Hmm agreed on the Light Clay, but why would Politoed screw me over?
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Virizion
- Thread starter Garganator
- Start date
Hmm agreed on the Light Clay, but why would Politoed screw me over?
Drizzle Politoed would reduce the damage from Giga Drain by fifty percent. And hit back with an Ice move like Ice Beam. Or just use Bounce. Any other ability on Politoed and...
Leaf Blade or Energy Ball if wanting Grass STAB. Or Hidden Power Grass if you for whatever reason are wary of Eccentric Ditto. Would it even be a Grass Hidden Power from Ditto?
I've played around with this guy a bit and I'm quite liking him. I particularly like Double Screening. Because he's so fast, and has bulk, you can easily set up both screens and switch to your sweeper/passer.
But he does tank really well. And while I agree it is annoying that he has that Ice and Fire weakness, Poison to an extent(wtf is with Swamperts running Slime Wave?), but really it doesn't interfere much and he's an awesome check to several pokemon, specifically, Tyranitar(which if it isn't running Ice Beam/Flamethrower, it can't do anything, and even if it could it's outsped and OHKO-2HKO'd by Holy Sword).
The lack of recovery move does hurt quite a bit, however, really, if you're using any kind of wall from this generation that isn't called Burungeru, you're probably going to need Wish support anyway, so it isn't that big of a deal imo.
Btw the speedy tank spread on the first page is missing 4 EVs in Defense :P
But he does tank really well. And while I agree it is annoying that he has that Ice and Fire weakness, Poison to an extent(wtf is with Swamperts running Slime Wave?), but really it doesn't interfere much and he's an awesome check to several pokemon, specifically, Tyranitar(which if it isn't running Ice Beam/Flamethrower, it can't do anything, and even if it could it's outsped and OHKO-2HKO'd by Holy Sword).
The lack of recovery move does hurt quite a bit, however, really, if you're using any kind of wall from this generation that isn't called Burungeru, you're probably going to need Wish support anyway, so it isn't that big of a deal imo.
Btw the speedy tank spread on the first page is missing 4 EVs in Defense :P
Thick Fat Snorlax/Miltank (Counter*move*), Hydration Rest Pokemon (with Rugged Helmet; Dewgong? :nerd:),
Drapion, and Walrein sound like acceptable teammates, though not ALL on the SAME team...
Surprising that some Rain teams lack this guy.
It doesn't seem like a complete counter, though I may be wrong.. Ice Beam is a 4 hit KO after a Light Screen, and in many circumstances Bounce is a 4 hit KO after Reflect. You could be really risky and go for a 3 hit KO with Focus Blast, or you could just take the damage and switch out to another counter I would think, with a screen up. I guess Drizzle is the point and would be annoying but if you've got your screens up and can still use STAB Focus Blast, it's really not all that bad..
Unless I'm missing something, how's Giga Drain's power reduced in rain? unless you meant Synthesis having less recovery in rain.
And to answer your question, yes Ditto will have HP Grass.
Yeah, he must be thinking of Synthesis (which Virizion doesn't get btw) since weather has no effect on Giga Drain's power.
Politoed isn't really a threat to Virizion. It has other things to worry about.
Politoed isn't really a threat to Virizion. It has other things to worry about.
I like very much Birijion. He can switch in many actual top threats (Doryuuzu, Garchomp no-Bander, Tyranitar, Zapdos to name just them) and threat them back with a respectable Close Combat (OHKO on Doryuuzu) or reduce the damage with Reflect.
I use the Speedy Tank, and he works very well. The only drawback is his below-average power, but he has good attacks (Leaf Blade with 90 BP and Close Combat).
I think he is under-rated. He has few but excellent niches.
I use the Speedy Tank, and he works very well. The only drawback is his below-average power, but he has good attacks (Leaf Blade with 90 BP and Close Combat).
I think he is under-rated. He has few but excellent niches.
One of the most effective movesets I've used with it is an annoyer set. It especially has good synergy with Politoed, who brings the rain and can minimize damage from Fire-type attacks. It can set up Reflect and Light Screen well. Toxic and Roar also let it distribute poison to other teammates. With EV investment in HP and Special Defense and leftovers, and some Wish support, it can really frustrate an opponent's team.
I've been playing around with Birijion on my rain team lately, it is easily my MVP. I first used a bulky SD set, then since everyone started spamming Nattorei and Gliscor, I changed to Calm Mind with HP Ice. It fills so many holes on different teams. It can straight up sweep your bog standard rain team and also help against Doryuuzu and Sandstorm teams to some extent. I've just been using:
Birijion @ Life Orb
Ability: Justice Heart
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Nature: Timid
-Calm Mind
-Giga Drain
-Focus Blast
-Hidden Power Ice
Yeah, Focus Blast is stupid but you really don't have any other choice. +1 Giga Drain eats up stuff that doesn't resist it and lets you last quite a while. I remember once Birijion was on about 5%, Giga Drained a Politoed and got back to about 55 (The opponent probably tried to sac Politoed to take Birijion by LO damage, but whatever). HP Ice kills Gliscor, which is probably the reason I changed to CM in the first place.
Birijion @ Life Orb
Ability: Justice Heart
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Nature: Timid
-Calm Mind
-Giga Drain
-Focus Blast
-Hidden Power Ice
Yeah, Focus Blast is stupid but you really don't have any other choice. +1 Giga Drain eats up stuff that doesn't resist it and lets you last quite a while. I remember once Birijion was on about 5%, Giga Drained a Politoed and got back to about 55 (The opponent probably tried to sac Politoed to take Birijion by LO damage, but whatever). HP Ice kills Gliscor, which is probably the reason I changed to CM in the first place.
As a fan of grass types and bulky offense, i was very much looking forward to attempting to put erufuun down long enough to test this thing, and when i finally did, i was quite impressed.
I ran jolly, max speed, some attack to get a round number and put everything else in hp and special defense w/ close combat, leaf blade, swords dance and stone edge. It is quite the capable sweeper that notably rips holes in rain teams due to grass' key resistances and the fact that ice beams tend to only 3 or even 4hko this thing. The combination of speed and bulk was something i initially balked at, but now i see the value.
It does have some issues. First is lack of recovery; the good news is that there are good water wishers, and water and grass have good synergy. The other major issue is the terrible offensive stab combo and the resulting reliance on the 80acc stone edge. Another major issue is that it is stopped cold by any and all status.
I found justice heart to be a little useless because it relies on prediction, and a few of the more common dark moves can't be switched into anyway (pursuit, sucker punch).
The good news is that it is bulky and fast, and SD gives it enough attack to kill stuff even if you invest in its defenses. Unfortunately, between breloom, roobushin, terakion and even kojondo, there are better choices for a team slot, but i can honestly say that virizion happily exceeded my expectations. Its speed, bulk and resists give it its own little niche.
I ran jolly, max speed, some attack to get a round number and put everything else in hp and special defense w/ close combat, leaf blade, swords dance and stone edge. It is quite the capable sweeper that notably rips holes in rain teams due to grass' key resistances and the fact that ice beams tend to only 3 or even 4hko this thing. The combination of speed and bulk was something i initially balked at, but now i see the value.
It does have some issues. First is lack of recovery; the good news is that there are good water wishers, and water and grass have good synergy. The other major issue is the terrible offensive stab combo and the resulting reliance on the 80acc stone edge. Another major issue is that it is stopped cold by any and all status.
I found justice heart to be a little useless because it relies on prediction, and a few of the more common dark moves can't be switched into anyway (pursuit, sucker punch).
The good news is that it is bulky and fast, and SD gives it enough attack to kill stuff even if you invest in its defenses. Unfortunately, between breloom, roobushin, terakion and even kojondo, there are better choices for a team slot, but i can honestly say that virizion happily exceeded my expectations. Its speed, bulk and resists give it its own little niche.
I dunno.. reminds me of Shaymin without Seed Flare.... Probly OU but only barely
what the heck with everyone saying this guy not OU ?
This guy is OU material from every sense.
His CM set is definitely the one of the most annoying and effective set in the entire gen 5 and hes definitely one of the best pokemon in gen 5.
No hes NOT a good dory check. I try to use him as that and its disapointing. But when used as offensive pokemon, 3 word. THIS GUY RULES.(my teams weak to this guy lol)
Basicaly when facing him, i rely on my opponents overconfidence at +2 birijion and using giga drain on Ttar. Otherwise, im probably dead by those time
Yeah rather than using his disapointing defenses for defensive pupose, why not using him as offensive pokemon ? He is not so reliable at checking Doryuuzu especialy considering randorusu usualy paired with dory, and can set up on biri without HP ice. Offensively, he has taunt, high speed, acceptable stats, high SpD, all he has on worse was his defense. Hes easily one of the closest counterpart to the uber beast that is CM offensive Lugia
This guy is OU material from every sense.
His CM set is definitely the one of the most annoying and effective set in the entire gen 5 and hes definitely one of the best pokemon in gen 5.
No hes NOT a good dory check. I try to use him as that and its disapointing. But when used as offensive pokemon, 3 word. THIS GUY RULES.(my teams weak to this guy lol)
Basicaly when facing him, i rely on my opponents overconfidence at +2 birijion and using giga drain on Ttar. Otherwise, im probably dead by those time
Yeah rather than using his disapointing defenses for defensive pupose, why not using him as offensive pokemon ? He is not so reliable at checking Doryuuzu especialy considering randorusu usualy paired with dory, and can set up on biri without HP ice. Offensively, he has taunt, high speed, acceptable stats, high SpD, all he has on worse was his defense. Hes easily one of the closest counterpart to the uber beast that is CM offensive Lugia
So I was thinking about testing this guy as I've been having some trouble with Sand and Rain and I just have a question.If the 3 moves I have so far are:
Calm Mind
Giga Drain
Focus Blast
What would be the better final option?
Taunt-With the speed you can shut down status,phazing,other set up sweepers, and Recovery moves.
Reflect-This lets it patch up the physical defense and provides team support.
HP Ice-Helps take out the flying types that wall his 2 STABs.
I can't really decide.I also want to know who all has used this against Rain and Sand.I really want to try it but I'm wondering how it will fare since some Rain abusers like Kingdra don't mind grass as much and can attack physically and Sand has Dory,Landlos,and Gliscor are all nuetral to the grass moves.
Really I have no experience using this so I appreciate any help.
Calm Mind
Giga Drain
Focus Blast
What would be the better final option?
Taunt-With the speed you can shut down status,phazing,other set up sweepers, and Recovery moves.
Reflect-This lets it patch up the physical defense and provides team support.
HP Ice-Helps take out the flying types that wall his 2 STABs.
I can't really decide.I also want to know who all has used this against Rain and Sand.I really want to try it but I'm wondering how it will fare since some Rain abusers like Kingdra don't mind grass as much and can attack physically and Sand has Dory,Landlos,and Gliscor are all nuetral to the grass moves.
Really I have no experience using this so I appreciate any help.
Any recommendations on the Swords Dance set?
Obviously, it may be something like this:
-Swords Dance
-Close Combat/Sacred Sword
-Leaf Blade/Stone Edge/Taunt/Reflect
-Leaf Blade/Stone Edge/Taunt/Reflect
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
Item: Life Orb
Go for HP ice. It helps take out Landlos, Garchomp, Gliscor, and other dragons, and Birijion outspeeds the majority of them. In rain, you set up on Politoed, Nattorei, etc. Giga Drain is all you need because at +2 nothing is gonna like it and even specs kingdra can't OHKO with Draco Meteor.
how does this thing compare to breloom? on its surface, as a physical attacker, Breloom outclasses. better move pool (including priority), abilities, and higher attack.
I also notice that this thing can't leech seed, which is a pity, considering its great speed. it has potential as a calm minder, but anything that has to rely on focus blast?... ech.
I also notice that this thing can't leech seed, which is a pity, considering its great speed. it has potential as a calm minder, but anything that has to rely on focus blast?... ech.
Thanks.Is a bulky EV spread better for the Calm Minder or just a 252 Sp.Atk/252 Spe the way to go?
Well personally I'd go for 252 Sp.Atk/252 Spe as it helps you to outspeed and KO Gliscor, Landlos,Garchomp etc(you still need a CM boost for Garchomp). Without the SpAtk evs its gonna be too weak and without the speed evs it may be too slow. Its physical defense is pathetic as it is and its SpDef is pretty damn high even without investment. So yeah just stick to the basic ev spread.
I had success with 252HP/252 Spe since the bulk gained from the HP Evs allows you to get to +2/2 pretty easily making it a pretty effective bulky stat upper with a move set of Giga Drain/Focus Blast( a shame he doesn't gets aura sphere or mystery sword :/)/HP Ice/Calm Mind. I think you could drop Spe evs to outspeed Garchomp and invest them in SpA if you don`t mind losing the chance to tie with other base 108s (most notably Terakion).
All in all he is a very good pokemon in the current meta game working well against Rain/Sand (including their inducers) and removing those pesky nattoreis. He can't take too much physical pain, but its enough to take a hit and KO back with his cool stab combo.
180 BP with 70% accuracy is not better than 280 BP with 100% accuracy.
I would have no problem with this guy because this guy dies to any flying move, like for example, sturdy skarmory