisp to further fuck with Balance teams.
Innovation
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Garganacl (Garganacl) @ Leftovers
Ability: Purifying Salt
Tera Type: Water/Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Salt Cure
- Recover
- Protect
What this set lacks as a special wall, it gets as a fat asf physical wall. Garg does have 100/130 physical bulk after all. Without Tera, this eats an unboosted Tera Water Wogre Cudgel after rocks, allowing you to trade and get off a Salt Cure more easily.
252 Atk Wellspring Mask Tera Water Ogerpon-Wellspring-Tera Ivy Cudgel vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Garganacl: 296-352 (73.2 - 87.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
This set also improves your matchups with Moon, Gambit, Tusk, Gliscor, etc. Pre-Tera it doesn’t beat these outright, but it has an easier time landing a Salt Cure on them. With Tera it can 1v1 them, surviving even a +2 SO boosted Kowtow after rocks.
Concept
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Gliscor (Gliscor) @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
Tera Type: Water/Fairy/Grass/Steel
EVs: 244 HP / 36 SpD / 228 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Toxic
- Knock Off
- Protect
- Taunt
The first concept I’ll be showcasing. The idea with this set is it allows you to Knock or Toxic Fast Lando. Taunt shuts down Corv/Skarm and prevents Recovery or setup. This set might be a bit wack due to its worse bulk, but I believe Taunt should be explored more on Gliscor. It complements Gliscor’s gameplan of setting hazards, breaking down Balance with SD, or forcing progress with Knock + Toxic while stopping Clef/Skarm/Corv from clicking their recovery moves.
Innovation
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Iron Crown (Iron Crown) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Tachyon Cutter
- Future Sight/Psyshock/Psychic Noise
- Focus Blast
- Volt Switch
Fun set that lets you pick off kills on teams expecting the standard AV sets. Tera Steel nukes everything besides Blissey with a 3HKO or 2HKO.
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Clodsire: 224-268 (48.3 - 57.8%) -- approx. 94.5% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 244 HP / 252+ SpD Gliscor: 272-324 (77.2 - 92%) -- approx. 2HKO after Poison Heal
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Skeledirge: 136-162 (33 - 39.4%) -- approx. 99.9% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Vessel of Ruin Ting-Lu: 200-236 (38.9 - 45.9%) -- approx. 3HKO after 1 layer of Spikes and Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 240+ SpD Slowking-Galar: 216-256 (54.8 - 64.9%) -- approx. 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Kingambit: 180-212 (44.6 - 52.6%) -- approx. 82.4% chance to 2HKO after 1 layer of Spikes and Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 224 HP / 0 SpD Cinderace: 200-236 (56 - 66.1%) -- approx. 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 0 HP / 252 SpD Alomomola: 196-232 (41.6 - 49.2%) -- approx. 3HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Gholdengo: 170-202 (44.9 - 53.4%) -- approx. 31.3% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Volcarona: 150-178 (40.1 - 47.5%) -- approx. 3HKO
You could force Glowking to Tera Water, which opens up Raging Bolt, Primarina, or SD Valiant.
Outside of spamming Tachyon, Psychic Noise rips apart Corv, 2HKOs Volc, 2HKOs Mola, 1v1s Dirge, and acts as a turn 1 Taunt that only prevents healing moves. Psyshock 2HKOs Blissey and Glowking, forcing the former to Tera Dark. Volt Switch trucks Corv while letting it pivot. I find that it pairs incredibly well with other breakers like Primarina or cleaners like Bolt, Pult, or Volc.
Innovation
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Iron Treads (Iron Treads) @ Booster Energy/Focus Sash
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Rapid Spin
- Earthquake
- Endeavor
- Ice Spinner/Stealth Rock
Endeavor allows Treads to cripple something before dying. It good for avoiding being a sitting duck vs Balance or Stall.
Concept
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Kingambit (Kingambit) @ Black Glasses
Ability: Supreme Overlord
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 112 HP / 252 Atk / 144 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Kowtow Cleave
- Sucker Punch
- Thunder Wave
Gimmicky, but T-Wave can cripple checks like Samu, Corv, Dozo, and Zama. With support to lure or cripple Tusk like Future Sight, it might work, but I see no reason not to just run standard sets with Future Sight.
Innovation
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Landorus (Landorus-Therian) @ Leftovers/Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
Tera Type: Poison/Water
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Rock Tomb
- U-turn
Setsu posted a team from me on TotW featuring Thundy and also SpD Lando, with a spread built to outrun Modest Bolt and Volcanion. SpD Lando is a SS OU classic that has some merit in this meta while still checking physical threats thanks to Intimidate, but I decided to go full SpD. It avoids a 2HKO from Val Moonblast at full, avoid an OHKO from +1 Rbolt Pulse after rocks, lives Specs Pult’s Draco after rocks, and even Prima’s Surf after rocks. Rock Tomb is a nice midground for Moon while threatening an OHKO on Volc and removing Valiant’s speed boost. The big appeal with this set however is its ability to check the moths. Fiery Dance from Iron Moth is a 4HKO with max SpD, and Lando threatens with either EQ or Rock Tomb while surviving the second Fiery Dance after a boost. As for Volc, EQ does huge damage to offensive sets or threatens an OHKO with Rock Tomb. EQ also 2HKOs Bulkarona while avoiding a 2HKO from +1 Fiery Dance after rocks. Tera Water makes it a more consistent check. The only sets it doesn’t beat are Tera Grass and Wisp Volc which can be handled by its teammates. I still think Volc is broken, but SpD Lando is one way to deal with it.
Concept
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Ogerpon (Ogerpon) (F) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Defiant
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 132 Atk / 120 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Ivy Cudgel
- Knock Off
- Encore/Spikes
- U-turn
The EV spread outspeeds Kyurem while 132+ Atk is the same as max Atk Jolly. The 120 Dfse EVs allows Grasspon to tank any hit from +5 SO Gambit at full besides Black Glasses or Tera Dark, making it Gambit endgame easier with Encore.
252+ Atk Supreme Overlord 5 allies fainted Kingambit Kowtow Cleave vs. 0 HP / 120 Def Ogerpon: 237-279 (78.7 - 92.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
This spread also lives any hit from Wogre after a Swords Dance.
+2 252 Atk Wellspring Mask Tera Water Ogerpon-Wellspring-Tera Ivy Cudgel vs. 0 HP / 120 Def Ogerpon: 249-294 (82.7 - 97.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Spikes is a cute option with Ghold to block Corv Defog. I am interested in seeing how this set will do in practice.
Innovation
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Raging Bolt (Raging Bolt) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Thunderclap
- Volt Switch
- Dragon Pulse
- Draco Meteor
Specs Bolt is cool. Turning it from a cleaner to a breaker. This set was used on a team hand crafted by vkhss and Fusien that’s also a sample. Draco becomes an absolute nuke. OHKOs Lando, Tusk, and Gliscor. It even 2HKOs Clod and Glowking. Only Ting-Lu and Blissey survive a 2HKO, but the former is easy to wear down while the latter is exclusive to Stall. It might be prediction reliant vs Fairy + Ground cores, especially if Glowking or Tect spam is involved, but they could be played around.
Innovation
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Rillaboom (Rillaboom) @ Life Orb/Lum Berry
Ability: Grassy Surge
Tera Type: Grass/Fire
EVs: 72 HP / 252 Atk / 184 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Grassy Glide
- Knock Off/Tera Blast
- Drain Punch/Wood Hammer/High Horsepower
Rillaboom is one of my favorite mons rn and I’ll make a post about it in the future. It provides amazing speed control, and makes progress with Knock, U-Turn, and Wood Hammer while providing the team with passive recovery. SD Rilla is gas. +2 LO Glide with Tera has a shot at OHKOing offensive Cinder and Pult. Tera Grass LO Wood Hammer + Glide also outright wins vs Ironpress Zama as it switches in which is kinda cracked.
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Tera Grass Rillaboom Wood Hammer vs. +3 84 HP / 252 Def Zamazenta in Grassy Terrain: 273-322 (78.9 - 93%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO after 1 layer of Spikes
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Tera Grass Rillaboom Grassy Glide vs. +3 84 HP / 252 Def Zamazenta in Grassy Terrain: 127-151 (36.7 - 43.6%) -- 99.5% chance to 3HKO after 1 layer of Spikes, Leftovers recovery, and Grassy Terrain recovery
Tera Fire Blast is an option to nuke Corv who’s often the only Rilla check on Balance while also avoiding burns and flipping the Kyu/Weav/Volc matchup. Considering you hit every Ground and Water type with your busted Grass STAB, this is a good trade off. If Heatran is annoying you, you could tech Drain Punch or High Horsepower. Lum Berry also beats Pult leads and lets you setup SD on Gliscor.
Innovation
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Samurott (Samurott-Hisui) @ Lum Berry
Ability: Sharpness
Tera Type: Water/Dark/Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Ceaseless Edge
- Razor Shell
- Swords Dance
- Encore/Sucker Punch/Aqua Jet
I fell in love with SD Samu recently which is great at setting Spikes and keeping them up. It directly beats Tusk since most of them these days are dropping CC for other options like Knock, Bulk Up, Rocks, etc.
View attachment 623901
Lum is particularly brutal vs Balance. Lets you get off Spikes or an SD in front of Mola without worrying about a burn. It also punishes assholes like Gliscor who love to randomly stay in on Samu and click Toxic or punish Wisp from Pult, Dirge, Cinder. Encore is broken on this and also Wogre. It punishes Dozo from clicking Curse or Rest and punishes Skarm/Corv for clicking ID or Roost. Also its Gambit insurane.
Alternatively, Aqua Jet or Sucker can be run to pick off faster threats like Darkrai, Valiant, Pult, Wogre, Weavile and Kyurem. Aqua Jet also prevents Cinderace from removing your hardwork with Court Change. You could pick any one of these Teras. Tera Water to one-shot Clef after an SD and eliminate your BP weakness, Tera Dark to guarantee a 2HKO on Mola and allow +2 Sucker to OHKO Wogre and Rilla after rocks. Tera Ghost lets it spinblock while Encoring Zama and Corv.
Wogre is the better offensive Water, but Samu is better at breaking Balance/Stall. Fat teams are teching Tera Grass, Sinistcha, or Amoonguss to handle Wogre. There’s no Tera to handle Samu Water/Dark STAB has no resists besides Prim who eats big damage from Spikes, frail ahh Meow who only switches in once, and Wo-Chien who’s Stall exclusive. Plus Samu can tech items like Boots to negate hazard damage or Lum for status. Samu enables other threats like Rilla, Zama, and Gambit on BO.
Innovation
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Serperior (Serperior) @ Custap Berry
Ability: Contrary
Tera Type: Fire/Steel
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Knock Off
- Glare
- Endure
Serperiorr shared this cool set. The original team and Dpulse on Serp, but I prefer Knock to remove Boots from Blissey or Glowking. Custap + Endure allows Serp to trade 1-to-1 with offense for a Glare or cheeky kill. This is similar to how Thundy-I plays, with less offensive oomph but with the ability to para everything that isn’t Ghold, Garg, or Gliscor.
Concept
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Scizor (Scizor) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Technician
Tera Type: Water/Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 156 Atk / 100 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Bullet Punch
- Knock Off
- Tera Blast/Close Combat/Dual Wingbeat
- U-turn
I mentioned this set before. In a nutshell, it allows BO builds to pivot around Fairies, Ghold, Darkrai, Kyurem, Prima, and Ghold while providing utility with priority, Knock, and U-Turn. Tera Water is an option to flip the matchup with Fire types and bulky Grounds while letting it 2HKO them with Tera Blast. Pretty neat if your gameplan revolves around eliminating/luring them. Tera Steel jacks up Bullet Punch. Close Combat smacks Gambit and Heatran. Dual Wingbeat with Technician is a base 120 Flying move that 2HKOs Tusk and the rare Amoonguss. I and I am considering just going max Attack Adamant.
Innovation
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Tyranitar (Tyranitar) @ Choice Band
Ability: Sand Stream
Tera Type: Rock
EVs: 8 HP / 252 Atk / 248 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Stone Edge
- Ice Punch
- Earthquake/Low Kick
First of all, I’m not a believer in Sand. I’d rather use Ttar for its wallbreaking potential than to run it with Drill. Adamant CB Ttar boasts the strongest Knock Off in OU, only eclipsed by CB Moon under Sun.
252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Corviknight: 186-220 (46.5 - 55%) -- 66.8% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Protosynthesis Roaring Moon Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Corviknight: 226-267 (56.5 - 66.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
I think there is no better time for CB Ttar to find its footing rn. Balance is one of the best styles rn and Ttar can still break them. Slow pivots like Mola and Glowking can easily bring it in. Plus the Sand chip helps further with chipping down non-Ground/Rock/Steel types, especially Zama who hates eating Knock + Sand chip. The classic combo Future Sight + CB Tar also punishes Gliscor without needing to predict with Ice Punch. Tera Rock Stone Edge 2HKOs Mola/Dozo, no hazards needed.
252+ Atk Choice Band Tera Rock Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Dondozo: 240-284 (47.6 - 56.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage
252+ Atk Choice Band Tera Rock Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Alomomola: 306-360 (57.3 - 67.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage
Ttar’s 61 Speed tier comes in clutch with outpacing Primarina and Gambit, which is important as it threatens a KO on both.
252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Primarina: 352-415 (109.6 - 129.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Low Kick (100 BP) vs. 212 HP / 0 Def Kingambit: 628-740 (159.3 - 187.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Imo this pairs well with Gambit despite the stacked weaknesses since it cripples many of Gambit’s checks. The Fighting and Ground weaknesses can be circumvented with any solid Ground immune or Fairy like Enamorus who’s also a Ground immune.
Concept
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Volcarona (Volcarona) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Flame Body
Tera Type: Water/Steel/Ground
EVs: 160 HP / 196 Def / 152 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Quiver Dance
- Fiery Dance
- Whirlwind
- Morning Sun
Idk if it was me or Tio Chico who came up with this, but this set takes a page out of Roar Zama’s book by potentially letting you beat opposing CM sweepers besides Hatt and Volc while racking up Spikes damage. Whirlwind also prevents Dnite from 1v1ing you and beats Ting-Lu. I’m being looking to test it, but I’ve been having trouble fitting it plus Spikes. The lack of coverage hurts as well.
What would everyone’s thoughts be on a Hazards Clause? Wherein only a single unit, of a single hazard can be up at a time. So, a choice between Rocks, a layer of Spikes, a layer of Toxic Spikes, or Webs. This would be implemented within the team builder, so outright preventing a team from running different Hazard setting moves, but allow multiple copies of, in this instance, Spikes for team members to use. In that example, Glimmorra would have to run Corrosion if the team already had Spikes, Stealth Rocks, or Webs. Same for Ceaseless Edge and Stone Axe, okay if the team already is running Spikes or Rocks respectively, restricted otherwise if not.
I’d argue that the hazards metagame isn’t so much unbalanced or uncompetitive, as it is unhealthy. Defensive Pokemon are naturally punished more by hazards because of the flat HP cost, and especially in such a power crept metagame like SV. You are constantly repositioning and addressing environmental changes like Speed Booster altering a game‘s Speed Tier, adapting to an unorthodox set, or really Tera but that is it’s own can of worms. We have spoken before at the ease of setting Hazards, and the subsequent difficulty in, not so much removing the Hazards themselves, but finding a solid core that can consistently address whatever Hazard setter, in whatever team composition, etc. Moving into DLC2, we aren‘t as hard pressed to deny hazard setting with Lando-T Taunt, or just outright obliterating whatever is right in front of you thanks to even more power creep.
Hazards aren’t less potent or fundamental to the average SV game despite this however. I argue most teams are exaggerated, either using pivots that do not care or Regen (or both), or creating team compositions that rely less on positioning and more on sheer brute force a la Arch Rain, Kyruem, whatever else we find honestly.
it's important to note that some playstyles require a more aggressive approach to hazard control than the guide makes note of. weather teams, for example, tend to hinge on a mon that's weak to rocks (atales, torkoal, or pelipper) getting multiple switch-ins over the course of a game while not holding boots, and often employ breakers that also don't use boots. i personally get around this by stacking hazard control—for example, on a sun team you might see me running both tusk and hatterene and putting rapid spin on the torkoal for good measureI recommend reading this guide on dealing with Spikes.
Not only is this clause a bad idea, but also unnecessary. Removing hazards is not hard and playing around them ain’t either. If you let them get 3 Spikes up, that’s a teambuilding or skill issue. Tusk is incredibly consistent at spinning. Cinder shuts down offensive hazard stack while Hatt shits on many bulky hazard stacking builds. Corv is another option. Even in the Ghold matchup, you U-Turn and punish them with a switch to Darkrai, Hoopa-U, or Samu, especially if its Ghold Balance. Some of the good teams you see don’t even run hazard removal or spam Boots. Its a matter of not playing passively so they have less chances of actually getting hazards up.
Hazards are important from stopping monsters like Wogre or Specs Kyurem from getting free switch ins.
My man, you can‘t just assume someone doesn’t understand or is incapable of recognizing solutions to a problem, that is absurdly patronizing. I know people go to the forums and parrot rhetoric because they didn’t understand something on the ladder, you can’t always assume that.I recommend reading this guide on dealing with Spikes.
Not only is this clause a bad idea, but also unnecessary. Removing hazards is not hard and playing around them ain’t either. If you let them get 3 Spikes up, that’s a teambuilding or skill issue. Tusk is incredibly consistent at spinning. Cinder shuts down offensive hazard stack while Hatt shits on many bulky hazard stacking builds. Corv is another option. Even in the Ghold matchup, you U-Turn and punish them with a switch to Darkrai, Hoopa-U, or Samu, especially if its Ghold Balance. Some of the good teams you see don’t even run hazard removal or spam Boots. Its a matter of not playing passively so they have less chances of actually getting hazards up.
Hazards are important from stopping monsters like Wogre or Specs Kyurem from getting free switch ins.
Thank you for the non-post. I specifically stated that because I am potentially wrong, and would like to be challenged and have my perspective changed. Even if it’s patiently false through discussion, at least it leads to constructive and efficacious output.my criticism is that you're incredibly brave to come out here with a proposal like this and announce you're accepting "any criticism"
He gave you a good response and listed reasons why a hazard clause would not be a good idea.My man, you can‘t just assume someone doesn’t understand or is incapable of recognizing solutions to a problem, that is absurdly patronizing. I know people go to the forums and parrot rhetoric because they didn’t understand something on the ladder, you can’t always assume that.
I am speaking from the perspective from alleviating strain on defensive backbones. The metagame is extremely centralized and not exactly in a pleasant place for creative or interesting defensive innovations. I pointed out in my post the inherent flat HP cost with Hazards, there’s an argument that lowering by restricting Hazards allows for more longevity, explicitly with forgoing Boots for Leftovers if deemed necessary. Moreover, if the main way of addressing threats like Gouging Fire and Waterpon is obstructing their progress via hazards, then aren’t the Pokemon themselves an issue? If anything, aren’t they reinforcing because they encourage using hazards to address them?
That’s my point, it feels like Hazards are a catch-all solution that ends up constricting the meta and encouraging these exaggerated, explosive playstyles that are exhausting the player base. If I am wrong, please confront that rather than giving me a guide.
saying you're taking any criticism instead of just constructive criticism is the internet equivalent of taping a "kick me" sign to your own backThank you for the non-post. I specifically stated that because I am potentially wrong, and would like to be challenged and have my perspective changed. Even if it’s patiently false through discussion, at least it leads to constructive and efficacious output.
Not thanks for being brave???? why post????
A hazards clause would be a massive violation of tiering policy (unless you ban all hazards, in which case why). It's an even bigger violation of cart accuracy, and you don't even have some archaic side Pokemon game to justify its existence. Sleep Clause was finally axed, and hazards aren't that big of an issue in the tier right now. If it does rise to be an issue, we can examine its setters (Gliscor in DLC 1) or their enablers (Gholdengo since... forever), but a blanket hazards clause is never going to be implemented no matter the state of the metagame.What would everyone’s thoughts be on a Hazards Clause? Wherein only a single unit, of a single hazard can be up at a time. So, a choice between Rocks, a layer of Spikes, a layer of Toxic Spikes, or Webs. This would be implemented within the team builder, so outright preventing a team from running different Hazard setting moves, but allow multiple copies of, in this instance, Spikes for team members to use. In that example, Glimmorra would have to run Corrosion if the team already had Spikes, Stealth Rocks, or Webs. Same for Ceaseless Edge and Stone Axe, okay if the team already is running Spikes or Rocks respectively, restricted otherwise if not.
I’d argue that the hazards metagame isn’t so much unbalanced or uncompetitive, as it is unhealthy. Defensive Pokemon are naturally punished more by hazards because of the flat HP cost, and especially in such a power crept metagame like SV. You are constantly repositioning and addressing environmental changes like Speed Booster altering a game‘s Speed Tier, adapting to an unorthodox set, or really Tera but that is it’s own can of worms. We have spoken before at the ease of setting Hazards, and the subsequent difficulty in, not so much removing the Hazards themselves, but finding a solid core that can consistently address whatever Hazard setter, in whatever team composition, etc. Moving into DLC2, we aren‘t as hard pressed to deny hazard setting with Lando-T Taunt, or just outright obliterating whatever is right in front of you thanks to even more power creep.
Hazards aren’t less potent or fundamental to the average SV game despite this however. I argue most teams are exaggerated, either using pivots that do not care or Regen (or both), or creating team compositions that rely less on positioning and more on sheer brute force a la Arch Rain, Kyruem, whatever else we find honestly.
Interested in people’s thoughts and would appreciate any criticism. I think dropping Ubers is better as a last resort, and I felt that looking towards more fundamental aspects of the metagame and engaging with them would lead to more constructive conversation.
Gee, hazards sure have been suddenly constraining and powerful in gen 9 out of the blue. If only there was a reliable way to remove them...That’s my point, it feels like Hazards are a catch-all solution that ends up constricting the meta and encouraging these exaggerated, explosive playstyles that are exhausting the player base. If I am wrong, please confront that rather than giving me a guide.
My man, you can‘t just assume someone doesn’t understand or is incapable of recognizing solutions to a problem, that is absurdly patronizing. I know people go to the forums and parrot rhetoric because they didn’t understand something on the ladder, you can’t always assume that.
I am speaking from the perspective from alleviating strain on defensive backbones. The metagame is extremely centralized and not exactly in a pleasant place for creative or interesting defensive innovations. I pointed out in my post the inherent flat HP cost with Hazards, there’s an argument that lowering by restricting Hazards allows for more longevity, explicitly with forgoing Boots for Leftovers if deemed necessary. Moreover, if the main way of addressing threats like Gouging Fire and Waterpon is obstructing their progress via hazards, then aren’t the Pokemon themselves an issue? If anything, aren’t they reinforcing because they encourage using hazards to address them?
That’s my point, it feels like Hazards are a catch-all solution that ends up constricting the meta and encouraging these exaggerated, explosive playstyles that are exhausting the player base. If I am wrong, please confront that rather than giving me a guide.
I don't want this to come off as creepy or anything but in the absence of Morkal, need my intake of creativity once in a while. "Forgive me Father, for I have sinned." I am a fiend for this shit bro that's why I'm still in this forum. Also, you got a history of posts like this every so often so I ask you:More Innovations & Concepts in SV OU
Note that a concept is something with promising feats on paper but not yet executed in a major ladder/tour game while innovations are proven to work.
Innovation
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Alomomola (Alomomola) @ Heavy-Duty Boots/Red Card
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 144 HP / 112 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Scald
- Flip Turn
- Wish
- Mirror Coat
Mirror Coat lures stuff like Darkrai, Hexpult, Kyurem, Enamorus, Deoxys, Moth, and Volcanion. Most of these matchup well vs Balance/Stall. The spread allows Mola to tank one Specs Freeze Dry from Kyurem which is fucking absurd.
252 SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Freeze-Dry vs. 144 HP / 252 SpD Alomomola: 428-506 (84.4 - 99.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
It also lets you Flip Turn on Prima clicking CM or Sub to get in Encore Grasspon for example. This does hinder Mola’s ability to check physical threats and also can’t scout with Protect, but it does improve Mola’s weaker matchups.
Edit: Mirror Coat doesn’t work on Darkrai because its a Psychic type move. My bad.
Innovation
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Clefable (Clefable) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Moonblast
- Knock Off/Stealth Rock/Thunder Wave
- Wish/Moonlight
- Protect/Knock Off/Stealth Rock/Thunder Wave/Ice Beam/Encore
SpD Clef is one of the best Kyurem checks on Balance. If you played early Gen 8 OU, you’d know this. Its avoids a 2HKO from Specs Ice Beam after Lefties.
252 SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Clefable: 169-201 (42.8 - 51%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
Boots (i.e the good Kyurem set) cannot even 3HKO Clef without Terastilizing.
252 SpA Kyurem Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Clefable: 114-135 (28.9 - 34.2%) -- 99.6% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
It also helps check other threats like Specs Pult, Deo-S, Mixed Val, AoA Darkrai, etc. Wishtect is preferable on this since you have more longevity vs Balance/Stall while its recovery doesn’t get nuked by Glowking’s Chilly Reception. Since its Clef, you can customize it to fill whatever other role. Knock, Rocks, T-Wave, etc. It performs worse as a Knock absorber, but that can be compensated with partners like Corv or Mola.
Innovation
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Darkrai (Darkrai) @ Heavy-Duty Boots/Focus Sash/Leftovers
Ability: Bad Dreams
Tera Type: Poison
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dark Pulse
- Sludge Bomb
- Ice Beam
- Will-O-Wisp
Huge fan of Wisp on Darkrai. The best check to it is Zama who gets destroyed by burn while Wisp also cripples most of the same targets as Focus Miss. Drifting made a really cool Balance rmt featuring Amoonguss and Wisp Rai you can check out. The set variety on it is huge. There’s a million ways to build Darkrai. I’ve even toyed with shit like Tera Steel Sub-CM Wisp to further fuck with Balance teams.
Innovation
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Garganacl (Garganacl) @ Leftovers
Ability: Purifying Salt
Tera Type: Water/Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Salt Cure
- Recover
- Protect
What this set lacks as a special wall, it gets as a fat asf physical wall. Garg does have 100/130 physical bulk after all. Without Tera, this eats an unboosted Tera Water Wogre Cudgel after rocks, allowing you to trade and get off a Salt Cure more easily.
252 Atk Wellspring Mask Tera Water Ogerpon-Wellspring-Tera Ivy Cudgel vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Garganacl: 296-352 (73.2 - 87.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
This set also improves your matchups with Moon, Gambit, Tusk, Gliscor, etc. Pre-Tera it doesn’t beat these outright, but it has an easier time landing a Salt Cure on them. With Tera it can 1v1 them, surviving even a +2 SO boosted Kowtow after rocks.
Concept
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Gliscor (Gliscor) @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
Tera Type: Water/Fairy/Grass/Steel
EVs: 244 HP / 36 SpD / 228 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Toxic
- Knock Off
- Protect
- Taunt
The first concept I’ll be showcasing. The idea with this set is it allows you to Knock or Toxic Fast Lando. Taunt shuts down Corv/Skarm and prevents Recovery or setup. This set might be a bit wack due to its worse bulk, but I believe Taunt should be explored more on Gliscor. It complements Gliscor’s gameplan of setting hazards, breaking down Balance with SD, or forcing progress with Knock + Toxic while stopping Clef/Skarm/Corv from clicking their recovery moves.
Innovation
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Iron Crown (Iron Crown) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Tachyon Cutter
- Future Sight/Psyshock/Psychic Noise
- Focus Blast
- Volt Switch
Fun set that lets you pick off kills on teams expecting the standard AV sets. Tera Steel nukes everything besides Blissey with a 3HKO or 2HKO.
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Clodsire: 224-268 (48.3 - 57.8%) -- approx. 94.5% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 244 HP / 252+ SpD Gliscor: 272-324 (77.2 - 92%) -- approx. 2HKO after Poison Heal
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Skeledirge: 136-162 (33 - 39.4%) -- approx. 99.9% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Vessel of Ruin Ting-Lu: 200-236 (38.9 - 45.9%) -- approx. 3HKO after 1 layer of Spikes and Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 240+ SpD Slowking-Galar: 216-256 (54.8 - 64.9%) -- approx. 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Kingambit: 180-212 (44.6 - 52.6%) -- approx. 82.4% chance to 2HKO after 1 layer of Spikes and Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 224 HP / 0 SpD Cinderace: 200-236 (56 - 66.1%) -- approx. 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 0 HP / 252 SpD Alomomola: 196-232 (41.6 - 49.2%) -- approx. 3HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Gholdengo: 170-202 (44.9 - 53.4%) -- approx. 31.3% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Tera Steel Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Volcarona: 150-178 (40.1 - 47.5%) -- approx. 3HKO
You could force Glowking to Tera Water, which opens up Raging Bolt, Primarina, or SD Valiant.
Outside of spamming Tachyon, Psychic Noise rips apart Corv, 2HKOs Volc, 2HKOs Mola, 1v1s Dirge, and acts as a turn 1 Taunt that only prevents healing moves. Psyshock 2HKOs Blissey and Glowking, forcing the former to Tera Dark. Volt Switch trucks Corv while letting it pivot. I find that it pairs incredibly well with other breakers like Primarina or cleaners like Bolt, Pult, or Volc.
Innovation
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Iron Treads (Iron Treads) @ Booster Energy/Focus Sash
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Rapid Spin
- Earthquake
- Endeavor
- Ice Spinner/Stealth Rock
Endeavor allows Treads to cripple something before dying. It good for avoiding being a sitting duck vs Balance or Stall.
Concept
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Kingambit (Kingambit) @ Black Glasses
Ability: Supreme Overlord
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 112 HP / 252 Atk / 144 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Kowtow Cleave
- Sucker Punch
- Thunder Wave
Gimmicky, but T-Wave can cripple checks like Samu, Corv, Dozo, and Zama. With support to lure or cripple Tusk like Future Sight, it might work, but I see no reason not to just run standard sets with Future Sight.
Innovation
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Landorus (Landorus-Therian) @ Leftovers/Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
Tera Type: Poison/Water
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Rock Tomb
- U-turn
Setsu posted a team from me on TotW featuring Thundy and also SpD Lando, with a spread built to outrun Modest Bolt and Volcanion. SpD Lando is a SS OU classic that has some merit in this meta while still checking physical threats thanks to Intimidate, but I decided to go full SpD. It avoids a 2HKO from Val Moonblast at full, avoid an OHKO from +1 Rbolt Pulse after rocks, lives Specs Pult’s Draco after rocks, and even Prima’s Surf after rocks. Rock Tomb is a nice midground for Moon while threatening an OHKO on Volc and removing Valiant’s speed boost. The big appeal with this set however is its ability to check the moths. Fiery Dance from Iron Moth is a 4HKO with max SpD, and Lando threatens with either EQ or Rock Tomb while surviving the second Fiery Dance after a boost. As for Volc, EQ does huge damage to offensive sets or threatens an OHKO with Rock Tomb. EQ also 2HKOs Bulkarona while avoiding a 2HKO from +1 Fiery Dance after rocks. Tera Water makes it a more consistent check. The only sets it doesn’t beat are Tera Grass and Wisp Volc which can be handled by its teammates. I still think Volc is broken, but SpD Lando is one way to deal with it.
Concept
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Ogerpon (Ogerpon) (F) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Defiant
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 132 Atk / 120 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Ivy Cudgel
- Knock Off
- Encore/Spikes
- U-turn
The EV spread outspeeds Kyurem while 132+ Atk is the same as max Atk Jolly. The 120 Dfse EVs allows Grasspon to tank any hit from +5 SO Gambit at full besides Black Glasses or Tera Dark, making it Gambit endgame easier with Encore.
252+ Atk Supreme Overlord 5 allies fainted Kingambit Kowtow Cleave vs. 0 HP / 120 Def Ogerpon: 237-279 (78.7 - 92.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
This spread also lives any hit from Wogre after a Swords Dance.
+2 252 Atk Wellspring Mask Tera Water Ogerpon-Wellspring-Tera Ivy Cudgel vs. 0 HP / 120 Def Ogerpon: 249-294 (82.7 - 97.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Spikes is a cute option with Ghold to block Corv Defog. I am interested in seeing how this set will do in practice.
Innovation
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Raging Bolt (Raging Bolt) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Thunderclap
- Volt Switch
- Dragon Pulse
- Draco Meteor
Specs Bolt is cool. Turning it from a cleaner to a breaker. This set was used on a team hand crafted by vkhss and Fusien that’s also a sample. Draco becomes an absolute nuke. OHKOs Lando, Tusk, and Gliscor. It even 2HKOs Clod and Glowking. Only Ting-Lu and Blissey survive a 2HKO, but the former is easy to wear down while the latter is exclusive to Stall. It might be prediction reliant vs Fairy + Ground cores, especially if Glowking or Tect spam is involved, but they could be played around.
Innovation
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Rillaboom (Rillaboom) @ Life Orb/Lum Berry
Ability: Grassy Surge
Tera Type: Grass/Fire
EVs: 72 HP / 252 Atk / 184 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Grassy Glide
- Knock Off/Tera Blast
- Drain Punch/Wood Hammer/High Horsepower
Rillaboom is one of my favorite mons rn and I’ll make a post about it in the future. It provides amazing speed control, and makes progress with Knock, U-Turn, and Wood Hammer while providing the team with passive recovery. SD Rilla is gas. +2 LO Glide with Tera has a shot at OHKOing offensive Cinder and Pult. Tera Grass LO Wood Hammer + Glide also outright wins vs Ironpress Zama as it switches in which is kinda cracked.
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Tera Grass Rillaboom Wood Hammer vs. +3 84 HP / 252 Def Zamazenta in Grassy Terrain: 273-322 (78.9 - 93%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO after 1 layer of Spikes
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Tera Grass Rillaboom Grassy Glide vs. +3 84 HP / 252 Def Zamazenta in Grassy Terrain: 127-151 (36.7 - 43.6%) -- 99.5% chance to 3HKO after 1 layer of Spikes, Leftovers recovery, and Grassy Terrain recovery
Tera Fire Blast is an option to nuke Corv who’s often the only Rilla check on Balance while also avoiding burns and flipping the Kyu/Weav/Volc matchup. Considering you hit every Ground and Water type with your busted Grass STAB, this is a good trade off. If Heatran is annoying you, you could tech Drain Punch or High Horsepower. Lum Berry also beats Pult leads and lets you setup SD on Gliscor.
Innovation
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Samurott (Samurott-Hisui) @ Lum Berry
Ability: Sharpness
Tera Type: Water/Dark/Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Ceaseless Edge
- Razor Shell
- Swords Dance
- Encore/Sucker Punch/Aqua Jet
I fell in love with SD Samu recently which is great at setting Spikes and keeping them up. It directly beats Tusk since most of them these days are dropping CC for other options like Knock, Bulk Up, Rocks, etc.
View attachment 623901
Lum is particularly brutal vs Balance. Lets you get off Spikes or an SD in front of Mola without worrying about a burn. It also punishes assholes like Gliscor who love to randomly stay in on Samu and click Toxic or punish Wisp from Pult, Dirge, Cinder. Encore is broken on this and also Wogre. It punishes Dozo from clicking Curse or Rest and punishes Skarm/Corv for clicking ID or Roost. Also its Gambit insurane.
Alternatively, Aqua Jet or Sucker can be run to pick off faster threats like Darkrai, Valiant, Pult, Wogre, Weavile and Kyurem. Aqua Jet also prevents Cinderace from removing your hardwork with Court Change. You could pick any one of these Teras. Tera Water to one-shot Clef after an SD and eliminate your BP weakness, Tera Dark to guarantee a 2HKO on Mola and allow +2 Sucker to OHKO Wogre and Rilla after rocks. Tera Ghost lets it spinblock while Encoring Zama and Corv.
Wogre is the better offensive Water, but Samu is better at breaking Balance/Stall. Fat teams are teching Tera Grass, Sinistcha, or Amoonguss to handle Wogre. There’s no Tera to handle Samu Water/Dark STAB has no resists besides Prim who eats big damage from Spikes, frail ahh Meow who only switches in once, and Wo-Chien who’s Stall exclusive. Plus Samu can tech items like Boots to negate hazard damage or Lum for status. Samu enables other threats like Rilla, Zama, and Gambit on BO.
Innovation
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Serperior (Serperior) @ Custap Berry
Ability: Contrary
Tera Type: Fire/Steel
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Knock Off
- Glare
- Endure
Serperiorr shared this cool set. The original team and Dpulse on Serp, but I prefer Knock to remove Boots from Blissey or Glowking. Custap + Endure allows Serp to trade 1-to-1 with offense for a Glare or cheeky kill. This is similar to how Thundy-I plays, with less offensive oomph but with the ability to para everything that isn’t Ghold, Garg, or Gliscor.
Concept
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Scizor (Scizor) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Technician
Tera Type: Water/Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 156 Atk / 100 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Bullet Punch
- Knock Off
- Tera Blast/Close Combat/Dual Wingbeat
- U-turn
I mentioned this set before. In a nutshell, it allows BO builds to pivot around Fairies, Ghold, Darkrai, Kyurem, Prima, and Ghold while providing utility with priority, Knock, and U-Turn. Tera Water is an option to flip the matchup with Fire types and bulky Grounds while letting it 2HKO them with Tera Blast. Pretty neat if your gameplan revolves around eliminating/luring them. Tera Steel jacks up Bullet Punch. Close Combat smacks Gambit and Heatran. Dual Wingbeat with Technician is a base 120 Flying move that 2HKOs Tusk and the rare Amoonguss. I and I am considering just going max Attack Adamant.
Innovation
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Tyranitar (Tyranitar) @ Choice Band
Ability: Sand Stream
Tera Type: Rock
EVs: 8 HP / 252 Atk / 248 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Stone Edge
- Ice Punch
- Earthquake/Low Kick
First of all, I’m not a believer in Sand. I’d rather use Ttar for its wallbreaking potential than to run it with Drill. Adamant CB Ttar boasts the strongest Knock Off in OU, only eclipsed by CB Moon under Sun.
252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Corviknight: 186-220 (46.5 - 55%) -- 66.8% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Protosynthesis Roaring Moon Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Corviknight: 226-267 (56.5 - 66.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
I think there is no better time for CB Ttar to find its footing rn. Balance is one of the best styles rn and Ttar can still break them. Slow pivots like Mola and Glowking can easily bring it in. Plus the Sand chip helps further with chipping down non-Ground/Rock/Steel types, especially Zama who hates eating Knock + Sand chip. The classic combo Future Sight + CB Tar also punishes Gliscor without needing to predict with Ice Punch. Tera Rock Stone Edge 2HKOs Mola/Dozo, no hazards needed.
252+ Atk Choice Band Tera Rock Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Dondozo: 240-284 (47.6 - 56.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage
252+ Atk Choice Band Tera Rock Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Alomomola: 306-360 (57.3 - 67.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage
Ttar’s 61 Speed tier comes in clutch with outpacing Primarina and Gambit, which is important as it threatens a KO on both.
252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Primarina: 352-415 (109.6 - 129.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Low Kick (100 BP) vs. 212 HP / 0 Def Kingambit: 628-740 (159.3 - 187.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Imo this pairs well with Gambit despite the stacked weaknesses since it cripples many of Gambit’s checks. The Fighting and Ground weaknesses can be circumvented with any solid Ground immune or Fairy like Enamorus who’s also a Ground immune.
Concept
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Volcarona (Volcarona) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Flame Body
Tera Type: Water/Steel/Ground
EVs: 160 HP / 196 Def / 152 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Quiver Dance
- Fiery Dance
- Whirlwind
- Morning Sun
Idk if it was me or Tio Chico who came up with this, but this set takes a page out of Roar Zama’s book by potentially letting you beat opposing CM sweepers besides Hatt and Volc while racking up Spikes damage. Whirlwind also prevents Dnite from 1v1ing you and beats Ting-Lu. I’m being looking to test it, but I’ve been having trouble fitting it plus Spikes. The lack of coverage hurts as well.
Two of these sets are on two rmts, Specs Bolt is on one of the samples, SpD Lando is on my team from TotW, and I have a team here featuring both Mirror Coat Mola and bulky Grasspon.
https://pokepast.es/db2e3aa2abf7bcb4
There are a few ways to deal with it from what I could see.tested quite a bit with this. Any reqs for dealing with Garg? Feels like it 6-0’s the team. Especially Tera fairy defensive
also, if you can bait tera on something else and double into it, tusk can just click headlong rush and it can't set up or recoverspam fast enough to win the interactionThere are a few ways to deal with it from what I could see.
Firstly, alomomola can take a salt cure for the team and regen the damage off. If it comes into something that is not salt cure, it can get a wish off.
Secondly, hoopa-u threatens Garg a lot. Knock + psychic noise destroys Garg, which will get chipped and destroyed. Aggressively use hoopa against it (though playing against Garg you always should be aggressive)
Finally, ogerpon can encore Garg into a useless move such as Id. From there you can either reposition or start fishing for ivy cudgel crits.
Of course, this is not as easy as it seems. You do need to play around it, but the team can deal with it decently well. It's just a bit of a difficult matchup.
There are a few ways to deal with it from what I could see.
Firstly, alomomola can take a salt cure for the team and regen the damage off. If it comes into something that is not salt cure, it can get a wish off.
Secondly, hoopa-u threatens Garg a lot. Knock + psychic noise destroys Garg, which will get chipped and destroyed. Aggressively use hoopa against it (though playing against Garg you always should be aggressive)
Finally, ogerpon can encore Garg into a useless move such as Id. From there you can either reposition or start fishing for ivy cudgel crits.
Of course, this is not as easy as it seems. You do need to play around it, but the team can deal with it decently well. It's just a bit of a difficult matchup.
Mola can usually stall it out a decent amount. It's not aiming to beat it purely, just take damage so teammates can do the damage without being chipped. Ogerpon can at least try to do some damage, but it's main deal is to lock Garg into something it doesn't want to. For example, if you chip Garg down into recover range, that is free entry for ogerpon as it can waste recover pp, forcing a switch.Yeah I found mola makes like negative progress and Ogerpon doesn’t do enough damage against defensive Garg. My problem is typically that Hoopa works but gets chipped very easily by salt cure+hazards.
Clef sometimes runs knock too on stall.View attachment 623753
But on garg, its an alright mon. I did underestimate it a bit, but I still believe that when facing it, you just hit it. Don't be scared of the salt cure damage, just switch into your attacker that can deal with garg and do damage. Most likely, the garg user will either have to take the hit, thus saccing the garg, if they don't have another mon that can take the hit, or be forced to switch out, meaning something else will have to take it. I know in the past I said 'don't be passive' but this is what I meant by that. I do disagree with the stall part though, garg can be a nightmare for stall. Clef while immune to salt cure chip, can't do much to it in return. It gets overwhelmed by either curse garg or id bp garg. The main answer on stall is dondozo, who was to get lucky with sleep talk turns and has to not get crit multiple times. Most of the time, you are able to deal with garg, but its difficult for stall. Also, knock off the lefties with gliscor first, that's a necessity otherwise it will win.
ok but consider: only legal source of sleepIts just a worse ZamaH/Physical Iron Valiant that has a useless moveslot and secondary typing that requires a turn to even exist.