Got Talent (Playable on ROM!) [Dead - no conditions in Gen 7]

Suicune @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 240 HP / 252 Def / 16 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Roar
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Altaria-Mega @ Altarianite
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 172 HP / 252 Def / 84 Spe
Bold Nature
- Body Slam
- Earthquake
- Cotton Guard
- Roost

Skarmory @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 232 HP / 252 Def / 24 Spe
Bold Nature
- Iron Head
- Roost
- Defog
- Iron Defense

Sceptile @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 240 HP / 16 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Agility
- Grass Knot
- Return

Electivire @ Leftovers
Ability: Motor Drive
EVs: 188 HP / 252 Atk / 68 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Focus Blast
- Taunt

Tyranitar @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 248 HP / 80 Def / 180 SpD
Bold Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Stealth Rock
- Pursuit
- Rock Tomb



Suicune Balance

INTRO :
I was messing around with Got Talent? today and I found a balance team that I thought functioned pretty well. After reading through this forum and stealing some of the awesome sets that other users posted, I came up with this team.
This is a balance team built around the Roar variant of Suicune, due to its ability to fire off powerful Scalds while phasing the unlimited amount of setup sweepers in the meta. Water is a great defensive typing coupled with Suicune's
outstanding physical bulk allowed it to take many boosted hits before relieving them of their stat changes. Now, for a brief explanation of the teambuilding process and inner workings of the team.

In Depth
Like I mentioned above, I started the team with Suicune. Its great bulk and defensive typing with access to Scald and Roar were very appealing in the current meta. I used max Defense in order to take boosted hits as well as possible.
The water defensive typing is very helpful as some of the most common boosters such as Skarmory, Aggron, and Slowbro are all resisted by Suicune. 16 Speed is rather standard on Cune to get a jump on other base 85 Pokemon.
240 HP hits a Lefties number, so that is rather useful too. Scald is obligatory STAB with a nice 30% burn chance, and is also Tough, which utilizes Suicune's high Defense stat.

The next Pokemon I added was Mega Altaria, which an awesome Pokemon right now because it can easily boost with Cotton Guard coupled with STAB Body Slam and reliable recovery. Some would say it is borderline broken, but here it
partners nicely with Suicune by resisting its 2 weaknesses in Grass and Electric, while Suicune checks Steel and Ice types. Earthquake gives Altaria borderline mandatory coverage imo to dent Steel Pokemon. 84 Speed just creeps the next
tier up with getting a jump on uninvested Base 90 Pokemon.

Skarmory is a really nice Pokemon in this meta due to its ability to utilize its high defense stat and Iron Head STAB coupled with reliable recovery and a nice boosting move in Iron Defense. Skarmory easily checks threats like Sceptile and Ninjask,
while providing crucial resists to the first two's weaknesses. He also gives the team some hazard control, while it isn't particularly weak to hazards, Spike-Stacking teams could give the team some trouble without Defog support. Max Defense with
a little bit of speed maximizes Skarmory's physical bulk, allowing it to sweep teams with Iron Head.

After the defensive core was more or less completed, I started to focus on faster cleaners and attackers. Sceptile caught my eye over something like Ninjask due to its ability to run Grass Knot and Return, which allowed it to take on both Special
and Physical walls with ease. Sceptile forces lots of switches, which gives it an opportunity to Substitute up and start boosting with Agility. Grass Knot is obligatory STAB, while Return gives it nice neutral coverage. It is a great late game cleaner,
and it can straight up 6-0 unprepared teams, while reaching Speeds over 1000. 240 HP gives it the ability to make 4 substitutes (4n + 1), while maxing out its Speed.

Even after adding Altaria, I was still weak to powerful electrical attackers, and I wanted a way of beating Skarmory and another way of beating Slowbro, while adding a stallbreaker. So, I after seeing that Electivire set that is earlier in the forums
(credit to you), I decided that Taunt Electivire would greatly benefit this team's matchup against stall, as well as giving it a nice Volt Switcher. I decided to go for a bulkier spread, because in this meta, everything is either really fat and slow, or really
fast like Ninjask. 68 Speed gives Electivire a jump on 24 Speed Base 100 Pokemon like Mew and Uxie(Is that going too far lol), while maxing out its nice Base 123 Attack Stat. The rest was thrown in HP, and Lefties give it a little longevity against stall
teams.

Looking at the previous five members, I was starting to see the lack of a specially bulky wall, and also the lack of Stealth Rocks. Dusclops was also looking like a huge threat, so Tyranitar perfectly fit the bill. It provided a form of speed control in T-Wave
and Rock Tomb, while giving me a rather powerful Pursuit trapper. I used the standard Smogon spread because under Sandstorm it hits a nice 421 SpDef, and I wanted it to have decent mixed bulk. If you want it to be stronger you can obviously invest
more SpDef, but that spread is just a preference.

Conclusion
The team is still in testing, but I feel like I have sufficiently covered the wide array of threats in this really fun, unique metagame. I also feel like it displays a good example of the frameworks for a Balance team in a metagame where Semi-Stall and Power
Stall are very prominent.

Enjoy n_N
 
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Had a bug when playing a private match. Diamond Storm apparently didn't switch to special damage, despite being a Beautiful move.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gottalent-380812651
It did. However, it still deals damage to their physical defense, just using your special attack stat. All attacks work like that. Basically, if you are a special attacker with a formerly physical move, it works like psyshock, and vice versa.

I don't know if this is intended, but I'm of the opinion that if it isn't it should be.
 
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It did. However, it still deals damage to their physical defense, just using your special attack stat. All attacks work like that. Basically, if you are a special attacker with a formerly physical move, it works like psyshock, and vice versa.

I don't know if this is intended, but I'm of the opinion that if it isn't it should be.
I totally forgot about that. Nevermind, ignore me.
 
The replay that Matt posted brings up a possible precedent for the unaware discussion. It's my understanding that burn used to cut attack (in earlier generations-- http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Burn_(status_condition) ) but switched to cutting all physical attacks; foul play is now only affected if the user is burnt, etc. The game has changed its exact mechanics to keep up with the spirit of the game before; certainly unaware could follow this pattern.

A stat-inclusive unaware also seems good for the metagame; speed boosts, cotton guards, and other setups are king, at least for now.
 
While this may not be a bug, per sè, I should think this is unintended behavior. After all, that description is the one that Smogon has assigned it; in-game, it's description is merely: "Ignore the opposing Pokemon's stat changes." Now, it's a known mechanic that Unaware doesn't ignore speed changes for the purpose of determining turn order, but it should be able to ignore the stat changes of any attacking stat, not just two. And besides, Pokemon using Cool and Beautiful moves are already at a disadvantage; why should they be the only ones to be affected by Unaware?
The description "assigned" by Smogon is merely a detailed explanation of how the Unaware was coded to work. In-game descriptions do tend to be a little bit more vague, but it's not as if Smogon made up the mechanics.

The replay that Matt posted brings up a possible precedent for the unaware discussion. It's my understanding that burn used to cut attack (in earlier generations-- http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Burn_(status_condition) ) but switched to cutting all physical attacks; foul play is now only affected if the user is burnt, etc. The game has changed its exact mechanics to keep up with the spirit of the game before; certainly unaware could follow this pattern.

A stat-inclusive unaware also seems good for the metagame; speed boosts, cotton guards, and other setups are king, at least for now.
Sure the game has changed its burn mechanics, but those changes have been kept constant since gen 3. It is a bit misleading that when you hover on showdown, it gives the atk stat as halved when it's actually not, which is specifically relevant in Got Talent? (Special Cool moves). We also are not Game Freak, so i don't think we should be changing mechanics for one specific ability just to "keep up with the spirit of game," because it was not the original intention for this metagame.
 

bp scrub

rub a dub dub one scrub in a tub
I was just going to start up a little discussion about one of the particular Pokemon nv was looking at for a potential suspect. That is, Mega Altaria.

Altaria @ Altarianite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Cotton Guard
- Body Slam / Double Edge
- Earthquake
- Roost

This is arguably its best set (although creeping metagross might be a decent idea n_n), Mega Altaria has one of the best boosting moves in the metagame to the point where it is borderline broken.
After just one boost, it is kind of unstoppable, even its best "counters" being not able to kill it.

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Iron Head vs. +3 248 HP / 252+ Def Mega Altaria: 114-134 (32.2 - 37.9%) -- 93.2% chance to 3HKO

+3 252+ Atk Mega Altaria Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Metagross: 286-338 (78.5 - 92.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

On top of that, Altaria can easily Roost on Metagross given that it is not getting flinches. Body Slam is a ridiculously strong STAB move that obliterates anything that doesn't resist it.
On the other hand, Altaria does have some reliable checks in Mega Venusaur and Skarmory, but both can easily be dealt with given Altaria's teammates.

Just wanted to open up the floor to Mega Altaria and hear people's thoughts on the place in the metagame.
 
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nv

The Lost Age
is a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Driver Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
ok so right now, burns in GT on rom.psim.us behave differently than on the main
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/rom-gottalent-8074
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gottalent-380905895

It looks like Attack is halved on the main server but Physical moves are halved on rom.
Which one is it supposed to be?
From how Foul Play works with burns, it seems like it should be halving physical moves instead of the actual attack stat.
The way it is on ROM where physical moves are halved is the way it should behave I think. Tagging urkerab and The Immortal for the fix and Marty to check and make sure this is how it should behave.
 

Eternally

is a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
NU Leader



Got Talent? Viability Rankings

S Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are amazing in the Got Talent? metagame. These Pokemon are usually able to perform a variety of roles effectively, or can just do one extremely well. Their use has low risk involved and high reward exerted. Pokemon in this rank have very few flaws that are patched up by numerous positive traits.

Mega Aggron
Mega Altaria
Mega Venusaur

A Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are fantastic in the Got Talent? metagame, and can sweep, support, or wall significant portions of the metagame. These Pokemon require less support than most others to be used effectively and have few flaws that can easily be overlooked when compared to their positive traits.

A+
Chesnaught
Mega Diancie
Ferrothorn
Skarmory
Mega Slowbro

A
Heatran
Mega Latias
Mandibuzz
Ninjask
Slowbro
Uxie

A-
Mega Metagross
Mew
Mega Sableye
Mega Scizor
Mega Steelix
Suicune
Mega Swampert
Tyranitar
Umbreon
Volcanion
Zygarde

B Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are great in the Got Talent? metagame. These Pokemon have more notable flaws than those above them that affect how they function in the tier. Their positive traits still outshine their negatives, but they require a bit more team support to bring out their full potential.

B+
Celebi
Chansey
Cresselia
Dusclops
Florges
Furfrou
Gliscor
Mega Heracross
Hippowdon
Keldeo
Mega Lopunny
Meloetta
Mega Pinsir
Quagsire
Registeel
Rhydon
Sceptile
Scolipede
Sigilyph
Snorlax
Steelix
Sylveon
Tyrantrum
Weezing

B
Amoonguss
Cobalion
Doublade
Forretress
Gligar
Hoopa
Kecleon
Lairon
Latias
Latios
Manaphy
Mega Medicham
Onix
Porygon2
Scrafty
Serperior
Spiritomb
Mega Tyranitar

B-
Mega Audino
Blastoise
Clefable
Cofagrigus
Dragonite
Golbat
Musharna
Swampert
Tangela
Volcarona


C Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that have notable niches in the Got Talent? metagame, but have just as many notable flaws that prevent them from being effective. Pokemon in the C tier often require significant support to be effective. Pokemon from this rank tend to face a lot of competition with the more commonly used Pokemon.

C+
Mega Abomasnow
Aggron
Alakazam
Mega Camerupt
Cofagrigus
Donphan
Garchomp
Kyurem-Black
Machamp
Slurpuff
Stoutland
Tangrowth
Togekiss
Torkoal

C
Mega Alakazam
Mega Beedrill
Bronzong
Claydol
Electivire
Gallade
Regirock
Relicanth
Rhyperior
Slowking
Thundurus
Whimsicott

C-
Aegislash
Carracosta
Diancie
Drapion
Landorus-Therian
Metang
Omastar
Pelipper
Probopass

D(on't use) Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are nonviable in the Got Talent? metagame and have no concrete advantage to make them worth using. Pokemon from this rank have multiple crippling flaws that prevent them from being successful a majority of the time, and are severely outclassed because of it.
Dusknoir
Galvantula
Magcargo
Malamar
 
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You're missing Starmie. Almost every move it commonly runs is Beautiful, while it gets Grass Knot coverage under Cute (its best stat). The only moves it misses out on are Scald (though you could run PDef to decent effect) and Thunderbolt (Cool).

Aggron also needs to move waaay up. It's outclassed as an Iron Defense user by its Mega and about a million other Pokemon, but Rock Polish or Autotomize give it much-needed speed so it can clean shop with STAB Head Smash.
 
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Cobalion @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Taunt
- Iron Defense
- Iron Head
- Superpower

With so many bulky mon that are slow, Cobalion can just outspeed them and Taunt them, preventing them to sweep. It outspeeds all of the S rank mons and most of the A rank mons and Taunt them, while you can boost yourself with Iron Defense and your opponent who doesn't have a Special move that's not resisted by Steel basically can't do anything. Because of this, I've been getting many free kills from this as it makes bulky steels like Mega Aggron (who only have Physical moves in it's Tough movepool) set up bait. Pretty good if you can use it correctly.

Also, Mega Metagross CAN beat a +3 Mega Altaria.

252+ SpA Mega Metagross Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Mega Altaria: 230-272 (64.9 - 76.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Changed the base SpA to 150.
 
going to have to nom Furfrou for a rise to A/A+. not only is Furfrou, sitting at base 102 Speed, one of the fastest relevant Pokémon in the GT metagame aside from dedicated Cute attackers like Ninjask, Sceptile, and to an extent Mega Lopunny, it's also an extremely threatening setup sweeper with its Ability Fur Coat coupled with access to one of the best boosting moves in the metagame, Cotton Guard. While Furfrou's offensive Tough movepool is rather sparse, consisting of only 10 moves with several being unviable for their own reasons, it's sufficient for its own purposes: Headbutt is a reliable STAB move which hits most neutral targets very hard, Wild Charge is a decent coverage move that hits bulky Waters and the likes of Mandibuzz and Tyranitar harder than Headbutt, and Snarl allows Furfrou to blow past many of the Steel-types, such as Mega Steelix, that would normally hope to wall it. Really, despite its low Base Power and lack of STAB, Snarl is another component that makes Furfrou as threatening as it is: Snarl hits based on the opponent's Special Defense as opposed to their physical Defense, which allows Furfrou to successfully exploit the lower Defense of many other common Tough set-up sweepers (excluding those that resist it, such as Mega Altaria and Cobalion). In addition to this, it also makes for a solid check to many attackers that hit on the physical defense in a pinch thanks to its naturally high Defense after Fur Coat and quick Cotton Guard. All of this I believe makes Furfrou worthy of a rise to A or A+.

(I'd include calcs but calcing for GT is a pain in the ass, if someone else wants to do that for me that'd be appreciated)

I also think that Kecleon should be ranked somewhere. Kecleon's high Special Defense, decent Clever movepool including the likes of Knock Off, Sucker Punch, Shadow Ball, Shadow Sneak, and Rock Tomb, and access to Protean make it an effective Assault Vest user. That said, at 40 base Speed it's very slow even for the standards of GT, and its low physical Defense is easily exploitable as a result. For that reason, I think it might be at home in B, B-, or C+.
 
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Eternally

is a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
NU Leader
going to have to nom Furfrou for a rise to A/A+. not only is Furfrou, sitting at base 102 Speed, one of the fastest relevant Pokémon in the GT metagame aside from dedicated Cute attackers like Ninjask, Sceptile, and to an extent Mega Lopunny, it's also an extremely threatening setup sweeper with its Ability Fur Coat coupled with access to one of the best boosting moves in the metagame, Cotton Guard. While Furfrou's offensive Tough movepool is rather sparse, consisting of only 10 moves with several being unviable for their own reasons, it's sufficient for its own purposes: Headbutt is a reliable STAB move which hits most neutral targets very hard, Wild Charge is a decent coverage move that hits bulky Waters and the likes of Mandibuzz and Tyranitar harder than Headbutt, and Snarl allows Furfrou to blow past many of the Steel-types, such as Mega Steelix, that would normally hope to wall it. Really, despite its low Base Power and lack of STAB, Snarl is another component that makes Furfrou as threatening as it is: Snarl hits based on the opponent's Special Defense as opposed to their physical Defense, which allows Furfrou to successfully exploit the lower Defense of many other common Tough set-up sweepers (excluding those that resist it, such as Mega Altaria and Cobalion). In addition to this, it also makes for a solid check to many attackers that hit on the physical defense in a pinch thanks to its naturally high Defense after Fur Coat and quick Cotton Guard. All of this I believe makes Furfrou worthy of a rise to A or A+.

(I'd include calcs but calcing for GT is a pain in the ass, if someone else wants to do that for me that'd be appreciated)

I also think that Kecleon should be ranked somewhere. Kecleon's high Special Defense, decent Clever movepool including the likes of Knock Off, Sucker Punch, Shadow Ball, Shadow Sneak, and Rock Tomb, and access to Protean make it an effective Assault Vest user. That said, at 40 base Speed it's very slow even for the standards of GT, and its low physical Defense is easily exploitable as a result. For that reason, I think it might be at home in B, B-, or C+.
That's my bad, Kecleon was ranked in the updated VR, just forgot to paste it in.

*Added Kecleon to an initial rank of B
 

xJownage

Even pendulums swing both ways
A-
Mega Metagross
WHAT??

Ok so Mega Metagross is the ONLY Mega I'm using anymore because it's SO good. Iron Defense, Iron Head, Earthquake, and Bullet Punch creates a very fast, very fat sweeper most teams can't handle. having base 110 speed is all it needs to outspeed most of the metagame and even with a positive nature it's attacks are stupidly powerful when boosted with Tough Claws. The speed and Bullet punch make it just as good as Maggron in my experience, considering Maggron has no way to deal with special attackers while Megagross just destroys them before they can flinch. The speed makes it easy to get off an Iron Defense as well, meaning it's effectively more bulky than Maggron on the first turn out in many situations due to the fact that it's getting an Iron Defense off well before Maggron does.

+2 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mew: 189-223 (55.4 - 65.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

That's some pretty serious priority damage that Maggron can't dose out.

Megagross should be around A+. It's the only mega I use just because I love the speed so much, and it's bulk still rivals Maggron's because of the speed allowing it to easily get off an Iron Defense before taking its first hit.

Also if yall want to sleep on Dusclops that's fine, Spdef RestTalk is an absurdly good set because it's essentially what Aegislash Dreams of being without the Steel Typing and with Eviolite.
 
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I would really like to get into this meta, but I'm finding it really hard to teambuild for. Any advice (without the snarky comments) would be greatly appreciated.
 
ChrystalFalchion , my personal advice for teambuilding in the meta would be to pick a Pokemon and a playstyle you want to build. For example, Mega Venusaur and Semi-Stall. Because Offense is easily outclassed by Power Stall in this tier, I would say that the most offensive playstyle you can have without becoming unviable is balance. So really, for a viable team, you have a choice between Power Stall --> Semi-Power Stall --> and Balance. Next, my thought process is to add check / counters for some of the major threats in the tier, which you can find in the Viability Rankings above. Try to do some role compression and add good type synergy so that you can have good "offensive" partners for the Pokemon you're building around. For something like Mega Venusaur, a good partner would be a Steel Type, because it can set up on Psychic and Flying types, which Mega Venusaur is weak to. Now that we have the core down, lets move on to some of the defensive stuff.

Because of the multitude of setup sweepers in the meta, adding checks for the most potent setup sweepers is near mandatory. If you don't have a Bulky Steel check, you're done for. These should be about 2-3 Pokemon that support your main core and help blanket check a majority of the tier.
Last, I find a late-game cleaner such as Sceptile or Ninjask very helpful in this meta. Once their few checks have been removed, they easily pick off weakened teams. The only instance where you would not have this role would be on Power Stall, in which your last Pokemon would be another defensive one that shores up any weaknesses you might still have.

In the case of Stall, you will literally have 6 Defensive Pokemon so it's pretty self explanatory.

tl;dr
- Pick Playstyle
- Choose Core (2-3 Pokemon)
- Add a Defensive Backbone to blanket check the meta (2-3 Pokemon)
- add a Supporting role or Late Game cleaner(1 Pokemon, depends on the playstyle you pick above)


Good luck with team building and I hope this helps~ ! :)
 
Sorry for the double post but after looking at the Viability Rankings, I think Sceptile needs to move from B+ ---> A-
Sceptile is a huge threat in this meta right now because it can easily sweep unprepared teams and has a limited amount of checks(Just Skarm, Defensive Venu, and Chesnaught is all I can think of)
After one boost it 2hko's almost all of the metagame, including fat steels such as Mega Aggron and Mega Metagross.
+2 252+ SpA Sceptile Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Metagross: 186-220 (51 - 60.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+2 252+ SpA Sceptile Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 240 SpD Mega Aggron: 186-220 (54 - 63.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Many of its checks can easily be worn down with right partners, and it has the potential to outspeed the entirety of the meta, with Unburden + Agility even beating a +6 Ninjask.

Some of its flaws that keep it from going higher than A- are that its very susceptible to priority and is checked by some common threats, but it does not mean they can't be overwhelmed with the right boosts.
 
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Well, is it really a bug? Unaware's description is such: "This Pokemon ignores other Pokemon's Attack, Special Attack, and accuracy stat stages when taking damage, and ignores other Pokemon's Defense, Special Defense, and evasiveness stat stages when dealing damage." So, Unaware doesn't ignore those boosts, according to mechanics. This OM changes move categories; other mechanics (should) remain intact.

Tagging mechanic expert Marty.
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/battle-mechanics-research.3489239/page-48#post-5067683

Foul Play ignores the target's Attack boosts if the target has Unaware, which is not implied by Smogon's description you are quoting. (I wouldn't turn to the Smogon description as a source of likely behavior regardless -it's designed for the least confusion, not the most accuracy)

Unaware Foul Play's behavior is strongly suggestive that Unaware flat-out ignores all non-Speed stat stage considerations on other Pokemon at all times.

(I'll admit that it's very possible Speed is logically exempt, even if Cute moves bypassing Unaware is a distressing, confusing possibility, since Speed is unaffected by Unaware normally)

The description "assigned" by Smogon is merely a detailed explanation of how the Unaware was coded to work. In-game descriptions do tend to be a little bit more vague, but it's not as if Smogon made up the mechanics.
Smogon's descriptions tend to be designed for minimal confusion, not maximal accuracy. (That is, they are designed to require the fewest number of clarifications for ambiguous or seemingly contradictory examples) Even then, they will provide descriptions that are wrong wrong wrong in practice -Pure Power/Huge Power continue to claim, as the games also claim, that they "double Attack", when the actual behavior would be most accuratly summarized as "Doubles the damage of user's Physical moves". (Diggersby's Foul Play benefits from its Huge Power, for example, where Klefki smacking Mega Medicham only hits it its base 100 Attack, not the functionally more than 250 Attack Pure Power pushes invested/max IV Mega Medicham to)

I was just going to start up a little discussion about one of the particular Pokemon nv was looking at for a potential suspect. That is, Mega Altaria.

Altaria @ Altarianite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Cotton Guard
- Body Slam / Double Edge
- Earthquake
- Roost

This is arguably its best set (although creeping metagross might be a decent idea n_n), Mega Altaria has one of the best boosting moves in the metagame to the point where it is borderline broken.
After just one boost, it is kind of unstoppable, even its best "counters" being not able to kill it.

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Iron Head vs. +3 248 HP / 252+ Def Mega Altaria: 114-134 (32.2 - 37.9%) -- 93.2% chance to 3HKO

+3 252+ Atk Mega Altaria Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Metagross: 286-338 (78.5 - 92.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

On top of that, Altaria can easily Roost on Metagross given that it is not getting flinches. Body Slam is a ridiculously strong STAB move that obliterates anything that doesn't resist it.
On the other hand, Altaria does have some reliable checks in Mega Venusaur and Skarmory, but both can easily be dealt with given Altaria's teammates.

Just wanted to open up the floor to Mega Altaria and hear people's thoughts on the place in the metagame.
Mega Metagross gets Iron Defense and will always outspeed at equivalent investment. Mega Metagross struggles to switch into and defeat Mega Altaria, but if they face off or Mega Altaria switches into Mega Metagross, Mega Metagross will tend to destroy it.

Also, Mega Altaria can run Incinerate (Tough Special Fire move) to destroy Skarmory easily. (And to more easily destroy Mega Metagross than using Earthquake) Doesn't even matter that it's only 60 BP. Leaves it more susceptible to Heatran, which is a flaw, but not necessarily an unmanageable flaw, especially if you're fine with just dropping Roost and having Cotton Guard+3 attacks.

Also, Mega Metagross CAN beat a +3 Mega Altaria.

252+ SpA Mega Metagross Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Mega Altaria: 230-272 (64.9 - 76.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Changed the base SpA to 150.
Mixedgross!

Slotting that in. In addition to Mega Altaria, that lets Mega Metagross beat various other bulky Physical 'mons. Neat!

Sorry for the double post but after looking at the Viability Rankings, I think Sceptile needs to move from B+ ---> A-
Sceptile is a huge threat in this meta right now because it can easily sweep unprepared teams and has a limited amount of checks(Just Skarm, Defensive Venu, and Chesnaught is all I can think of)
After one boost it 2hko's almost all of the metagame, including fat steels such as Mega Aggron and Mega Metagross.
+2 252+ SpA Sceptile Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Metagross: 186-220 (51 - 60.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+2 252+ SpA Sceptile Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 240 SpD Mega Aggron: 186-220 (54 - 63.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Many of its checks can easily be worn down with right partners, and it has the potential to outspeed the entirety of the meta, with Unburden + Agility even beating a +6 Ninjask.

Some of its flaws that keep it from going higher than A- are that its very susceptible to priority and is checked by some common threats, but it does not mean they can't be overwhelmed with the right boosts.
Note that it can run Fling (Cute) to easily trigger Unburden. Against Special walls like Chansey, it of course stomps things with Return/Frustration -or Facade, if you expect Status attempts.

It's definitely a threatening Pokemon.
 
I've noticed that unaware doesn't work like normal in this metagame. If your opponent were to set up a swords dance against my unaware quagsire, the +2 attack would be ignored when they attack. However, lets say a +6 speed Ninjask uses return... it acts as if I didn't have unaware. Same goes for defense and special defense boosts.
 

Marty

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The way it is on ROM where physical moves are halved is the way it should behave I think. Tagging urkerab and The Immortal for the fix and Marty to check and make sure this is how it should behave.
I looked at how it's implemented on main and the damage calculation doesn't consider burn at all, so no damage is getting halved anywhere. I assume it's an oversight and all physical moves should be affected, but TI can confirm.
 
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I'll weigh in on the Unaware debate -- changing the ability to work with non-Atk/Spa boosts isn't making a custom change for one ability, it's fixing an oversight to match the overall idea of the OM. If I were to rephrase the mechanic outlined in the OP, it would be "Got Talent uses different stats, including Def/SpD/Spe, as offensive stats depending on the move used."

Unaware is designed to ignore offensive boosts while defending and to ignore defensive boosts while attacking. Because no move currently uses non-Atk/SpA stats to calculate damage, the Showdown coding doesn't account for Def/SpD/Spe as "offensive" boosts. However, if hypothetically such a mechanic were added into Gen 7, I guarantee Unaware would account for it. In fact, the current in-game coding my already account for it, there's just no easy way to check.

The fact the poster two posts above me and a great deal of other people have been confused by the way Unaware is currently working on the server indicate that it's behaving in an unexpected way -- just because the Showdown-written text defines it one way doesn't mean it's a perfect representation of in-game mechanics or the intentions of the OM.
 

Marty

Always more to find
is a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Simulator Administratoris a Programmeris a Super Moderatoris a Top Researcher
Research Leader
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/battle-mechanics-research.3489239/page-48#post-5067683

Foul Play ignores the target's Attack boosts if the target has Unaware, which is not implied by Smogon's description you are quoting. (I wouldn't turn to the Smogon description as a source of likely behavior regardless -it's designed for the least confusion, not the most accuracy)
You don't seem to understand how Foul Play works so allow me to explain it.

All Foul Play does is use your target's Attack stat and Attack stat stage in the damage formula instead of yours. What Unaware does is ignore the attacker's Attack stat stage. This value just so happens to be the Unaware Pokemon's Attack stat stage when it gets hit by Foul Play, so it gets ignored.
Even then, they will provide descriptions that are wrong wrong wrong in practice -Pure Power/Huge Power continue to claim, as the games also claim, that they "double Attack", when the actual behavior would be most accuratly summarized as "Doubles the damage of user's Physical moves". (Diggersby's Foul Play benefits from its Huge Power, for example, where Klefki smacking Mega Medicham only hits it its base 100 Attack, not the functionally more than 250 Attack Pure Power pushes invested/max IV Mega Medicham to)
As for Huge Power and Pure Power, like I said above the only thing Foul Play does is replace the Attack stat and Attack stat stage with the target's. Everything else in the damage formula remains the user's: i.e. the user's Ability, the user's item, and the user's burn. That's why Huge Power Foul Play is better than Foul Play VS a Huge Power target, and why Choice Band Foul Play is better than Foul Play VS a Choice Band target, and why a burned Foul Play does pitiful damage but a Foul Play against a burned target does normal damage.

Anyway, please don't assume my descriptions are wrong. If you think a description is wrong feel free to test it and any related mechanics yourself; there's no need to spread misinformation like this.
Well, is it really a bug? Unaware's description is such: "This Pokemon ignores other Pokemon's Attack, Special Attack, and accuracy stat stages when taking damage, and ignores other Pokemon's Defense, Special Defense, and evasiveness stat stages when dealing damage." So, Unaware doesn't ignore those boosts, according to mechanics. This OM changes move categories; other mechanics (should) remain intact.

Tagging mechanic expert Marty.
You must have tagged me in an edit since I didn't get a notification for this. :(

Having said all of the above, if the idea behind this metagame is that the Attack or Special Attack stat stage is replaced with another stat's while using a move, then Unaware should be ignoring it. Unaware on Showdown actually used to be able to account for such a mechanic until it got refactored. How it was implemented wasn't really important as long as existing and verifiable game mechanics worked properly. I of course am generally a fan of hardcoding certain things directly in the damage formula because that's what I expect Game Freak to have done. Makes a big difference in the case of OMs sometimes.
 
Got Talent Frameworks
Italics = Description
Underline = Role in the Team

Semi-Stall is very nice in this tier because it can utilize 5 Defensive Pokemon that have around 2-3 setup sweepers, and then 1 fast, late game cleaner. It is a very solid strategy in the meta.

(4 Pokemon) Defensive Core(s) / Defensive Backbone - On semi-stall, the majority of the team is Defensive, which allows it to deal with the wide array of threats in the metagame. 4 Pokemon is usually enough to safely check a majority of threats.
Example :
+
+
+
-
This is a snippet of Jajoken's Semi-Stall team that features this pretty nice defensive core that allows it to check / set-up on most teams. The first step of Semi-Stall should be coming up with a solid Defensive Backbone
(1 Pokemon) Support Pokemon - This role is given to the Pokemon so that it can support the rest of the team by providing reliable ways to stop setup sweepers or be a cleric(if you don't already have one
Example :
:
Quagsire is a nice support Pokemon because it provides a reliable check to the majority of prominent setup sweepers. It can also boost to become a huge threat for the opponent. *Note that this role can also be a Pokemon like Support T-Tar
(1 Pokemon) Fast Cleaner / Offensive Pokemon - Because this is Semi-Stall and not full on Stall, usually Semi-Stall has one fast attacker to complement the rest of the slow team.
Example :
-
Sceptile is a great Speed Booster in the game because it can take on a variety of walls with access to blistering speed and a strong physical and special move, it fits on Semi-Stall very well because the defensive Pokemon tend to wear down the opposing team


Stall is certainly a very viable strategy in this tier because of the amount of fat Pokemon like Slowbro and Aggron that can still do ridiculous amounts of damage through either their Defense or Special Defense stat. Usually, the whole team is defensive.
(2-3 Pokemon) Bulky Setup Sweepers - These Pokemon are designed to check other threats in the meta, while boosting and becoming huge threats. There should be around 2-3 of these Pokemon that can check other boosters by boosting along side of them. It gives the team a solid win condition
Examples:
,
,
:
great boosting Pokemon with very high defenses are able to check a majority of the metagame.

(1 Pokemon) Setup Sweeper Check - Since setup sweepers are so prominent, a solid check to these such Unaware Pokemon are very nice for Stall teams to have
Example:
-
Unaware Pokemon are nice for Stall teams and rather mandatory

(2 Pokemon) Bulky Support Pokemon - Pokemon like these provide Wish support, Heal Bell support, hazard support, and other various forms of support that benefit the rest of the team. Usually these roles can be fit into 2 Pokemon

Example:
,
-
Cleric support is super useful for stall teams. Hazards are effective for wearing down the opposing team.
(0-1 Pokemon)Annoyance / Status Spreader - Pokemon that provide Toxic, Encore, Thunder Wave, Taunt, and Knock Off. They have great utility(similar to support but a little more specific)
Example:
,
- These Pokemon provide utility and spread status, while Knocking Off key items. Sableye can also use Taunt to stallbreak opposing teams


Balance is a very strong playstyle, as it is in most every meta. The components are a little more loose and harder to categorize, but I'll try and make it as detailed as I can. It focuses on a balance between offense and defense.
(2-3 Pokemon) Offensive Core - Two or three Pokemon that can complement each other offensively and beat each other's checks
Example:
+
-
These Pokemon make an effective offensive core because Heatran clears out the steel types for Ninjask to clean up
(2-3 Pokemon) Defensive Core - Two or three Pokemon that cover each others weaknesses and can support the offensive teammates by absorbing attacks.
Example:
+
-
although a bit weak to electric type pokemon, Skarmory and Slowbro form an effective defensive core because they cover for the Fire weakness for Skarmory and the Bug weakness for Slowbro
(1-2 Pokemon) Support Pokemon - Pokemon that provide lots of utility and can use it to provide hazards, status, and other useful moves such as Knock Off
Example:
-
Ttar is a great support Pokemon because it has access to great utility moves and hazards. He can also Pursuit trap key threats

(0-1 Pokemon) Patcher - A Pokemon that fills in what you don't have and patches up any weaknesses. Usually they are added to check a specific Pokemon that ravages the rest of the team.


Offense is a little harder to pull off in this metagame, but it can catch opponents off guard and is still very viable
(1 Pokemon) Suicide Lead / Spiker - On offense(mostly hyper offense) Suicide Leads are really good for putting pressure on the opponent via hazards.
Example:
,
,
-
excellent hazard stackers that can get up multiple layers of hazards

(2 Pokemon) Setup Sweepers - Setup sweepers are huge threats in this meta because of how many viable ones there are. They boost their stats to punch holes in the opposing team
Example:
,
-
speed boosters and SpD that can easily sweep unprepared teams

(1-2 Pokemon) Wallbreaker - Wallbreakers are very needed in this meta to run offense because of the abundant amount of stall teams in the tier.
Example:
(scarf) ,
(specs) - Pokemon that can easily rip holes in the opponents team to exploit.

(1-2 Pokemon) Fast Cleaners- Cleaners are used when the whole opponents team is weakened and the cleaners' checks have been sufficiently dealt with.
Example:
,
-
both of these Pokemon are excellent cleaners because of their powerful priority and insanely high speed



tagging nv so he sees this
 
Last edited:
You don't seem to understand how Foul Play works so allow me to explain it.

All Foul Play does is use your target's Attack stat and Attack stat stage in the damage formula instead of yours. What Unaware does is ignore the attacker's Attack stat stage. This value just so happens to be the Unaware Pokemon's Attack stat stage when it gets hit by Foul Play, so it gets ignored.
I'm aware of what Foul Play does. The description does not suggest to the layman the outcome that is happening, as Unaware is effectively ignoring the Unaware's own Attack stages.

As for Huge Power and Pure Power, like I said above the only thing Foul Play does is replace the Attack stat and Attack stat stage with the target's. Everything else in the damage formula remains the user's: i.e. the user's Ability, the user's item, and the user's burn. That's why Huge Power Foul Play is better than Foul Play VS a Huge Power target, and why Choice Band Foul Play is better than Foul Play VS a Choice Band target, and why a burned Foul Play does pitiful damage but a Foul Play against a burned target does normal damage.

Anyway, please don't assume my descriptions are wrong. If you think a description is wrong feel free to test it and any related mechanics yourself; there's no need to spread misinformation like this.
I'm aware that your descriptions are probably describing the internal code logic, but when read by someone who isn't fairly informed of such points (ie most players) the implication of the statement runs contrary to the actual behavior -since Foul Play "uses the target's Attack stat" (With no further explanation or qualification, such as "base Attack and Attack stages only"), the expectation is going to be that anything that claims to modify the Attack stat will in turn interact with Foul Play in the form of "Target has Huge Power? Double damage." when in actuality that's the opposite of what happens.

This is why I say it would be more accurate to say that Huge/Pure Power double the user's damage with Physical attacks -it instantly clarifies that Foul Play is boosted by the user's Huge Power and not the target's Huge Power, without having to dig into the exact code logic to understand why it's accurate to say that Huge Power doubles Attack and yet Foul Play's damage is doubled by the user's Huge Power rather than the target's.

As far as I'm aware there's no benefit to distinguishing between cases that, in code terms, modify Attack vs, in code terms, modify damage on Physical moves without modifying Attack.

Having said all of the above, if the idea behind this metagame is that the Attack or Special Attack stat stage is replaced with another stat's while using a move, then Unaware should be ignoring it. Unaware on Showdown actually used to be able to account for such a mechanic until it got refactored. How it was implemented wasn't really important as long as existing and verifiable game mechanics worked properly. I of course am generally a fan of hardcoding certain things directly in the damage formula because that's what I expect Game Freak to have done. Makes a big difference in the case of OMs sometimes.
Hooray! Unaware is supposed to work!

That makes the meta so much less maddening.

------

We've already got moves organized by category, but not by type.





Blaze Kick, Fire Fang, Flame Charge, Flare Blitz, Searing Shot, V-create



Blast Burn, Blue Flare, Eruption, Fiery Dance, Fire Blast, Fire Pledge, Fire Spin, Flame Burst, Flame Wheel, Flamethrower, Fusion Flare, Heat Wave, Inferno, Mystical Fire, Overheat, Sacred Fire



Fire Punch, Heat Crash, Incinerate, Lava Plume, Magma Storm



Hidden Power Fire



Ember

Fire's Clever and Cute options are limited and terrible besides. Its Tough options are a bit better. Otherwise, Fire moves mostly fall under the usual offensive stats, limiting their appeal. Still, there's a decent pool of Pokemon with Fire Punch and more than 100 Defense.





Aqua Jet, Razor Shell, Water Shuriken



Aqua Tail, Bubble Beam, Dive, Hydro Cannon, Hydro Pump, Origin Pulse, Steam Eruption, Surf, Water Pledge, Water Pulse, Water Spout, Whirlpool



Brine, Clamp, Crabhammer, Muddy Water, Octazooka, Scald, Waterfall



Hidden Power Water



Bubble, Water Gun

Physically durable Water types will tend to be the main form of Water type to watch out for. While most will run Scald for the Burn chance, Physically bulky Water types can often choose whether they want to hit on the Special end or the Physical end.





Bullet Seed, Frenzy Plant, Leaf Blade, Leaf Tornado, Razor Leaf, Solar Beam, Vine Whip



Energy Ball, Grass Pledge, Leaf Storm, Magical Leaf, Petal Blizzard, Petal Dance, Seed Flare



Horn Leech, Power Whip, Seed Bomb, Wood Hammer



Absorb, Giga Drain, Hidden Power Grass, Mega Drain, Needle Arm



Grass Knot

Grass is fairly flexible. Notably, Serperior can still spam Leaf Storm and have it be synergistic -in fact, for most Serperior the main change to their movepool is that they've lost Hidden Power coverage in exchange for the more powerful Aqua Tail, which is actually decent coverage and lets them beat a number of Special walls more rapidly.





Electro Ball, Fusion Bolt, Shock Wave, Spark, Thunder, Thunder Fang, Thunder Punch, Thunder Shock, Thunderbolt, Volt Switch, Volt Tackle, Zap Cannon



Bolt Strike, Charge Beam, Discharge, Electroweb



Wild Charge



Hidden Power Electric, Parabolic Charge



Nuzzle

Electric slants toward the traditional offensive stats (And the exceptions are all weak and/or otherwise flawed), but don't count it out just for that reason -if nothing else, Furfrou carries Wild Charge and uses it with frightening effectiveness.





Ice Fang



Aurora Beam, Avalanche, Blizzard, Freeze Shock, Freeze-Dry, Frost Breath, Glaciate, Ice Ball, Ice Beam, Ice Burn, Ice Punch, Ice Shard, Icicle Crash, Icicle Spear, Icy Wind, Powder Snow



None.



Hidden Power Ice



None.

That's right, if a Pokemon doesn't have either Technician Hidden Power or actually good traditional offensive stats (Or Refrigerate), you can basically assume ice coverage isn't a thing at all.





Precipice Blades



Earth Power, Land's Wrath, Thousand Arrows



Bone Club, Bone Rush, Bonemerang, Bulldoze, Dig, Drill Run, Earthquake, Magnitude, Mud Shot, Thousand Waves



Hidden Power Ground, Sand Tomb



Mud Bomb, Mud-Slap

Ground coverage will usually come from Physically bulky 'mons. Keep in mind Dugtrio using Mud Bomb as a semi-notable exception. Also note that Mud Shot means a Physical wall isn't necessarily adequate against a Tough abuser.





None.



Diamond Storm, Power Gem



Ancient Power, Head Smash, Rock Blast, Rock Slide, Rock Throw, Rock Wrecker, Smack Down, Stone Edge



Hidden Power Rock, Rock Tomb



Rollout

Diamond Storm turning Beautiful is notable for smoothing out Mega Diancie a bit -mixed attacking doesn't mean mixed investment- but overall you should mostly focus on Physically bulky attackers when worrying about Rock types. Don't count out Rock Tomb entirely, though. And of course there are no Cool Rock moves, so Physical glass cannons cannot bring Rock coverage to bear at all!





Gyro Ball, Iron Tail, Magnet Bomb, Metal Burst, Metal Claw, Meteor Mash, Steel Wing



Doom Desire, Flash Cannon, Mirror Shot



Bullet Punch, Heavy Slam, Iron Head



Gear Grind, Hidden Power Steel



None.

Steel is largely unchanged by Got Talent (And Gear Grind's shift is basically a flat downgrade to Klinklang, as if it didn't have trouble as-is), but Bullet Punch and Iron Head being Tough is enough to keep Steel a strongly relevant attacking type. You can still basically assume you don't need to worry about Special Steel coverage outside of the usual exceptions, however. (... excepting Technician Hidden Power, of course)





Extrasensory, Psycho Cut, Psystrike



Mirror Coat, Psybeam, Psyshock



None.



Confusion, Dream Eater, Future Sight, Hidden Power Psychic, Hyperspace Hole, Luster Purge, Mist Ball, Psychic, Psycho Boost, Psywave, Stored Power, Synchronoise, Zen Headbutt



Heart Stamp

Physically bulky 'mons are out of luck if they wanted to run Psychic coverage. Specially bulky are just fine, and in fact a number of Pokemon can straight-up replace Calm Mind with Cosmic Power and pull ahead compared to Standard. Stored Power Sigilyph is particularly happy, regardless of the fact that its Special Attack is higher than its Special Defense -it usually runs Cosmic Power anyway.

Note from an Ubers perspective that Psycho Boost has been shifted to Special Defense, and therefore has no disadvantage at all!





Phantom Force, Shadow Claw, Shadow Force



Ominous Wind



None.



Hex, Hidden Power Ghost, Shadow Ball, Shadow Punch, Shadow Sneak



Astonish, Lick

Watch out for Specially bulky Ghost coverage. Eviolite Dusclops can sweep a team with just Shadow Sneak if you're really badly prepared, and Ghosts are often able to go mixed just on the basis of STAB. On the other hand, outside of Clever abusers, Ghost is incredibly awful, and doesn't even have a Tough move.





Dark Pulse, Night Daze, Night Slash, Punishment



None.



Bite, Crunch, Hyperspace Fury, Payback, Snarl, Thief



Assurance, Beat Up, Feint Attack, Foul Play (Does it still use the target's Attack? If so, this doesn't matter), Hidden Power Dark, Knock Off, Pursuit, Sucker Punch



Fling (Note

Dark is very relevant, though Hoopa-Unbound has had its favorite STAB crippled. There's several good Clever abusers and a decent pool of Tough abusers. There's no Beautiful Dark moves at all, though this isn't that bad a flaw since using Attack or Special Attack is generally undesirable anyway. Note in particular that Sucker Punch+Pursuit still runs off the same stat, making that very threatening combination still very threatening. Since Ghosts and Psychic types don't even have Tough STABs, the fact that it hits on Defense is even very workable against a number of those cases -they're liable to prioritize Special Defense over Defense anyway.





Brick Break, Circle Throw, Cross Chop, Double Kick, Dynamic Punch, Focus Blast, Force Palm, High Jump Kick, Jump Kick, Mach Punch, Reversal, Rolling Kick, Sacred Sword, Sky Uppercut, Storm Throw, Submission, Triple Kick, Vacuum Wave, Vital Throw



Aura Sphere, Secret Sword



Arm Thrust, Close Combat, Drain Punch, Flying Press, Focus Punch, Hammer Arm, Karate Chop, Low Kick, Power-Up Punch, Revenge, Rock Smash, Superpower, Wake-Up Slap



Hidden Power Fighting, Low Sweep



None.

Close Combat is essentially inferior to Superpower 99% of the time, as they both lower their own damage output while Superpower keeps your Special Defense intact and actually protects you against the likes of Confusion damage. Power-Up Punch no longer improves itself, making it much less threatening. There's a fair few Tough Fighting abusers, overall, and there's at least one good Clever Fighting abuser -Scrafty has 115 Special Defense, Amnesia, Low Sweep, and Knock Off, which is actually more threatening than its base 90 Attack and access to Bulk Up. (No equivalent to Dragon Dance is unfortunate, though) There's nothing to fear from Cute abusers, in terms of Fighting moves. Period.





Fell Stinger, Fury Cutter, Megahorn, Pin Missile, Twineedle, X-Scissor



Bug Buzz, Signal Beam, Silver Wind



Steamroller



Attack Order, Hidden Power Bug, Leech Life



Bug Bite, Infestation, Struggle Bug, U-turn

Theoretically Vespiquen gets a new lease on life now that its STAB benefits from Defend Order, but...

In practice, the main thing worth noting about Bug is that U-Turn and Bug Bite run off of Speed. This has already been abused to extensive effect on Ninjask by various people, but in general U-Turn moving to Speed tends to represent an improvement to Scarf U-Turn builds. (It hurts slow U-Turn, admittedly, but it's difficult to get slow U-Turn normally anyway)





Cross Poison



Acid Spray, Clear Smog, Venoshock



Belch, Gunk Shot, Poison Jab, Sludge, Sludge Bomb, Sludge Wave, Smog



Acid, Hidden Power Poison, Poison Fang, Poison Sting, Poison Tail



None.

The main thing to note is that Tough Poison is fairly good, and can hit on either end of the defensive spectrum. It's unfortunate Acid Spray isn't, say, Clever. Clever Poison is... passable... though without Technician it's weak.





Acrobatics, Aerial Ace, Aeroblast, Air Cutter, Air Slash, Brave Bird, Drill Peck, Oblivion Wing, Peck, Sky Attack, Wing Attack



Dragon Ascent



Hurricane, Sky Drop



Fly, Gust, Hidden Power Flying



Bounce, Chatter, Pluck

Flying falls badly behind most types, and in a lot of ways is actively hurt by Got Talent. Hurricane, for instance, is found on nothing with 100 or more Defense -where Mega Pidgeot has 135 Special Attack to work with in Standard. Similarly, Air Slash paraflinchhax from Togekiss is just flat-out weakened. Etc.

No wonder I'm not really seeing Flying types on teams.





Dragon Breath, Dragon Claw, Outrage, Twister



Draco Meteor, Dragon Pulse, Roar of Time, Spacial Rend



Dragon Rush, Dragon Tail, Dual Chop



Hidden Power Dragon



None.

Dragon is barely changed at all -it doesn't even get Draco Meteor moved to something other than Beautiful. Probably the most notable thing is Dragon Tail moving to Tough, enhancing its damage on the various Physically bulky walls that like to run it anyway.





None.



Dazzling Gleam, Fairy Wind, Light of Ruin, Moonblast



None.



None.



Disarming Voice, Draining Kiss, Play Rough

Fairy's only actual change is moving a handful of moves to Speed-based. This... is largely not a good thing. Belly Drum Unburden Slurpuff, for instance, has lost more than half its STAB damage, and its Cute options are fairly mediocre in general. I guess Dedenne is happy with the change...

If it weren't for Mega Altaria's Pixilate, Fairy would be borderline meta-irrelevant as an attacking type.





Crush Claw, Cut, Double Hit, Extreme Speed, False Swipe, Fury Attack, Hold Back, Horn Attack, Hyper Beam, Hyper Fang, Hyper Voice, Mega Kick, Quick Attack, Rapid Spin, Razor Wind, Retaliate, Slash, Sonic Boom, Spike Cannon, Swift, Techno Blast, Trump Card



Echoed Voice, Explosion, Judgment, Relic Song, Round, Self-Destruct, Tri Attack, Weather Ball



Bide, Bind, Body Slam, Boomburst, Chip Away, Comet Punch, Constrict, Crush Grip, Double-Edge, Fury Swipes, Giga Impact, Head Charge, Headbutt, Mega Punch, Pound, Rage, Rock Climb, Scratch, Skull Bash, Slam, Smelling Salts, Spit Up, Stomp, Strength, Struggle, Tackle, Take Down, Thrash, Vice Grip, Wrap, Wring Out



Feint, Hidden Power, Natural Gift, Pay Day, Secret Power



Barrage, Covet, Dizzy Punch, Double Slap, Egg Bomb, Facade, Fake Out, Flail, Frustration, Last Resort, Present, Return, Snore, Tail Slap, Uproar

Hey, that silly Fake Out+Last Resort Ambipom gimmick is marginally stronger. Also note that Explosion Gengar is actually threatening. Note that most any Physically bulky or high Speed Pokemon can break out good Normal damage.


Also, in case you were wondering about increased priority moves in specific...



Aqua Jet, Extreme Speed, Mach Punch, Quick Attack, Vacuum Wave, Water Shuriken



Ice Shard



Bullet Punch



Feint, Shadow Sneak, Sucker Punch



Fake Out

Every category has some priority, though Cute is restricted to Fake Out. Ice Shard Glaceon is the hardest-hitting Ice Shard without turning to a Mega. (Mega Abomasnow) So that's interesting.
 

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