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Double Battle Metagame.

I've actually been using a Jirachi + Electivire lead on my Skill Swap team on the advice of TheMaskedNitpicker to throw the latter pokemon in there and it's been working well so far.

dpmfb385.png

Jirachi@Leftovers
Serene Grace
Timid-252 Sp. Atk, 176 Spd, 80 HP
-Thunderbolt
-Psychic
-Skill Swap
-Light Screen

dpffb466.png

Electivire@Expert Belt
Motor Drive
Lonely-252 Atk, 176 Spd, 80 Sp. Atk
-Discharge
-Cross Chop
-Ice Punch
-Taunt

It's a basic strategy--Skill Swap Electivire first turn while it Discharges, giving Jirachi a speed boost thanks to Motor Drive and a 60% chance to paralyze each opponent with Serene Grace, although it's not all that powerful. The lead could use a bit of tweaking, though; it gets royally screwed by status and any lead sporting Eruption (I just realized my team has a massive CS Typhlosion weak >_>). I'm also thinking of ditching Light Screen for an attacking move so Jirachi can have better coverage, but the truth is the protection it affords is really helpful, especially against Blizzard-happy Hail teams.
 
Wait, do you Skill Swap Serene Grace back after the speed boost? I dunno, seems like you're letting yourself pretty open to attacks. It seems cool though.
 
False said:
Possibly. Does Endure ensure that you'll survive one entire turn of attacks, or just a single attack?
Click to expand...
You can survive an entire turn of attacks. For example, you'll survive both a megahorn and a close combat if you have endure in play.
 
Here's a basic double battle strategy that I've found out.

Togekiss@Leftovers
EVs: 252 Hp / 6 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
-Follow Me
-Air Slash
-Roost
-Protect

Salamence@life orb
EVs: 6 def / 252 att / 252 speed
Adamant Nature
-Dragon Dance
-Dragon Claw/Outrage
-Earthquake/Brick Break
-Fire Blast

The point of this set is to get all of the oncoming attacks from the opponent to Togekiss, while a physical sweeper like Salamence sets up with Dragon Dance. Salamence can then proceed with sweeping with its STAB moves. Dragon Claw is for generic STAB, but Outrage boasts more power if you want to. Earthquake takes care of Heatran, but if you're concerned about accidentally hitting Togekiss (while roosting), you may opt to go with Brick Break instead. Fire Blast is there so you can hit Bronzong and Skarmory.

The EVs in HP and SpD are there for Togekiss to survive special attacks (most notably Ice Beam), such as Hidden Powers from Heatran or Thunderbolts. It's also useful for Togekiss to absorb Status as well.
 
tauros @ life orb/leftovers
252 Atk ,252 Spe , 4HP
intimidate
jolly
-rage
-return
-EQ
-filler (zen headbutt for ex)

Cloyster @ leftovers
252 Def , 252 Hp , 4 Spa
Skill link
bold
-icicle spear
-spikes
-surf
-ice beam

the idea is to let tauros attack first with rage and then let cloyster attack him with 5 times icile spear doing litte damage . because of rage tauros attack is now 5+ and then he can sweep teams . unlike bellydrum this is not countered by taunters. this startegy works with every poke who learns rage and cloyster . tauros has to survive the round of course
 
brutal satyr said:
tauros @ life orb/leftovers
252 Atk ,252 Spe , 4HP
intimidate
jolly
-rage
-return
-EQ
-filler (zen headbutt for ex)

Cloyster @ leftovers
252 Def , 252 Hp , 4 Spa
Skill link
bold
-icicle spear
-spikes
-surf
-ice beam

the idea is to let tauros attack first with rage and then let cloyster attack him with 5 times icile spear doing litte damage . because of rage tauros attack is now 5+ and then he can sweep teams . unlike bellydrum this is not countered by taunters. this startegy works with every poke who learns rage and cloyster . tauros has to survive the round of course
Click to expand...

I'd give Tauros Rock Slide and a Salac Berry. If you can't take out or flinch both opponents each turn, Tauros is going to be shut down fast, especially since it has to take damage to set up. I'd also put more EVs into Tauros's defenses and Cloyster's SpDef. Right now one Thunderbolt could shut this whole thing down. Give Cloyster a Foucs Sash, Choice Scarf, or something to make sure it gets to use Icicle Spear. Also, I'd give Cloyster Torment instead of Surf unless it's on a Rain Dance team. If Tauros doesn't KO both opponents, at least one will be hampered.
 
currently... i'm tinkering with some lead combos
this will probably be terrible.. but you never know until you try, just a note, this is for none sleep clause
dpmfa235.png

Smeargle@focus sash
Adamant
own tempo
4hp/252atk/252speed
Dark void
Gastro Acid
Belly Drum
ExtremeSpeed

dpmfa486.png

Regigigas@leftovers
adamant
slow start
252hp/252atk/4speed
Earthquake
Zen headbutt
Return
Thunderpunch/Ice punch

this combo is a very early tryout of an idea... moves may change (EG belly drum/extremespeed can be anything you wish, as can the zen headbutt and the punch on gigas), these don't matter to me at the moment as its an early test phase and moves will be modified to fit the metagame as and when.
the idea: the smeargle sleeps BOTH pokemon on the other team, then on the switches activates the gastro acid onto the regigigas, disabling slow start (might try sub punch with this combo) a smiple idea i have always wanted to test. i will probably also put slacking in a similar place, and swap smeargle with something more bulky to and with gastro if need be.
 
I'd just like to point out that Netbattle (you all remember Netbattle, right?) has been upgraded to Diamond and Pearl, so SOME of these teams can finally be tested! Sadly, any team relying on Platinum updates still has to wait.

As for starting duos, I've been thinking about the Salamence/Gyarados combo. It has a pretty good start, to be sure, what with Double intimidate, but most people just make both Salamence and Gyarados act like they do in Single battle and just try to sweep, which I see as problematic. Here's my take:

373.png

Salamence @ Life Orb
Intimidate
Modest/Mild
-Heat Wave/Fire Blast
-Hydro Pump
-Dragon Pulse/Earthquake/Rock Slide
-Protect

Salamence doesn't change much from his usual job of sweeping. If you decide to use a mixed set I went with Mild over Rash because Special attacks seem to be more common in Doubles, and you're going to be halving your opponent's Attack right away anyhow.


130.png

Gyarados @ Leftovers/Wacan Berry/Lum Berry
Intimidate
Adamant/Lonely || Jolly/Hasty
-Waterfall
-Earthquake
-Icy Wind/Thunder Wave
-Taunt

Gyarados, on the other hand, is going to play Support. There are a few things that outspeed Salamence that are problematic, but an Icy Wind on the first turn will solve that issue fairly quickly. And if it looks like they're going to try a Sleep or Trick Room, Taunt will sort that out as well. Thunder Wave is there if you only want to stop one pokemon and are incredibly paranoid about Icy Wind's 95 accuracy, but since Electivire has a new home in Double battles, that's not such a great idea. Again, if you want to have Icy Wind do just a LITTLE bit more damage, go with a -Defense Nature, because you aren't going to be worrying much about Physical attacks.
 
The big problem I have with Netbattle right now is that the turn endings are screwed up in that you switch in pokemon before the turn is over if they're KO'd, not to mention all the other bugs it has right now.
 
brutal satyr said:
tauros @ life orb/leftovers
252 Atk ,252 Spe , 4HP
intimidate
jolly
-rage
-return
-EQ
-filler (zen headbutt for ex)

Cloyster @ leftovers
252 Def , 252 Hp , 4 Spa
Skill link
bold
-icicle spear
-spikes
-surf
-ice beam

the idea is to let tauros attack first with rage and then let cloyster attack him with 5 times icile spear doing litte damage . because of rage tauros attack is now 5+ and then he can sweep teams . unlike bellydrum this is not countered by taunters. this startegy works with every poke who learns rage and cloyster . tauros has to survive the round of course
Click to expand...
This could also work with cloyster/mence.
Mence uses rage, cloyster uses unSTAB'd spike cannon (much less damage then icicle spear, and mence sweeps with an incredible attack stat, and more remaining HP than tauros. The only turn off is mences lower speed. (fix with salac berry, maybe?)
 
I think I have a pretty good idea here, but it's pretty complicated.
251.png

Celebi@leftovers
Timid
252hp/252spe/6def
~trick room
~baton pass
~filler
~filler
36.png
Clefable@leftovers

Relaxed


252hp/252def/6spD
~follow me
~softboiled
~filler
~filler

So first turn, celebi trick rooms, while clefable uses follow me.
Next, Clefable heals up and the fast celebi takes hits and either dies or baton passes out to this:
468.png

Lickilicky@leftovers
Brave
252hp/252atk/6def
~belly drum
~return
~earthquake
~explosion/aqua tail
Then the hopefully healed clefable uses follow me while lickilicky belly drums.
When clefable dies send in more trick room users for conitinued ultrafast lickilicky ownage.
 
I'm trying to think of other things for Celebi to do beforehand. It could set up screens, certainly; Light Screen would probably be favored over Reflect if you only pick one. You could also give it Heal Bell and send it in again just in case something goes wrong and Lickilicky gets statused before he can Belly Drum.
 
Also, if you are not worried about Clefable being Taunted, you can put Cosmic Power on it. And the more cosmic powers you have, the better you can follow me. You can then proceed to sweep their pokemon as all their attacks go to Clefable instead. You can also use her to setup other pokemon that are fragile but powerful. Just make sure you put protect on it if you are using Explosion.
 
There's a lot of potential with skill swapping Pure Power/Huge Power. Gallade and Azelf could get 766 attack. Tanks like Slowbro/Slowking, Bronzong and Claydol could get decent attacking stats to sweep with. A lot of possibilites.
 
I was thinking of something like this but wasn't sure if it would be viable:
Bronzong @ Lum / Leftovers / Occa / not sure
Brave / Sassy
Levitate
- Trick Room
- Psych Up
- Attack (Probably Iron Head?)
- Attack (Probably EQ?)

Snorlax @ Leftovers
Relaxed
Thick Fat
- Protect
- Belly Drum
- Attack (Probably Return?)
- Attack (Probably EQ?)

1st turn = Trick Room + Protect.
2nd turn = Belly Drum + Psych Up
... then both attack. Under TR, both pokemon will be slow, but Snorlax should be slower (assuming ideal low Speed IVs for both), so it can Belly Drum before Bronzong can use Psych Up. Even if Snorlax faints, at least Bronzong is still at +6 and can attack pretty hard. Snorlax can Protect for leftovers recovery while Bronzong is EQing.
 
Kaleidoscope said:
There's a lot of potential with skill swapping Pure Power/Huge Power. Gallade and Azelf could get 766 attack. Tanks like Slowbro/Slowking, Bronzong and Claydol could get decent attacking stats to sweep with. A lot of possibilites.
Click to expand...

Erm... I believe one of the things about skill swapping Pure Power / Huge Power is that you lose the boost. So it won't work.

EDIT: Ok, The Masked Ninjaker replied otherwise, so do try skill swapping in that case :).
 
Been testing out some team ideas on Netbattle. One of the stranger Trick Room starters I've run into has been a Gengar and a Togekiss. Togekiss uses Follow Me, while Gengar is the Trick Room user. Although I wouldn't really think of using Gengar for Trick Room, Follow Me has meant that more or less every single match against this person has resulted in him getting Trick Room off with no trouble at all. His Gengar was Focus Sashed as well, otherwise a Helping Handed Eruption could probably have solved that problem.
 
I've actually seen a ton of Follow Me Togekiss leads and they've turned out to be more of a hassle to deal with than I thought, especially since you can use the move twice in a row. Pretty much guaranteed set up of whatever--I'm thinking of using one on one of my new teams, if I ever get around to it. I wonder if it'll lead to more leads with Blizzard or Explosion?
 
Possibly. I've been thinking, and one thing that would screw over that lead I faced would be a Hail team, and opening with double Blizzards.

Still, if I used Follow Me on my team, I'd probably go with Clefable, especially if it was a Trick Room team.

Also, a peeve I've had with Netbattle is that they still use the Advance system of switching in pokemon after a faint, where you switch them in immediately.
 
@hhjj: Hm, that's interesting. I didn't look at your post until just now, but I've been using a similar strategy the past couple days in 4 v 4. The first 3 pokemon are really similar, except I used a Snorlax instead of Marowak. Also, it's best to be more defensive with marowak I think. For my Snorlax, it's Relaxed with near maxed EV in HP and Defense (and holds leftovers, while Togekiss holds Lum). Pretty much nearly nothing outside of fighting attacks can OHKO even after belly drum.

Also, my Bronzong had TR / Psych Up / Earthquake / Faint Attack (I wanted Iron Head but will have to wait for Platinum). I do the same thing you do: TR while my Snorlax Protects. But in the next turn, I usually have Bronzong use Psych Up on Snorlax while Snorlax attacks (so even if Snorlax faints, Bronzong can still attack pretty hard). I don't think Gyro Ball's a very good option for Bronzong in Double Battle, since Trick Room - and thus slow pokemon- is pretty common. That's why I'm waiting for Platinum to get Iron Head instead. I had Faint Attack since my Snorlax had Return and Earthquake, so it can't hit levitating ghosts. Return can 2HKO Skarmory/Bronzong. (My 4th pokemon was Gyarados, as a back up, for Intimidate and resisting both of Bronzong and Snorlax's only weaknesses.)

EDIT: Lol, o yah, I don't think it's possible to EV train a LEVEL 1 Smeargle (other than vitamins). :P So yah, it doesn't need any EVs.
 
hhjj said:
Togekiss: @ Leftovers
252 HP/ 4 Def/ 252 SpD
Trait: Serene Grace *so nothing misses under Hustle*
Calm

Follow Me
Roost
Baton Pass
Encore


Marowak: @ Thick Club
Trait: Lightening Rod
(- Spe, + Atk)
0 Spe IVs

Earthquake
Rock Slide
Belly Drum
Protect
Click to expand...

I posted something along the lines of your leading combo earlier on in this thread, I think. The problems remain the same; that against Hail teams, Abomosnow's Blizzards will pretty much massacre you, against rain teams, Surf will kill Marowak, and against Discharge leads, Togekiss dies. Follow Me won't stop Dark Void. Also, Follow Me overrides Lightningrod. And why does Togekiss have anything other than Follow Me if you won't use them?
 
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