Project Old Gen Hackmons Megathread

[Electra102]

My first impressions of gen4ph​

Hai! I haven’t made a post on the forums in a while, so I decided to make one about one of my new favorite metas: gen4 Pure Hackmons. I’ve had a lot of fun with it so far, and I wanted to give my first impressions on it as a meta, what I think is good, what are some problems, and so forth. I'm also providing a team near the end, if you want to see that.

The Pokemon​

Deoxys-Speed​

Ever since I became serious about Pure Hackmons, I’ve seen this thing as extremely mid. When I started playing gen 5, I learned how deadly this thing used to be, and it is still extremely dangerous in gen4. The mere existence of No Guard + Sheer Cold ensures that most good teams will have at least one non-Ice-weak Wonder Guard on it, and Gastro Acid makes at least two of these near-required. If you run TrickScarf, you can shut down one of these Wonder Guards, unless they carry Mail. This interaction made me realize something that could be extremely important for this meta, though I’m going to dedicate an entire section to this later (look at “TrickScarf No Guard Baton Passer + Shadow Tag” if you want to skip ahead). I’ve used TrickScarf Deoxys-Speed as my dedicated lead on both of my serious teams (Double Lati Sun HO and Triple Latios Rain), and this thing works wonders. I’ll provide my set below:

Deoxys-Speed @ Choice Scarf
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
Timid Nature
- Baton Pass
- Sheer Cold
- Trick
- Gastro Acid

When you lead with this, you have one of two options (in most cases): Baton Pass out or click Sheer Cold. If you know how your opponent tends to play against this, you can either call the switch to a Wonder Guard and Baton Pass into the appropriate Pokemon to pressure it, or you can click Sheer Cold and potentially nail their lead (which tends to be a weather setter, from my experience). If you call the switch to a Wonder Guard, you can also Trick it your scarf, unless it has Mail. If this set becomes popular, I can see some counterplay to it. Unfortunately, I found that a Shadow Tag lead will not be able to guarantee a KO on it. I’ll provide some calcs below.

252+ Atk Silk Scarf Slaking Fake Out vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252 Def Deoxys-Speed: 85-102 (28 - 33.6%) -- 0.2% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Silk Scarf Slaking Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252 Def Deoxys-Speed: 169-201 (55.7 - 66.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(Shadow Tag Slaking HAS to get at least one crit or max rolls on both Fake Out AND Extreme Speed in order to KO, and this can be avoided if Deoxys-Speed simply runs max HP instead of 248/31 or 252/30)

252+ Atk Griseous Orb Giratina-Origin Shadow Sneak vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252 Def Deoxys-Speed: 138-164 (45.5 - 54.1%) -- 42.2% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Griseous Orb Giratina-Origin Shadow Sneak vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252 Def Deoxys-Speed on a critical hit: 278-330 (91.7 - 108.9%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
(Giratina-Origin needs a crit in order to KO, and it needs Fake Out or Choice Band in order to guarantee the KO)

Slaking vs Regigigas​

…it depends. In my opinion, Latios is one of the most important offensive Pokemon in the format, and being able to take its attacks better does give Regigigas a niche. However, Fire Fang is essentially required on Huge Powers, and Slaking is able to take them better than Regigigas. I guess it depends on what is more important for you. On a Rain stall team, Regigigas is probably better, since the Rain will make up for the extra Fire Fang damage Regigigas will be taking. On Sun or Sand, I would assume Slaking would be better, since Fire Fang will be dealing either normal damage or 1.5x damage, making the extra physical bulk more worthwhile.

252+ Atk Huge Power Giratina-Origin Fire Fang vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252+ Def Regigigas: 100-118 (23.6 - 27.8%) -- 86.4% chance to 4HKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Giratina-Origin Fire Fang vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252+ Def Regigigas in Sun: 149-176 (35.2 - 41.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

252+ Atk Huge Power Giratina-Origin Fire Fang vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252+ Def Slaking: 106-125 (21 - 24.8%) -- guaranteed 5HKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Giratina-Origin Fire Fang vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252+ Def Slaking in Sun: 158-186 (31.4 - 36.9%) -- 78% chance to 3HKO

252+ Atk Huge Power Giratina-Origin Fire Fang vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252+ Def Arceus: 94-111 (21.2 - 25%) -- 0.1% chance to 4HKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Giratina-Origin Fire Fang vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252+ Def Arceus in Sun: 140-165 (31.6 - 37.2%) -- 84.5% chance to 3HKO

Latios​

I’ve run four sets so far on Latios- two Mold Breaker sets, one weather setting set, and one Shadow Tag set. The Shadow Tag set is probably one of the sets I’m most proud of so far. The idea behind it is that you trap and KO Fire Fang walls that made the mistake of not running Shed Shell. The set will be provided below:

Latios @ Soul Dew
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
Modest / Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Seed Flare / Grass Knot
- Focus Blast
- U-Turn / Fire Blast / Earth Power / Surf / Whatever the hell you want

Modest lets you hit things harder, while Timid lets you outspeed non-252+ Spe Arceus sets. Grass Knot will always OHKO Swampert, though Focus Blast is always a 2HKO on Arceus regardless of the nature.

252 SpA Soul Dew Latios Focus Blast vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252+ SpD Arceus: 248-294 (55.9 - 66.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Soul Dew Latios Focus Blast vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252 SpD Arceus: 300-354 (67.7 - 79.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 SpA Soul Dew Latios Grass Knot (80 BP) vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252+ SpD Swampert: 408-480 (101.2 - 119.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

This set is designed to hit as many important Fire Fang-walling Wonder Guards as possible. Draco Meteor provides STAB and hits Palkia. Seed Flare/Grass Knot hits Swampert, Regirock, Relicanth (though Focus Blast does more to Relicanth than Grass Knot), Kyogre, and Suicune. Focus Blast mainly hits Arceus, though it also hits Probopass, Regigigas, Slaking, Registeel, Dialga, Blissey, and most importantly, Magcargo. The last moveslot is up to you. I used to run U-Turn, but then I remembered that Shadow Tags can’t be trapped by other Shadow Tags starting in gen4. Fire Blast will get a boost in Sun, and hits Scizor, Jirachi, and I guess Heracross. Surf gets a boost in Rain, but only uniquely hits Camerupt (though you also hit Magcargo harder and more reliably). Earth Power provides the most additional coverage (seven new targets), hitting Jirachi, Gengar, Probopass more reliably than Focus Blast, Electrode, Tentacruel, Raikou, Jolteon, Camerupt, and Drapion (and you also hit Magcargo for more damage and more reliably than Focus Blast).

Magcargo​

The only niche I can see for this thing is being a Wonder Guard that takes ¼ damage from Fire Fang. We have Palkia for this, but idk, maybe you don’t want the Dragon weakness and are fine with a 4x weakness to Water and Ground and a 2x weakness to Fighting while being Stealth Rock weak. Up to you, I guess.

Strategies​

TrickScarf No Guard Baton Passer + Shadow Tag​

As you can probably guess from my previous sections, I tend to use Deoxys-Speed and Latios for this strategy, but other Pokemon could also work for this (maybe No Guard Aerodactyl and/or Shadow Tag Rayquaza?). I believe this strategy to be the key to my decent success in this format. It essentially boils down to a few interactions in-battle-

1. Lead with your No Guard
2. Make a prediction
   1. Opponent switches: Baton Pass to your Shadow Tag, trap, and KO
   2. Opponent stays in: OHKO with Sheer Cold

I can see a few ways this can be beaten, but I’m going to let you all come up with your own ideas. Shed Shell is not 100% reliable, because of the TrickScarf, and you will need to switch to something that is going to take the hit. If you run Mail instead of Shed Shell, you may block the TrickScarf, but then you run into the same problem as before- being trapped.

You can take this strategy a step further by adding a Fire Fang sweeper to the team. The Shadow Tag can remove the Fire Fang walls, the No Guard can remove Flash Fires and other annoying walls, and the Fire Fang sweeper (I tend to use Huge Power Giratina-Origin) can KO anything left. I’ve used this entire strategy on my team Double Lati Sun HO, which I will be providing later.

Leads​

I don’t know how hot of a take this is, but I don’t think leads are always the best for setting weather. In my opinion, it is sometimes better to lead with a Deoxys-Speed, make the turn one prediction, and set weather later, when it is more convenient. Leads that set weather run the risk of being trapped and/or OHKOed, which will leave your opponent free to permanently keep their own weather up.

I also don’t think the current weather leads are the best options, save for maybe Probopass with Sand. I’m currently experimenting with a weather-setting Deoxys-Speed lead for a Sun team I’m working on (and still need to test). I think Latias works fine for setting Sun, I just really like Deoxys-Speed leads. Venusaur I do not like, however. To be honest, I still need to give it a try, but I was able to use Latios to set Rain over it on my triple Latios team, and it worked well for me. As for Probopass… I can’t think of anything better. My only ideas (other than Deoxys-Speed) are Regirock, which probably wants Wonder Guard more (double Regirock team?), and Rhyperior, which… might be worth trying, to be honest.
If you were to ask me what the best kind of lead is, I would say TrickScarf + Baton Pass No Guards. Combined with a trapper, these things can almost guarantee a KO early on, sometimes on the opponent’s weather setter.

Now for the team-​

My team- Double Lati + Sun HO​

https://pokepast.es/cc3b2e58bf079115
This next section will function as both a RMT and as a sample team submission​

Teambuilding process​

Deoxys-Speed @ Choice Scarf
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Trick
- Sheer Cold
- Baton Pass
- Gastro Acid​

When starting this team, I expected to see Deoxys-Speed leads everywhere. I wanted my lead to be able to beat them, thus the Choice Scarf. I also expected that any player who knows what Deoxys-Speed does would immediately switch to a Wonder Guard upon seeing it, so I decided to pair it with my newly-created Shadow Tag Latios set, and gave Deoxys-Speed Baton Pass (U-Turn would be blocked by Wonder Guard, and Parting Shot/Volt Switch don’t exist yet). Sheer Cold was an obvious choice for No Guard, though you could replace it with Fissure to hit several Wonder Guards (Regirock, Jirachi, Dialga, etc.) at the price of no longer threatening Flash Fire Skarmory. Next came Gastro Acid and Trick. Trick not only allows Deoxys-Speed to remove the Shed Shell of a Wonder Guard, but it also frees it from the Choice Scarf, allowing Deoxys-Speed to become a dangerous late-game threat.

Latios (M) @ Soul Dew
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Seed Flare / Grass Knot
- Draco Meteor
- Focus Blast
- U-turn / Earth Power​

I believe I next added this set, a Shadow Tag Latios set that is designed to trap and KO as many Fire Fang walls as I can. I’ve already explained my choices on the moveset, but just as a reminder- Seed Flare for Swampert/Relicanth/Regirock, Draco Meteor for Palkia, and Focus Blast for Arceus. U-Turn I ended up replacing with Earth Power, though U-Turn did come in handy in one match.

Latias (F) @ Soul Dew
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Draco Meteor
- U-turn
- Stealth Rock
- Spore​

I needed a sun setter, so I decided on the only one I was aware of at the time- Latias. To be honest, I wasn’t exactly sure what I should run on it, so I mainly stole the set from the sun sample team. The set works well, though i wonder if Latias might like a recovery move.

Slaking @ Lum Berry
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Belly Drum
- Fire Fang
- Extreme Speed
- Spore​

When I was making this team, I was planning for Deoxys-Speed. I didn’t think I could fit a second Wonder Guard, so I tried to make a Wonder Guard that could beat Deoxys-Speed offensively. The idea was that when Deoxys-Speed tries to Gastro Acid or Spore Slaking, it uses Belly Drum, and then I KO with Extreme Speed. Even if Deoxys-Speed has a Focus Sash, Giratina-Origin would be able to come in and either force it out or KO it with Shadow Sneak. Spore I threw on so I could break through some walls more easily, and Fire Fang is there so I don’t get hard walled by a Wonder Guard.

Giratina-Origin @ Griseous Orb
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Shadow Sneak
- Fire Fang
- Dragon Claw
- Dragon Dance​

Another set I stole from a sample team, and I’m glad I did. Despite resisting both of Giratina-Origin’s STABs, Giratina-Origin can still 2HKO after two or three Dragon Dances, which aren’t that hard to get if you play well. Shadow Sneak serves not only as STAB but as a backup Deoxys-Speed killer.

Ho-Oh @ Salac Berry
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum / Dragon Dance
- Substitute
- Fire Fang
- Flare Blitz / Volt Tackle​

Probably my weakest set here. Magic Guard is nice to have, but I think I executed it badly. Having only Fire moves for coverage means this set is walled by Flash Fires. If I were to do it again, I would probably drop Ho-Oh and replace it with a second Wonder Guard with Rapid Spin. I’m hoping that if this team becomes a sample, a new player can use it to learn to spot weaknesses in their teams.

Weaknesses/Problems​

Sand​

Unless I can remove the Sand setter quickly, Sand kind of dunks on this team. Only Ho-Oh is immune to sand, and nothing has recovery, so you kind of have to blast through the team or you get slowly worn down. What's worse is that Rock-types get a 1.5x boost to their Special Defense in Sand, which makes my main form of wall removal, Latios, have an even harder time with trapping and KOing key targets.

Hazards​

The main counterplay this team has to hazards is punishing the hazard setter and trying to break through everything else as fast as possible, since the team lacks a Rapid Spinner and any sort of recovery. Toxic Spikes are especially bad for this team, especially when combined with Sand.

/

Skarmory/Flash Fire Scizor​

If they run Shed Shell, Latios can’t trap them, and Tricking them a Choice Scarf is far from guaranteed, considering Skarmory/Flash Fire Scizor do not want to stay in on Deoxys-Speed and risk getting OHKOed by Sheer Cold. They both resist Extreme Speed from Slaking, completely wall Ho-Oh, resist both of Giratina-Origin’s STABs, and aren’t weak to anything from Latios. My best hope is to start steamrolling with Deoxys-Speed, and hope they decide to sacrifice their biggest wall to my team.

Gyarados​

My main form of Fire Fang wall removal, Latios, isn’t able to hit Gyarados. All I can really do is try my best to rack up Stealth Rock chip and land a Fire Fang with enough boosts. Luckily for me, I haven’t seen a single Gyarados yet, but if this format becomes more popular, I would expect to see one before long.

Giratina-Origin​

If this thing sets up enough to outspeed and/or KO Deoxys-Speed with Shadow Sneak, I'm pretty much done for. My only hope would be to Spore it with Slaking, switch to something else, and KO it.

Replays​

Win versus sussyamongusdrip, who was piloting the Sand sample team
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen4anythinggoes-2251814888

Win versus IReallyDontKnowlol, who was piloting the Sun sample team
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen4anythinggoes-2251224442

Win versus Ransei, who was piloting a custom-made Sand team
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen4anythinggoes-2247353074

Loss versus future king of ou, who was piloting the Sand sample team. This replay really shows how this team struggles against hazards and Sand
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen4anythinggoes-2252413783

Loss versus AV Cosmoem, who was piloting a custom-made Sand team. This replay also shows the team’s weakness to Sand and hazards.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen4customgame-2252420011-b56pdqvxoe2q7tiof58mfo5q2ui1dltpw?p2​

Final thoughts​

This format sounds like it has a lot of potential, and I can see myself putting in more time into it, assuming I get more battles. Sleep and entry hazards are obvious problems that this format has, but I think they can be worked around. I’m also planning on making a personal VR for this format, which should be out in a few days or so (might be earlier).

Thank you for reading this post, and I hope this inspires some more people to give this format a chance.
-electra​

 

[adriancosmoem]

hey it's av cosmoem. i've been building a few teams for adv and discovering new ideas. i want to share, though they've only been able to be put into practice a couple times, so they won't be perfect. also these aren't tested enough to be samples so none of these are submissions


current offense sample is really bad so i tried to make a better ho team. i wanted to make a team that was just very default, but ended up running some substandard sets anyway because it's ph and niche is the game. jask is the lead because it's jask lol, this mon is broken. standard set because like i said, i wanted to make a "normal" team. the 2 slak are there to get passed speed and win the game. i just ran the 2 normal variants (cc sball and cc spore) because they're broken. kyogre counters every slak check except like groudon in sun, who will die if he's not in sun or if he's not at full hp, so this addition was a no brainer. tg could sweep with jask support but i chose to run surftalk because it has a way stronger matchup against opposing offense and can't get interrupted by spore gar. it also gives an out against aero/ttar lead with more longevity than tg due to lefties. subpass is too slow for offense so i chose to run bd instead. this set always threatens the reverse sweep against +6 slak which nothing else can really do. it also answers all +0 spe slak without compromising momentum. another mon that threatens balance hard and answers all the slak checks, except for some fringe lugia sets. this set runs milk drink over spore or talk to switch in on kyogre at no cost which makes the matchup against other offense a lot easier.


wanted to try banette because it has a lot of good qualities. its stats suck really bad so i decided to make back jask offense to support it. the end result seems to be pretty good. this banette is really anti-offense. it's only built to 1v1 most leads in the first two turns. t1 imprison will always stop lead jask from passing speed and it will also stop slak from doing anything since it disables sball and it's immune to spore because of insomnia. cc lets it beat ttar lead and stab sball lets it beat psychic leads. the only offense lead it's not winning the 1v1 against is aero. it can also be a slak check midgame with jask support. back jask is so the team can actually take advantage of bane's anti-lead qualities. jask can pass to bane and then bane can pass to a sweeper to stop slak from interrupting speed passes with espeed, or just to let bane get some kills since it has an attack boosting nature and stab sball hits hard. the 2 slak are there to get passed speed and win the game. it's just the same as before. tg latios beats all of the slak checks which is why it's here. this team doesn't need latios to have longevity for other offense since bane already provides enough anti-offense value, so it runs spore instead to set up and sweep easier. gross is a one-time slak check for when bane isn't available. +1 cc will always kill slak after bd and talk makes sure that slak can't bypass gross with spore. the other moves can't be called by talk and you won't usually use them, but assist lets you spore sometimes


this was me trying to make a cool ogre set work. this team is probably really hard to use because of slak matchup but every member can immediately threaten especially if lum is still active, so it should work out. deo-a lead isn't really hyperfocused on beating jask like deo-s lead. instead it just uses high power to threaten and kill stuff. if you wanna use band, then band blast will ohko aero, but lum gives you a way better jask mu so i like to run that instead. i still can't decide on last move, espeed is good for to revenge slak and chip jask, and cc ohkoes lead ttar to stop him from pursuiting you. this is a demon set that will own people who are lazy with their anti-ogre measures. after even one acid armor, +6 slak espeed only does about 70%. resttalk stops you from losing to toxic and also ensures that ww steels lose long term. this mon can remove steels and latis. taunt prevents whirlwind and spore, and haze prevents tg and bd. removing latis is essential to let kyogre sweep, and removing steels is very helpful for the slaks. one of these slak is cc explode which is a secondary option to remove opposing slak and steels immediately. both slaks lose to gar, but gar really has no hope to do anything in this mu with ogre and mewtwo around, and it can also be revenged by deo-a or just countered outright if it lacks sball. tg boltbeam beats ogre-lati-gar cores that are popular on offense. mewtwo is chosen to outspeed gar and latis instead of tying. also lum is helpful since you can get a free tg without worrying about spore.


i wanted to use deo-s because it seemed like it could enable offense while being an anti-offense lead. i also wanted to run lugia because it was definitely good but i didn't have any teams with it. similar to banette where it's designed to 1v1 leads, except it can use a fast explosion which makes it really scary. t1 agility t2 blast will pretty much always beat jask, unless they get a double protect or you get 2 hits. i put band slak to take advantage of deo-s stopping speedpass, so you don't have to worry about random tg sweepers stopping you. people usually run trick over cc but band espeed is important speed control on this team. with no speedpass, lugia runs over offense, especially if ogre is removed. dd taunt makes it basically immune to spore, and also stops setup sweepers. lefties and pressure and its natural bulk make it super fat even though it's weak to blast and sball. taunt has a massive 32 pp so with pressure it will always win long term. revenge killing is basically impossible, even band espeed from slak only 3hkoes. it can even beat steels, since skarm counter will never do more than 50%. drill peck over aeroblast for pp. i decided to run tg 3 attacks to beat latis and other ogre. this not only clears kyogre's walls, it also paves the way for lugia. i didn't feel like sleep absorb was necessary for this team due to lugia and gar. the usual subpass set but with agility over spore. added this to let slak and ogre sweep. plus i don't really think encore spore sub bp is a good set anyway


i was building too much offense and the current stall sample is kinda bad and loses to ogre and latis, so i wanted to make another stall. i also wanted to build around blissey because it had potential. i think any good stall is gonna use ttar, sand is too broken to not take advantage of. 3 of the mons on this team are immune to sand and 1 of the non-immune mons has lefties, so we're always in a good position. sheer cold is because pursuit is only really good against like deo-a and doesn't damage anything else. i figured it was worth it to take potshots since ttar is bulky. unfortunately some of the good mons (skarm and agg) get sturdy. stops ogre and latis from doing anything, alongside every other special attacker. but it's here for those two. it beats basically every variant of ogre and latis except for the ones that cteam blissey like tg mono resttalk, which people won't run anyway because who wants to cteam blissey? natural cure lets it run lefties over lum, though it also has sleep talk to stay in against spore latis which are common. best spiker and probably best phys wall in general. it can actually tank +6 slak espeed without resisting which is wild, and it obviously doesn't lose to cc. liechi is an option over lum since +1 eq ohkoes slak after bd and 1 round of sand, but don isn't always gonna be at full hp and i have several other slak checks so i didn't bother. cross chop ohkoes slak after 2 rounds of sand which sets up a favorable trade. one has ww in case you get slept so sleep talk has a 2/3 to call an option that takes slak out of commission. one has sball to 1v1 psychics and gar. you could definitely run liechi like don, but again i chose not to cause with sand up, slak will die anyway. there are 2 metagross to strengthen the slak and psychic matchups. beats ogre and don and outputs a lot of pressure with dclaw alone. latias is a spinner that's immune to spikes and beats the best spiker, so it's important to keep this alive to win both the hazards and weather war against don teams. it also ensures that ogre will never make progress, since even if one of blissey / latias gets removed via trapping, explosion, hax etc. the other will still wall ogre.

also found a couple of mons and sets that could work out well. i didn't get to fit them into any teams though.


Ninjask @ Lum Berry
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Rock Blast
- Protect
- Baton Pass
- Imprison

prevents rock blast from opposing leads so you can pass speed t2. also beats opposing jask sometimes. lum over lefties since sub can't protect you from spore. 100% the inferior set to standard because spore and sub are very important moves you're missing out on, and you have to run protect to guarantee +1 speed pass. but it cteams the cteam


Medicham @ Lum Berry
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly / Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Cross Chop
- Mach Punch
- Shadow Ball / Extreme Speed / Rock Blast / Spore

ok this mon is bad. BUT +6 cc ohkoes every last slak check and it resists cc and blast. so if you pass speed and sub to this it probably wins. but +6 mach punch 2hkoes a lot of stuff insead of ohkoing it which is why this mon is bad


Shuckle @ Lum Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
- Whirlwind
- Soft-Boiled
- Rapid Spin
- Sleep Talk

shuckle is a slak check that can also spin on spiker don. i thought about adding it to the sand stall team but i had the space to run a 2nd metagross and latias separately, and shuckle also loses to dd blast don. but it's honestly probably worth it on some stall out there. just not the one i wanted to build

thanks for reading

 

[Electra102]

My personal gen4ph viability rankings​

Hai! I said I promised I would have this ready by around this time, and I finally finished it. All placements are based mostly on either my opinion and/or speculation. All placements are subject to change. Also, only the Pokemon in the S tier are ranked within the tier- the rest are not.

S tier​

S​

Deoxys-Speed- May be controversial, but I’m rather confident that this is number one. It is the best No Guard, though it could theoretically run several other abilities- I’ve heard of/thought of Wonder Guard, Chlorophyll/Swift Swim, Drizzle/Drought/Snow Warning/Sand Stream, and maybe Magic Guard. No Guard is where it shines best, though. The main things that hold it back are its vulnerability to priority, U-Turn weakness, and how easy it is at times to chip it down (since it can’t fit recovery). Despite that, I am shocked this thing isn’t used far more often than it is.

Arceus- The best Wonder Guard. Its bulk is amazing, and everyone knows it. I’ve learned that you shouldn’t plan on OHKOing it, unless it is with No Guard. Unfortunately for Arceus, while it is amazing at taking a hit, it is not that hard to 2HKO it, so you can just break it by putting it to sleep first. The existence of Arceus also makes Fighting coverage necessary on Shadow Tags, which does

Giratina-Origin- This thing can be a monster, but it needs time to set up. STAB Shadow Sneak can shred Deoxys-Speed, the Lati twins, and other Giratinas. It also gets Dragon STAB, which is unresisted by anything that isn’t Steel-type, and can nail Palkia trying to wall Fire Fang. Griseous Orb also gives it a 1.2x boost to its STABs, and it makes it so Giratina-Origin can’t be Tricked anything. Once this thing gets going, there’s not much that can stop it, and it can be paired with a Shadow Tag to remove any annoying walls before it attempts the sweep. Incredibly good choice, especially since it can adapt to fit on any kind of weather team (Huge Power for Sun, Magic Guard for Sand, and Mold Breaker for Rain).

S-​

Latios- Latios is a dragon of many talents. It is a great Shadow Tagger, it works well with Mold Breaker, it can even set weather or serve as a No Guard. It is terrified of being trapped, so you can’t always just click buttons with it and win. The U-Turn weakness also sucks, so Shadow Tag especially needs to be wary of it. Overall, I think this thing is a bit underrated if anything, but I’m not sure if it is quite on par with the S tier

---

A tier​

A+​

Latias- Bulkier than Latios, but doesn’t hit as hard. Seems like it works better than Latios as a weather setter, but any other role it can do is probably just done better by Latios. Still a very solid choice, even if it is outclassed in most roles.

Rayquaza- The main Shadow Tag user (no, it wasn’t Latios). Unlike Latios, it can run Physical coverage or go mixed, granting it more options on its coverage. Fighting/Dragon/Ground/Grass is possible both physically and specially, and Rayquaza also has a nice Spikes and Toxic Spikes immunity, along with resisting U-Turn (unlike Latios, who is weak to it). It is Stealth Rock weak, which hurts it a bit, but it is still a very solid choice for a Shadow Tag user. It could also theoretically function with Mold Breaker, Magic Guard, or maybe Huge Power, but that is just speculation from me.

Slaking- Takes physical hits slightly better than Arceus, and trades 20 points in Speed for 40 points in Attack, making it much more threatening offensively. However, unless you really need that extra Attack, Arceus is probably better nine times out of ten, especially since Slaking takes special hits far worse than Arceus.

Regigigas- Slaking but worse against Fire Fang. On paper it would take hits from Latios better, but I’m not sure how important that actually is. Might work better than Slaking on a Rain team, where Fire Fang is weaker.

Skarmory- Seems like the standard Flash Fire user. Works well from what I have seen, especially since it resists both of Giratina-Origin’s STABs, but it is far from invulnerable, and Giratina-Origin can break through with enough boosts. Also requires special coverage if you want to deal super effective damage against it, only being weak to Electric if it has Flash Fire.

Gyarados- Interesting Wonder Guard. It is Stealth Rock weak, but it resists Fire Fang, and isn’t weak to Ice, Dragon, or Ghost. You also need to run either Electric or Rock coverage on your Shadow Tag in order to trap and KO it, and Electric overlaps badly with Grass coverage, which is needed to hit Swampert. The only new targets you hit with Electric are Tentacruel (which is already weak to Ground) and Skarmory (not a Wonder Guard).

A​

Ho-Oh- Can run Huge Power or Magic Guard, but you know why it needs Magic Guard so badly. Taking 50% from Stealth Rock otherwise makes Ho-Oh’s sets rather predictable at times, but it is still a very solid choice, with STAB Fire Fang, decent bulk, and decent offensive stats, allowing it to function as a semi-bulky setup sweeper. I can see this thing staying popular for the foreseeable future.

Dialga- Steel-type Wonder Guard that isn’t weak to Fire Fang. The Ground and Fighting weaknesses aren’t great, but Dialga does get STAB on Draco Meteor, allowing it to threaten out Giratina-Origin. Very solid choice for a Wonder Guard, and can function well on either Sand or Rain.

Palkia- If you want a Wonder Guard that takes 1/4 damage from Fire Fang, this is almost always your best choice. Its only weakness is Dragon, but Dragon is one of Giratina-Origin’s STABs, so you need to be wary of that. Dragon STAB is also nice for Palkia, making a safe switch hard for Shadow Tag Latios and Rayquaza. Overall very good, and the quartered damage it takes from Fire Fang could come in very handy on a Sun team. I also think Palkia could be a decent Mold Breaker, since so little resists its Spacial Rend, and what does resist it can be hit with Palkia’s Water STAB.

Swampert- A Fire Fang-resisting Wonder Guard that I expected to see more of. Its only weakness is to Grass, but any decent special Shadow Tag (such as Latios) is likely going to run Grass coverage just for it. Compared to Gyarados, it trades the Spikes/Toxic Spikes immunity for a Stealth Rock resistance, which could be worth it if you have a Toxic Spikes absorber. It also takes Fire Fangs better than Gyarados, so I guess which one you use depends on how well your team handles hazards. If you can remove Spikes and Toxic Spikes easily, Swampert may be the better choice, but otherwise Gyarados’ immunity to both is probably more worthwhile.

Deoxys-Attack- The definition of a glass cannon. Its Huge Power set is the hardest hitter in the format, though it is shredded by priority. Would work well in a hyper offense team that has a good answer to priority.

A-​

Blissey- Extremely bulky Wonder Guard on the special side. Secret Sword doesn’t exist yet, and I haven’t seen a lot of physical Fighting attacks yet, so I think this thing has a solid place in this meta. It has some decent calcs against Latios, requiring a 3HKO with Focus Blast at +0 (or a 2HKO with enough chip), and Spacial Rend has a 14.1% chance to 2HKO at +2. Its physical defense doesn’t seem great, but in Rain it surprisingly isn’t even 2HKOed by Huge Power Giratina-Origin’s +2 Fire Fang, and Stealth Rock doesn’t even guarantee the 2HKO (64.8% chance). Definitely need to give the pink blob a chance.

Registeel- Flash Fire that can be used instead of Skarmory. Compared to Skarmory, it resists Stealth Rock, but it trades the Electric weakness for a Ground and Fighting weakness, which I think would be more common. Registeel might also be able to serve as a Wonder Guard, but then it would be Fire Fang weak, which is never a good thing. Overall a very good choice, but may be mostly outclassed by Skarmory or Dialga.

Jirachi- Wonder Guard that likes to run TrickScarf with U-Turn. Might also be able to run Flash Fire. Steel resists Ghost and Dark this gen, so Jirachi doesn’t have to fear either of Giratina-Origin’s STABs, nor does it have to fear Weavile (unless it runs specific coverage for Jirachi). It also takes Earth Power just as well as Dialga, so whether you use Dialga or Jirachi depends on what you prioritize more: fast pivoting or STAB Draco Meteor.

Giratina- Compared to its Origin form, it has 20 points added to both defenses and 20 points taken away from both offenses. What mainly holds back Giratina in gen4 is that Prankster and Magic Bounce don’t exist yet. It can technically run Wonder Guard, and it has a Fire Fang resistance, but the Sheer Cold weakness is horrible. Might also be able to run Poison Heal, though that is mainly me just speculating.

---

B tier​

B+​

Tentacruel- It isn’t as bulky as Swampert, and it is far easier to hit than Gyarados, but Tentacruel shines in the role compression it can do, serving as both a Fire Fang-resisting Wonder Guard and a Toxic Spikes absorber. I can see this being invaluable on certain teams, but its not-amazing physical bulk is going to hold it back a bit, even if it resists Fire Fang.

Scizor- Can function as either a Wonder Guard or as a Flash Fire. As a Wonder Guard, it has only one weakness, but that weakness is 4x to Fire, which sounds terrible. As a Flash Fire, it loses its only weakness, and it resists both of Giratina-Origin’s STABs. It also isn’t weak to Stealth Rock, which is nice for the roles it tries to serve, and it is immune to Toxic Spikes.

Spiritomb- Wonder Guard not weak to anything, best Rapid Spin blocker available. Shadow Tag has a hard time removing it. Seems decent, but doesn’t really resist any important attacks in case Wonder Guard is removed or ignored. Its level two set sounds funny, but Psycho Shift can miss in gen4, so I don’t know how to feel about it.

Regirock- Sand setter or a Sand Wonder Guard. It always does well in Sand, with its 1.5x boost to its Special Defense and its massive Defense stat, which allows it to function as a great Fire Fang wall. Ithink Regirock is a slept on choice, if anything. I’d be curious to see how well it does as gen4 develops.

Mewtwo- Latios if it lost Soul Dew. It is slightly faster than the Lati twins, but unless you really need your item slot, I can’t think of much of a good reason to run Mewtwo over the Latis. Mewtwo is still a great special attacker, though, so I’m not placing it that low, even if it is mostly outclassed.

B​

Relicanth- Might be kind of slept on, to be honest. Takes 1/4 damage from Fire Fang and gets a 1.5x boost to Special Defense in Sand, allowing it to function as a surprisingly bulky Wonder Guard for Sand teams. Definitely need to give this thing a try.

Kyogre- Decently bulky pure Water-type Wonder Guard. Kyogre’s niche seems to be its massive Special Attack stat, which could let it function as an offensive Wonder Guard. Could be an interesting pick for a Rain team, but most of the time I think you would rather just use Gyarados or Swampert.

Weavile- Huge Power revenge killer with an interesting type combination- Ice and Dark. This gives it STAB Pursuit, Sucker Punch, and Ice Shard, allowing it to threaten several top threats such as Latios, Deoxys-Speed, and Giratina-Origin. Latios actually HAS to run Timid in order to not be completely shut down by Choice Band Pursuit (which OHKOs even if it doesn’t switch). If Giratina-Origin is weakened enough, Ice Shard can KO it (range is 63.6%-75.5% with Choice Band). Deoxys-Speed has to make a gamble, since it is OHKOed by Pursuit if it switches, OHKOed by Sucker Punch if it tries to attack, and it is at best 2HKOed by Pursuit even if it doesn’t switch (and is OHKOed by Choice Band Pursuit). Even Arceus isn’t safe, since it is OHKOed by Choice Band Close Combat. Weavile is Stealth Rock weak, and it also needs to be wary of priority and Fire Fang, but I can see this thing becoming more popular later on, especially considering how threatening it can be to the S tier.

Gengar- I’ve seen/heard of Shadow Tag and Wonder Guard on this. Both are terrified of Weavile and being Pursuit trapped in general. Ghost STAB lets it scare the Lati twins and Deoxys-Speed a bit, but Giratina-Origin can just click Shadow Sneak on it. Gengar sounds okay, but until I see it actually excel in a role, I’m ranking it here.

Suicune- Another Water-type Wonder Guard. It’s rather bulky, with even a Modest Latios not being able to OHKO it with Seed Flare (90.8% at most without a crit). That’s kind of all it has, though- most of the other Water-type Wonder Guards have something else going for them. Maybe it can serve the role of the Water-type Wonder Guard over Swampert if you are especially scared of Grass coverage? I don’t really see much of a point in running Suicune, to be honest.

Heatran- Probably my hottest take on this entire VR. Heatran runs Unaware, which allows it to be what I believe to be the best check to Giratina-Origin sweepers from Sun teams. It is neutral to Fire Fang, and it resists both of Giratina-Origin’s STABs. Unaware will prevent Giratina-Origin from breaking through with enough boosts, since Fire Fang doesn’t ignore Unaware (it only ignores Wonder Guard). Could be very interesting to see on maybe a Sand team that otherwise struggles with Giratina-Origin.

B-​

Infernape- Huge Power with STAB Close Combat and Fire Fang. It also isn’t Stealth Rock weak, which is nice. Overall it sounds okay, might work fine as a replacement for Giratina-Origin as a sweeper on Sun teams that need Giratina-Origin for some other role.

Blaziken- Basically Infernape but slightly worse. I don’t know why you would use this over Infernape.

Cresselia- Bulky Wonder Guard with only three weaknesses, but they are kind of a big deal- Dark, Ghost, and Bug. Being weak to Dark means you are open to being Pursuit-trapped, which isn’t that bad right now, but I wouldn’t be surprised if Weavile usage goes up, so you may need to be wary of that. Being weak to Ghost is also bad, since you are vulnerable to one of Giratina-Origin’s STABs. Being weak to Bug is especially bad, though, since you no longer block U-Turn, allowing you to get chipped over the course of the game really easily. It also doesn’t have any many good resistances, only resisting Fighting and Psychic. It does have the nice niche of being a Wonder Guard not weak to Ground, but I feel like the U-Turn weakness holds it back too much from being anything amazing, even if the bulk makes up for it somewhat.

Probopass- The main Sand setter, but can also function as a Wonder Guard on Sand. The Toxic Spikes immunity and Stealth Rock resistance is always nice, and it has decent bulk on top of a very low Speed stat, allowing for Sandstorm to be set if you out-slow your opponent’s weather lead.

Bastiodon- Probopass but gains a little Defense at the cost of a little Special Defense. Also slower than Probopass, if that matters to you.

---

C tier​

C+​

Groudon- What Groudon does, I do not know. It has decent stats, so it could maybe run something like Huge Power with Earthquake / Fire Fang / Dragon Claw / Dragon Dance? Once I find out what exactly Groudon can do, I’ll adjust its placement.

Electrode- Has one weakness, but it is Ground, which is kind of bad considering a lot of Wonder Guards are weak to Ground. It also doesn’t have Air Balloon this gen, so it can’t even pull off something like what Muk-Alola does in gen7. It doesn’t hit very hard, so I don’t think getting Electric STAB matters as much on it as it does on Jolteon or Raikou, but it is very fast, only being outsped by Deoxys-Speed, Ninjask (not real), Deoxys (not real), and Deoxys-Attack (which probably wants to run an Attack/Special Attack-boosting nature over a Speed-boosting one). Only realistically being outsped by Deoxys-Speed, itself, and maybe Deoxys-Attack sounds really nice, and with Choice Scarf, you guarantee that you can outspeed Choice Scarf Aerodactyl and either paralyze it with Zap Cannon (risky) or finish it off with Thunderbolt (guaranteed KO if Aerodactyl is at 59.5% or lower, or if it has at most 216 HP left). Overall, I can see this thing working as a Wonder Guard that serves the roles of a fast pivot and a potential disruptor with Spore and Taunt.

Darkrai- I had to ask Ransei what this thing does. Apparently it can function as a Mold Breaker Rapid Spinner that can punish Ghost-types attempting to spinblock. That does sound like a good niche for Darkrai, but I have yet to see it in action. May raise it higher depending on how well I see it perform.

Venusaur- If Grass-types were immune to Spore this generation, I think Venusaur would be a really solid choice, serving as a Rain setter that immediately benefits from Rain through losing its Fire Fang weakness. It also can serve as an absorber of Toxic Spikes, which can be very handy on the more defensive or stally kinds of teams that would work well in Rain. It does have the problem of not being especially strong, and it isn’t as bulky as it would like to be, especially considering its lack of good resistances.

C​

Rhyperior- I have only seen this once- Ransei ran it against me as a Sand setter. It sounds decent to me- it resists Stealth Rock, and it trades a Toxic Spikes immunity for a Fire Fang resistance. Its Special Defense is really bad, though, and I don’t know if Sand’s boost makes up for it enough. Definitely has potential, though.

Raikou- Electric-type Wonder Guard that carves itself a niche over Electrode in being bulkier and hitting harder at the cost of some speed. I generally don’t think Pure Electric Wonder Guards are very good in this format, but if you had to use one or if you found a good spot for one on your team, Raikou would be a decent choice.

Jolteon- Raikou but slightly faster and worse in every other way. If you want speed, you have Electrode. If you want power, you have Raikou. Jolteon kind of sits there awkwardly in between the two. It doesn’t seem that bad, but I don’t know why you would want to use it over Raikou or Electrode.

Drapion- Like the Pure-Electric Wonder Guards, Drapion is only weak to Ground. However, Drapion is unique in that it trades Electric STAB for being a Toxic Spikes absorber, which are rare in this format. Unfortunately for Drapion, it faces competition in this role as a Poison-type Wonder Guard from Tentacruel, who also has the niche of resisting Fire Fang. Might be handy from time to time, but most of the time I think you would rather just use Tentacruel.

C-​

Regice- I asked lag=bad what this thing does, and they mentioned it could work on Hail. I don’t really see Hail teams working too well, since there are only two viable Ice-types (if you include Regice as one). I can see this thing as maybe a Snow Warning user, but since Hail is easily the worst of the four weathers, I’m not ranking this thing very high.

Heracross- STAB U-Turn sounds nice, as does Fighting STAB considering the presence of several amazing pure Normal-type Wonder Guards. Could function okay as an offensive Wonder Guard, but the Fire Fang weakness really sucks.

Gliscor- I have no idea what this thing does, but unlike Groudon, its stats aren’t that of a legendary, so it doesn’t even have that going for it. Might raise this if I find or hear about a good niche for it, but until then, it can stay in C- hell with Magcargo.

Magcargo- Wonder Guard that takes 1/4 damage from Fire Fang, and does get a boost in Sand to its Special Defense. However, it takes 4x damage from Ground and Water, and I can see Ground coverage becoming more popular, considering the plethora of Ground-weak Wonder Guards.

Camerupt- Yet another Wonder Guard with a Fire Fang resistance. I really don’t see the point in this thing. Most of the other Fire Fang-resisting Wonder Guards at least have some extra use that goes along with them- Tentacruel removes Toxic Spikes, Relicanth and Palkia take quartered damage from it, Regirock gets a boost to Special Defense in Sand, and so forth. If Camerupt has anything unique to it other than the fact that it looks funny, I don’t know what it is.

Final thoughts​

I'm not sure on Weavile's and Heatran's placements- could definitely be adjusted. I also still have no idea what Gliscor does, so if anyone has any ideas, please let me know either here or in the Pure Hackmons Discord server.

Thank you again for reading
-electra​

 

[adriancosmoem]

Magcargo- Wonder Guard that takes 1/4 damage from Fire Fang, and does get a boost in Sand to its Special Defense. However, it takes 4x damage from Ground and Water, and I can see Ground coverage becoming more popular, considering the plethora of Ground-weak Wonder Guards.

relicanth is better than magcargo to me. relicanth has 100/130 phys bulk and magcargo has 50/120 phys bulk. relicanth is also neutral to rocks and magcargo is weak to rocks. they both get spdef boost from sand. for comparison, a relicanth switching into a +6 fire fang from huge power giratina-o will take 31.8-35.2% with rocks. a magcargo in the same situation takes 52.9-57.8% with rocks.

 

[Electra102]

relicanth is better than magcargo to me. relicanth has 100/130 phys bulk and magcargo has 50/120 phys bulk. relicanth is also neutral to rocks and magcargo is weak to rocks. they both get spdef boost from sand. for comparison, a relicanth switching into a +6 fire fang from huge power giratina-o will take 31.8-35.2% with rocks. a magcargo in the same situation takes 52.9-57.8% with rocks.

I don't disagree with you at all. That's why I placed Relicanth in the B tier, far above Magcargo in the C- tier

 

[adriancosmoem]

I don't disagree with you at all. That's why I placed Relicanth in the B tier, far above Magcargo in the C- tier

oh my eyes literally skipped over that fsr lol.
anyway to not make this a one liner i will put in my 2 cents about some dpp stuff.

huge power: i see people not running this ability a lot anymore but it's really good. there seems to be a rise of wgs that arent fire fang resists. so i think an sd / fang / dclaw / cc set on a huge power mon could be really good right now.
knock off: i think knock off is a good move for teams with stag mons to take away shed shell or latias soul dew. it could be run on a bulky mold breaker like one of the normals.
wg venomoth: ok don't laugh, but in majority of games i've played i have seen tspikes. so a wonder guard that can remove tspikes just by switching in could have a good matchup against the tspikes spiritomb balances that are everywhere. being weak to rocks is really annoying though, and it gets destroyed by fire fang. but maybe?
magic guard: i think this ability could only be run on select few pokemon but there is a lot of reliance on passive damage in this tier. so i think magic guard for both offense and defense could be a strong ability

 

[Electra102]

DPPt Pure Hackmons

Banner to be made later
​

Premise: Anything directly hackable onto a set (which includes EVs, IVs, form, abilities, items, and moves) and is usable in a local battle is allowed.

This is not Balanced Hackmons, which has a banlist in order to have a less centralized variant of Hackmons. For Generation 4 Balanced Hackmons, take a look at the Balanced Hackmons Old Gens Hub.

This is also not Anything Goes, which is exclusive to legal Pokémon. For Generation 4 Anything Goes, a post does not exist yet, but you can look at Anything Goes for Generations 6, 7, or 8 if you take a look at the AG Old Gens Hub.

Clauses: Endless Battle Clause


FAQ:
Q: Is this Custom Game?
A: No. Custom Game is based on what the Pokémon Showdown teambuilder is capable of, while Pure Hackmons is based around what is hackable in game and usable in local battles. Specifically, in Pure Hackmons you are limited to a maximum level of 100, a maximum of 4 moves, and a maximum of 6 Pokemon. In addition to that, Showdown-exclusive abilities and moves such as Rebound and Paleo Wave are unusable. In Custom Game, however, the maximum level is 9999, the maximum number of moves is 24 per Pokemon, a team can have up to 24 Pokemon, and moves and abilities that are Showdown-exclusive are usable.

Q: Can I make my Pokémon invincible?
A: No Pokémon can be made fully invincible, and most gimmicky attempts in having them done end up bringing no impact towards the competitive metagame. Spiritomb may have no weaknesses and therefore be immune to most conventional damage if given Wonder Guard, but it is far from invincible.

Q: Why is there an Endless Battle Clause?
A: Endless Battle Clause is present in every Showdown metagame to prevent battles taking too long and lagging the server. This acts similar to the in-game timer system in later generations, but more loose, meaning battles can extend further with Endless Battle Clause than it could with the in-game timer of later generations.


Resources:
Viability Rankings (work in progress)
Sample Teams (need to be updated)
Setpedia (work in progress)
Roles Compendium
What is Hackmons? Article

Social:
Pure Hackmons Discord
Pure Hackmons PS! room

Accessibility:
Currently playable only through Custom Game, challenge codes, or tournaments in the Pure Hackmons and Ruins of Alph rooms.

Challenge Code

/challenge [user], gen4anythinggoes @@@ !Obtainable, -Future, -Past, -LGPE, -CAP, -Custom, !Arceus EV Limit

Council:
Electra102 (leader)
lag=bad
NToTheN

Former council members

AV Cosmoem

 

[Electra102]

DPPt Pure Hackmons Sample Teams

Rain Balance by Tmi489


The Dragons and The Knights Sand by ArcticBreeze


Dual Lati Offense by NToTheN


Double Lati + Sun HO by Electra102

Changelog

• 12/1/2024: Removed Vicious Sun Balance, added Double Lati + Sun HO

Removed teams

Vicious Sun Balance by Tmi489
Reason for removal: Whirlwind was discovered to not be able to be chained with Copycat in gen4.

 

[Electra102]

DPPt Pure Hackmons Viability Rankings

Welcome to the DPPt Pure Hackmons Viability Rankings. This is one of the several resources available to help players determine what is viable in DPPt Pure Hackmons. Everything is ranked within subtiers in alphabetical order. Abilities are also included, with the most important ones being bolded and more niche abilities being in italics. Abilities are sorted in alphabetical order within their category (so bolded abilities and abilities in italics are sorted separately). If you think something should be added or a placement should be changed, let us know! Please explain why you think your Pokemon should have its placed be changed or have it and/or an ability for it be added, and why. Backing up your argument with replays helps.

S tier

S
Arceus (Shadow Tag, Wonder Guard, No Guard, Speed Boost)
Deoxys-Speed (No Guard)
Giratina-Origin (Huge Power, Magic Guard)

S-
Latios (Mold Breaker, Shadow Tag, Drizzle, Drought, No Guard)

A tier

A+
Palkia (Mold Breaker, Wonder Guard)
Regigigas (Wonder Guard, Huge Power, Mold Breaker, Scrappy, Shadow Tag)
Skarmory (Flash Fire, Wonder Guard)
Slaking (Wonder Guard, Huge Power, Mold Breaker, Scrappy, Shadow Tag)
Swampert (Wonder Guard)

A
Dialga (Mold Breaker, Wonder Guard)
Gyarados (Wonder Guard)
Ho-Oh (Magic Guard, Huge Power)
Latias (Drought, Mold Breaker)
Rayquaza (Shadow Tag, Mold Breaker)

A-
Aerodactyl (No Guard, Magic Guard, Poison Heal)
Blissey (Wonder Guard)
Deoxys-Attack (Huge Power, Magic Guard, Mold Breaker)
Giratina (Poison Heal, Shadow Tag, Wonder Guard)
Jirachi (Wonder Guard)
Registeel (Flash Fire, Wonder Guard)

B tier

B+
Infernape (Huge Power)
Mewtwo (Mold Breaker, No Guard)
Scizor (Flash Fire, Wonder Guard)
Spiritomb (Wonder Guard)
Tentacruel (Wonder Guard)

B
Bastiodon (Sand Stream, Wonder Guard)
Darkrai (Mold Breaker)
Gengar (Wonder Guard, Mold Breaker)
Groudon (Mold Breaker, Shadow Tag, Huge Power)
Kyogre (Mold Breaker, Wonder Guard)
Probopass (Sand Stream, Wonder Guard)
Relicanth (Wonder Guard)

B-
Blaziken (Huge Power)
Heatran (Unaware)
Metagross (Drizzle, Wonder Guard)
Regirock (Wonder Guard, Sand Stream)
Suicune (Wonder Guard)
Weavile (Huge Power)

C tier

C+
Cresselia (Wonder Guard)
Electrode (Wonder Guard)
Tyranitar (Mold Breaker)
Venusaur (Drizzle, Mold Breaker)

C
Drapion (Wonder Guard)
Jolteon (Wonder Guard)
Lugia (Poison Heal, Unaware)
Raikou (Wonder Guard)
Rhyperior (Sand Stream)

C-
Ariados (Wonder Guard)
Camerupt (Wonder Guard)
Cloyster (Snow Warning, Wonder Guard)
Heracross (Wonder Guard)
Magcargo (Wonder Guard)
Regice (Snow Warning, Wonder Guard)

Changelog

December 12, 2024

Rises
: UR to A-
: UR to C-
: C+ to B
: UR to C
: UR to B-
Drops
: C- to UR
: A+ to A
: C+ to C (Change was reverted a few hours later)

January 7, 2025

Added viable abilities
Rises
: UR to C-
: B- to B
: C+ to B
: B- to B+
: A to A+
: B- to B
: A to A+
: UR to C+
Drops
: B- to C+
: A to A-
: A+ to A
: B to B-
: B to B-
: A+ to A
: B to B-
: B to B-

January 10, 2025

• Fixed the January 7, 2025 changelog record for Cresselia (originally said it dropped from B- to B)
• Added Sand Stream as a medium-importance ability option for Regirock

January 11, 2025

• Added Wonder Guard in italics to Giratina
• Removed the medium-importance category of abilities. Now, main abilities are bolded while more niche abilities are in italics
• Changed the formatting of part of the changelog (now includes bullet points for some dates)
• Made some changes to the opening/post explanation paragraph
• Placed abilities in alphabetical order (with bolded ones always before ones in italics, so bolded abilities and abilities in italics are sorted separately)

January 13, 2025

Drop
: B+ to B-

 

[Electra102]

DPPt Pure Hackmons Setpedia

Welcome to the DPPt Pure Hackmons Setpedia. Some sample sets have been provided for high-enough ranking Pokemon on the Viability Rankings. If you think a set should be added, please feel free to suggest it, along with why you think it is worth a place on the Setpedia, some replays, and so forth. This is not a comprehensive list of everything a Pokemon can run- if your set is not here, that does not necessarily mean it is bad. Sets are not ranked in any particular order.

S tier

S

Arceus

Support Wonder Guard (Arceus) @ Mail / Shed Shell
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin
- Recover / Wish
- U-turn / Baton Pass
- Spikes / Stealth Rock / Toxic Spikes / Will-O-Wisp

SubPass Wonder Guard (Arceus) @ Leftovers / Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Baton Pass
- Recover / Wish
- Magic Coat

Huge Power Revenger (Arceus) @ Silk Scarf
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Extreme Speed
- Pursuit / Close Combat / Sucker Punch
- Baton Pass / U-Turn

Surprise No Guard (Arceus) @ Choice Scarf / Focus Sash
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sheer Cold
- Baton Pass
- Gastro Acid / Spore
- Trick / Gastro Acid / Spore

Speed Boost Anti-Lead (Arceus) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fake Out
- Sheer Cold
- Baton Pass
- Taunt / Substitute / Spore

Deoxys-Speed

No Guard Pass+TrickScarf Lead (Deoxys-Speed) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Sheer Cold
- Gastro Acid
- Baton Pass
- Trick

No Guard Focus Sash Lead (Deoxys-Speed) @ Focus Sash
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Sheer Cold
- Spore
- Gastro Acid
- Baton Pass / Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes

Weather setting TrickScarf Lead (Deoxys-Speed) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Drought / Drizzle / Sand Stream / Snow Warning
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Me First / Recover
- Baton Pass
- Spore
- Trick

Weather setting Sash Lead (Deoxys-Speed) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Drought / Drizzle / Sand Stream / Snow Warning
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes
- Spore
- Recover / Wish
- Baton Pass

Giratina-Origin

Huge Power Dragon Dance sweeper (Giratina-Origin) @ Griseous Orb
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Dragon Claw / Shadow Sneak / Leaf Blade
- Fire Fang
- Shadow Sneak / Leaf Blade
- Dragon Dance

Magic Guard Recovery sweeper (Giratina-Origin) @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Fire Fang
- Dragon Claw / Leaf Blade
- Dragon Dance
- Recover

Surprise No Guard sweeper (Giratina-Origin) @ Griseous Orb
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Fissure
- Dragon Claw / Leaf Blade
- Fire Fang
- Dragon Dance

S-

Latios

Fire Fang Wall Remover (Latios) (M) @ Soul Dew
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid / Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor / Spacial Rend
- Grass Knot / Seed Flare
- Focus Blast / Earth Power / Aura Sphere
- Earth Power / Fire Blast / Surf / Thunderbolt

Mold Breaker sweeper (Latios) (M) @ Soul Dew
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid / Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spacial Rend
- Fire Blast / Earth Power
- Tail Glow / Agility
- Spore / Agility / Taunt

Surprise No Guard sweeper (Latios) (M) @ Soul Dew
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid / Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fissure / Sheer Cold
- Spacial Rend / Draco Meteor
- Thunderbolt / Fire Blast / Earth Power
- Spore / Gastro Acid / Agility / Tail Glow

Rain setter (Latios) (M) @ Soul Dew
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor / Spacial Rend
- Spore / Taunt / Recover
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Will-O-Wisp
- U-turn / Baton Pass

A tier

A+

Palkia

Wonder Guard (Palkia) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Draco Meteor / Spacial Rend
- U-turn / Baton Pass / Spore / Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin
- Recover / Wish
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin

Mold Breaker (Palkia) @ Lustrous Orb
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest / Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Spacial Rend
- Surf / Hydro Pump
- Tail Glow / Spore
- Recover / Spore

Regigigas

Rain Stall Wonder Guard (Regigigas) @ Shed Shell / Leftovers
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin / U-Turn / Baton Pass
- Spore / Will-O-Wisp / Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / U-Turn / Baton Pass
- Extreme Speed / Spore / Taunt / Magic Coat / U-Turn / Baton Pass
- Recover / Wish

See Slaking for more sets

Skarmory

Flash Fire (Skarmory) @ Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Whirlwind
- Rapid Spin / Aromatherapy
- Recover
- Gastro Acid / Taunt / Will-O-Wisp / Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Magic Coat

Wonder Guard (Skarmory) @ Shed Shell / Mail / Leftovers
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Roost / Recover
- Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin
- U-Turn / Baton Pass
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Magic Coat / Taunt / Will-O-Wisp

Slaking

Wonder Guard sweeper (Slaking) @ Lum Berry / Shed Shell
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Extreme Speed
- Fire Fang
- Belly Drum / Swords Dance / Dragon Dance
- Spore / Taunt

Huge Power FakeSpeed (Slaking) @ Silk Scarf
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Fake Out
- Extreme Speed
- Fire Fang
- U-turn / Baton Pass / Pursuit

Shadow Tag revenger (Slaking) @ Silk Scarf
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Fake Out
- Extreme Speed
- Fire Fang
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes

Scrappy Rapid Spinner (Slaking) @ Silk Scarf
Ability: Scrappy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Rapid Spin
- Extreme Speed
- Close Combat
- Baton Pass / U-Turn

SubPass Wonder Guard (Slaking) @ Shed Shell / Leftovers
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Substitute
- Baton Pass
- Extreme Speed / Spore / Taunt / Magic Coat
- Recover / Wish

Swampert

Wonder Guard (Swampert) @ Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Baton Pass / U-Turn
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes
- Recover / Wish
- Spore / Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin / Will-O-Wisp

A

Dialga

Support Wonder Guard (Dialga) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Spe
- U-turn / Baton Pass / Spore
- Draco Meteor / Spacial Rend / Substitute
- Recover / Wish
- Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin / Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Spore / Will-O-Wisp

Note- Running 30 HP IVs is only necessary if you are running SubPass

Mold Breaker (Dialga) @ Adamant Orb / Choice Specs
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest / Timid Nature
- Spacial Rend / Draco Meteor
- Earth Power / Fire Blast / Focus Blast
- Fire Blast / Focus Blast / Rapid Spin / Spore
- Tail Glow / Trick / Spore

Gyarados

Support Wonder Guard (Gyarados) @ Leftovers / Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Relaxed Nature
- Roost / Wish
- U-turn / Baton Pass
- Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Will-O-Wisp

Ho-Oh

Magic Guard sweeper (Ho-Oh) @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Recover
- Volt Tackle
- Fire Fang

Huge Power (Ho-Oh) @ Leftovers
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Fire Fang
- Dragon Claw
- Recover
- Dragon Dance

Magic Guard Sleep Answer (Ho-Oh) @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
- Recover
- Psycho Shift
- Aromatherapy
- U-turn / Baton Pass

Magic Guard Belly Drum sweeper (Ho-Oh) @ Salac Berry
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Substitute
- Volt Tackle / Wood Hammer / Dragon Claw
- Fire Fang

Latias

Sun setter (Latias) (F) @ Soul Dew
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor / Spacial Rend
- U-turn / Baton Pass
- Spore / Taunt / Recover
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Will-O-Wisp

Rayquaza

Physical Shadow Tag (Rayquaza) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat / Earthquake
- Dragon Claw / Outrage
- Earthquake / Thunderbolt / Trick
- Power Whip / Trick / Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes

Special Shadow Tag (Rayquaza) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor / Spacial Rend
- Earth Power / Focus Blast
- Seed Flare / Grass Knot / Trick
- Focus Blast / Trick

A-

Aerodactyl

No Guard Lead (Aerodactyl) @ Choice Scarf / Focus Sash
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Sheer Cold / Fissure
- Baton Pass / U-Turn / Spore
- Gastro Acid
- Trick / Spore / Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes

Blissey

Support Wonder Guard (Blissey) (F) @ Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin
- Baton Pass / U-Turn
- Soft-Boiled / Wish
- Spore / Taunt / Magic Coat

SubPass Wonder Guard (Blissey) (F) @ Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Substitute
- Baton Pass
- Soft-Boiled / Wish
- Spore / Taunt / Magic Coat

Deoxys-Attack

Huge Power sweeper (Deoxys-Attack) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Fire Fang
- Close Combat / Earthquake
- Power Whip / Earthquake
- Swords Dance

Special Mold Breaker (Deoxys-Attack) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Psycho Boost
- Focus Blast / Earth Power
- Fire Blast
- Trick / Draco Meteor

Physical Mold Breaker (Deoxys-Attack) @ Choice Band
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Close Combat / Earthquake
- Extreme Speed
- Power Whip / Trick
- Earthquake / Dragon Claw / Trick

Magic Guard (Deoxys-Attack) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Fire Fang
- Close Combat
- Extreme Speed

Giratina

Poison Heal (Giratina) @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Psycho Shift / Spore / Will-O-Wisp
- Aromatherapy
- Recover / Protect
- Baton Pass / U-Turn

Wonder Guard (Giratina) @ Griseous Orb / Shed Shell / Leftovers
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Substitute / Spore / Taunt / Draco Meteor
- Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin
- Baton Pass / U-Turn / Taunt / Spore
- Recover / Wish

Shadow Tag (Giratina) @ Griseous Orb / Leftovers
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Perish Song / Toxic
- Rapid Spin / Aromatherapy
- Taunt / Spore
- Recover / Wish

Jirachi

Choice Scarf Wonder Guard Pivot (Jirachi) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- U-turn / Baton Pass
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Spore
- Trick
- Recover / Wish

Registeel

Flash Fire (Registeel) @ Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Recover / Wish
- Whirlwind
- Rapid Spin / Aromatherapy
- Gastro Acid / Baton Pass / U-Turn / Magic Coat

Wonder Guard (Registeel) @ Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Recover / Wish
- Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin
- Spore / Magic Coat / Taunt / Substitute
- Baton Pass / U-Turn

Note- Running 30 HP IVs is only necessary if you are running SubPass

B tier

B+

Infernape

Huge Power (Infernape) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant / Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Fire Fang
- Close Combat
- Thunder Punch / Dragon Claw / Leaf Blade / Spore
- Dragon Dance

Mewtwo

Mold Breaker (Mewtwo) @ Lum Berry / Focus Sash
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid / Modest Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Psychic / Psycho Boost
- Fire Blast
- Spore / Rapid Spin / Taunt
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Rapid Spin

No Guard (Mewtwo) @ Choice Scarf / Focus Sash
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Sheer Cold / Fissure
- Trick / Spore
- Gastro Acid
- Baton Pass

Scizor

Flash Fire (Scizor) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Spe
Impish Nature
- U-turn / Baton Pass
- Whirlwind / Taunt / Spore
- Rapid Spin / Aromatherapy / Spore / Taunt
- Recover

Wonder Guard Pivot (Scizor) @ Choice Scarf / Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
IVs: 30 HP
Impish Nature
- U-turn / Baton Pass
- Trick / Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes
- Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin
- Recover / Wish

Spiritomb

Curse Wonder Guard (Spiritomb) @ Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Curse
- Baton Pass / U-Turn
- Will-O-Wisp / Spore / Taunt
- Recover / Wish

Level 2 Wonder Guard (Spiritomb) @ Flame Orb
Ability: Wonder Guard
Level: 2
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Curse
- Psycho Shift
- Pain Split
- U-Turn / Baton Pass / Magic Coat

Tentacruel

Wonder Guard (Tentacruel) @ Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Rapid Spin / Aromatherapy
- Recover / Wish
- Baton Pass / U-Turn
- Haze / Taunt / Spore / Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes

B

Bastiodon

Sand Setter (Bastiodon) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Baton Pass / U-Turn
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes
- Soft-Boiled
- Aromatherapy / Spore / Taunt / Rapid Spin

Wonder Guard (Bastiodon) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Baton Pass / U-Turn
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Spore
- Soft-Boiled / Wish
- Aromatherapy / Taunt / Spore

Darkrai

Mold Breaker Rapid Spin (Darkrai) @ Leftovers / Dread Plate
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Rapid Spin
- Dark Pulse / Judgment
- Spore / Recover

Gengar

Wonder Guard Fast Pivot (Gengar) @ Shed Shell / Black Sludge / Choice Scarf
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Recover / Wish
- Baton Pass
- Trick / Toxic Spikes / Taunt
- Shadow Ball / Spore / Taunt

Mold Breaker Rapid Spin (Gengar) @ Spooky Plate / Black Sludge
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball / Judgment
- Rapid Spin
- Nasty Plot
- Recover / Spore

Groudon

Mold Breaker (Groudon) @ Choice Band / Leftovers / Lum Berry
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Earthquake / Bonemerang
- U-Turn / Sacred Fire
- Dragon Claw / Outrage
- Trick / Dragon Dance

Choice Band Shadow Tag (Groudon) @ Choice Band
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Earthquake / Bonemerang
- U-Turn / Sacred Fire / Extreme Speed / Fire Fang
- Dragon Claw / Outrage / Sucker Punch
- Trick / Extreme Speed / Sucker Punch

Huge Power (Groudon) @ Choice Band / Leftovers
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Earthquake / Bonemerang
- Fire Fang
- Dragon Claw / Thunder Punch / Leaf Blade
- Dragon Dance / Leaf Blade / Thunder Punch

Kyogre

Wonder Guard (Kyogre) @ Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Surf / Hydro Pump / Water Spout / Whirlwind
- U-Turn / Baton Pass
- Recover
- Taunt / Spore / Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes

Wonder Guard SubPass (Kyogre) @ Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Surf / Hydro Pump / Water Spout / Whirlwind / Taunt / Spore
- Baton Pass
- Substitute
- Recover

Rain’s Mold Breaker Nuke (Kyogre) @ Choice Scarf / Choice Specs / Splash Plate
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest / Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Water Spout / Hydro Pump / Judgment / Surf
- Surf / Ice Beam / Thunder / Thunderbolt
- Ice Beam / Thunder / Thunderbolt / U-Turn / Rapid Spin / Tail Glow
- Trick

Mold Breaker Sweeper (Kyogre) @ Splash Plate / Leftovers
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest / Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Judgment / Surf / Hydro Pump / Water Spout
- Ice Beam / Thunder / Thunderbolt
- Spore / Tail Glow / Agility
- Agility / Tail Glow / Recover

Probopass

See Bastiodon for sets. Bastiodon and Probopass are extremely similar to each other, and can run the same sets.

Relicanth

What’s a Fire Fang? (Relicanth) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Bold / Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Recover
- Aromatherapy / Spore / Whirlwind
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes
- U-Turn / Baton Pass

B-

Blaziken

Worse Infernape (Blaziken) @ Focus Sash / Lum Berry
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Fire Fang
- Close Combat
- Thunder Punch / Dragon Claw / Leaf Blade / Spore
- Dragon Dance

Band Huge Power (Blaziken) @ Choice Band
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Fire Fang
- Dragon Claw
- Leaf Blade
- Thunder Punch

Heatran

The Magma Frog (Heatran) @ Leftovers / Shed Shell
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Recover
- Whirlwind / Will-O-Wisp / Night Shade / Gastro Acid
- Magma Storm / Taunt / Substitute
- Baton Pass / U-Turn

Metagross

Rain Setter (Metagross) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Impish / Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Spe
- Recover
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes
- U-Turn / Baton Pass
- Spore / Taunt

Wonder Guard (Metagross) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Impish / Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Spe
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin
- Recover
- U-Turn / Baton Pass
- Taunt / Spore / Substitute / Whirlwind

Regirock

Wonder Guard (Regirock) @ Shed Shell / Mail
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Recover / Wish
- U-Turn / Baton Pass
- Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin
- Will-O-Wisp / Spore / Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes

Sand Stream (Regirock) @ Shed Shell / Lum Berry
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Spe
- Recover
- U-Turn / Baton Pass
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes
- Spore / Will-O-Wisp / Taunt

Suicune

Wonder Guard (Suicune) @ Shed Shell / Leftovers
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Spe
- Whirlwind / Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin / Whirlwind
- U-Turn / Baton Pass
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Rapid Spin / Spore / Substitute
- Recover

Weavile

S Tier Killer (Weavile) @ Choice Band / Focus Sash
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Close Combat / Fire Fang
- Pursuit
- Ice Shard
- Sucker Punch

C tier

C+

Cresselia

Why use this (Cresselia) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin
- Baton Pass / U-Turn
- Spore / Taunt / Aromatherapy / Rapid Spin / Toxic / Will-O-Wisp
- Roost

Electrode

Wonder Guard Disruptor (Electrode) @ Shed Shell / Choice Scarf
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Taunt / Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Trick
- Baton Pass / U-Turn
- Spore / Thunder Wave / Taunt / Trick
- Recover

Tyranitar

Mold Breaker Rapid Spin (Tyranitar) @ Leftovers
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant / Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Rapid Spin
- Crunch
- Recover / Spore
- Dragon Dance

Venusaur

Drizzle (Venusaur) @ Shed Shell / Black Sludge
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Seed Flare / Spore / Taunt
- Recover
- U-Turn / Baton Pass
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Spore / Taunt

Mold Breaker (Venusaur) @ Black Sludge / Shed Shell
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Seed Flare
- Roost
- Rapid Spin / Trick
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Toxic Spikes / Spore / U-Turn / Trick

Changelog

December 12, 2024

• Added set for Aerodactyl
• Fixed some rankings

December 26, 2024

• Added Mold Breaker set for Dialga
• Added Speed Boost set for Arceus
• Fixed IVs on some SubPass sets + added notes
• Slightly changed name for the Jirachi set (changed from "Choice Scarf Wonder Guard" to "Choice Scarf Wonder Guard Pivot").

January 8, 2025

• Removed Adamant Orb as an item choice from Wonder Guard Dialga, since it does not actually block Trick (thanks for pointing this out to me, hendrit)
• Removed Lustrous Orb as an item choice for Wonder Guard Palkia, since it does not actually block Trick (thanks to hendrit again for pointing this out).
• Removed the comment about EV spreads in the text before the sets begin.
• (Not a change) Still need to reorder the placements of mons that changed tiers.

January 11, 2025

• Reordered placements of mons that changed tiers on the VR.
• Added sets for B+ through C+
• Slightly edited the notes for the SubPass sets for Dialga and Registeel (Before: “Note- 30 HP IVs is only necessary if you are running SubPass”, After: “Note- Running 30 HP IVs is only necessary if you are running SubPass”)
• Changed the formatting of the changelog (now has spoilers for each date like the VR changelog)
• Second edit session: Added disclaimer that sets are not ranked in any particular order

January 13, 2025

• Moved Regirock to match its new VR placement (now in B-)
• Fixed today’s changelog (“to match its current VR…” -> “to match its new VR…”)

 

[lag=bad]

I've been a Room Prize winner for 4 consecutive months until it got removed. (mainly playing gen 6 ph)
I've been testing a team, which won me several tours until I found out it worked very well. Since I've stopped playing PH for a while, I might as well do a sample submission.

Team: https://pokepast.es/a3b28423711dd73f

Dog impression (Mewtwo-Mega-X) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Beat Up
- Close Combat
- Leaf Blade
- Play Rough

MMX is used as an offensive Wonder Guard; this set makes it strong against No Guard users (Mewtwo Y, Lopunny) while not getting trapped if they have the niche spider webs. Leaf Blade is used to deal decent damage to Primal Kyogre as well.

Mega Terrabbit (Audino-Mega) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Baton Pass
- Defog
- Aromatherapy
- Recover

Mega Audino, no need for explanation; it's here as the only defensive mon (except for Giratina). It is used to resist every single thing my MMX has so I don't get defeated by an impostor Blissey/Chansey.

Gulp (Gyarados-Mega) @ Lum Berry
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Beat Up
- Pursuit
- Water Shuriken
- Sucker Punch

Our team is relatively weak against Primal Groudon if Mega Rayquaza is somehow gone. A reminder to NEVER play mind games with Primal Groudon and use Water Shuriken every time. Gyarados is the perfect answer to Primal Groudon and its Sucker Punch and Pursuit pretty much take care of every single sweeper Pokémon in the meta.

Destiny (Lucario-Mega) @ Fist Plate
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 116 Atk / 140 SpA / 252 Spe
Rash Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flash Cannon
- Taunt
- Judgment
- Shell Smash

Now, the controversial pick. My team is clearly weak to Xerneas, so I thought of two mons: Mega Scizor and Mega Lucario. But Mega Scizor's terrible speed allows it to get easily destroyed by any Mold Breaker fairy, which will easily end up in a full sweep, simply by pressing Spore/Dark Void. This Lucario set not only beats Mold Breaker Xerneas but also Impostor Chansey/Blissey. This set also beats defensive Wonder Guard users with Taunt like Audino and Primal Kyogre.

Boss Battle (Rayquaza-Mega) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Volt Switch
- Chatter
- Flash Cannon

This set is just meant to be annoying. Chatter defeats EVERY SINGLE Wonder Guard in the meta with a bit of RNG, Drac o Meteor beats everything it can hit, and Volt Switch is a great momentum tool to pivort and hit Primal Kyogre.

Terror (Giratina) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Destiny Bond
- Encore
- Toxic
- Roost

Non-Curse Giratina? I found out Curse really isn't needed on this team. Toxic provides valuable support to chip and support your Rayquaza for the sweep. Toxic is also especially good against HO teams, where if they don't have an Aromatherapy user, toxic is lethal. Giratina is here if you make a mistake, and their Mold Breaker has a +2/+3 boost. Just one Destiny Bond/Encore; you get a get-out-of-jail-free card.



This is one of the games: (Pyogre completely shut down by taunt) https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2258296892

really cool team! Wonder guard sweepers are often overlooked, because of difficulty slotting them and the mu-fishing nature inherent in them, so it's interesting to see one more able to support it's team beyond just taking kos. Right off the bat, your team struggles to Mscizor. Potentially consider running flame plate over fist plate to hit sciz, while still improofing. You have mmx for the normals. I know it isn't stab, however this should theoretically help your team better take advantage of Specs mray's ability to remove key defensive pokemon.
Play rough mmx is a problem.
252 Atk Mewtwo-Mega-X Play Rough vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mewtwo-Mega-X: 262-310 (74.2 - 87.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Mewtwo-Mega-X Play Rough vs. 64 HP / 0 Def Rayquaza-Mega: 262-310 (71.3 - 84.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Mewtwo-Mega-X Play Rough vs. 208 HP / 0 Def Rayquaza-Mega: 262-310 (65 - 76.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
You either need to commit fully to hitting rayquaza or MMX, as once this mmx is gone, there isn't much (besides gyarados) stopping them from ripping you apart.
while yes you have no oblivion wing/chatter switchin, Maudino usually prefers physdef to better pivot off Mlatios, non-huge power mmx, or other non-huge power coverage moves. Spd is still fine, I just don't think that a team such as this one would appreciate it as much as physdef. Maudino is also not min-speed, which is essential to a slowpivot such as itself.
Gyarados really needs bulk in order to even attempt to semi-consistently check sweepers. Without it, you cannot switch into Mray or Pdon safely, and do not do enough with pursuit damage to prevent them from coming back in and sweeping again. Furthermore, while yes you do outspeed many sweepers, you still lose to the normal gyarados-mega checks, like stag mmx/slaking. I can see the appeal of this set, with it being able to outspeed and surprise many common sweepers and offensive threats, however, because this is realistically your only way of stopping a setup sweeper (with the understanding that many players will scout giratina for destiny bond by putting it to sleep/taunting it), you would most likely prefer a more standard defensive ev spread.
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Mach Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gyarados-Mega: 356-422 (107.5 - 127.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Mach Punch vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Gyarados-Mega: 356-422 (90.5 - 107.3%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
Lucario-mega does not have a physical attack, uh, I'd assume this was a mistake. Would like to hear the reasoning behind 140spa specifically though. (have been informed the ev's were a mistake)
Rayquaza-mega is a potent threat with specs, however, taking 25% from rocks every time, and with no healing. You already counter Maudino very well with lucario, consider running oblivion wing to give ray some much-needed longevity.
Overall, there are some other key weak points:
Huge power MMX: you cannot stop it. At all. you need to sack both mewtwo and potentially Mgyarados to deal with it, and it can most likely take a ko every time it switches in.
Stag Slaking/MMX: Because ray has no bulk investment, and no healing, stag trappers can just nuke it. This, coupled with your lack of hazard support, and only status being on giratina, leaves you open to being unable to make progress lategame when your sweeper is removed.

These are just some of my first thoughts about the team, there are probably a few more bad matchups I'm not thinking of right now, but if polished a little more, could be a really solid team!

 

[LycanrocWastaken]

Updated Post:
I've been a Room Prize winner for 4 consecutive months until it got removed. (mainly playing gen 6 ph)
I've been testing a team, which won me several tours until I found out it worked very well.

Team: https://pokepast.es/c09100c1a90ecdf1

Radiant (Diancie-Mega) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpA
Lonely Nature
- Fake Out
- Extreme Speed
- Boomburst
- Toxic Spikes

MMX was originally used as an offensive Wonder Guard; but it can't output pressure to opposing MMX, and neither can the rest of my team. So diancie is here. It does pressure to both Rayquaza and MMX.

Mega Terrabbit (Audino-Mega) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Parting Shot
- Defog
- Aromatherapy
- Recover

Mega Audino, no need for explanation; it's here as the only defensive mon (except for Giratina).

Gulp (Gyarados-Mega) @ Lum Berry
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Water Shuriken
- Beat Up
- Pursuit
- Spore

Our team is relatively weak against Primal Groudon if Mega Rayquaza is somehow gone. A reminder to NEVER play mind games with Primal Groudon and use Water Shuriken every time. Gyarados is the perfect answer to Primal Groudon and its Pursuit pretty much take care of every single sweeper Pokémon in the meta. Spore can be used instead of Sucker Punch because Pixilate Diancie easily deals with those meta threats.

Destiny (Lucario-Mega) @ Flame Plate
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flash Cannon
- Taunt
- Judgment
- Shell Smash

Now, the controversial pick. My team is clearly weak to Xerneas, so I thought of two mons: Mega Scizor and Mega Lucario. But Mega Scizor's terrible speed allows it to get easily destroyed by any Mold Breaker fairy, which will easily end up in a full sweep, simply by pressing Spore/Dark Void. This Lucario set not only beats Mold Breaker Xerneas but also Impostor Chansey/Blissey. This set also beats defensive Wonder Guard users with Taunt like Audino and Primal Kyogre. While Fire Judgment makes MBeedril prone to its attacks.

Boss Battle (Rayquaza-Mega) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Volt Switch
- Chatter
- Oblivion Wing

This set is just meant to be annoying. Chatter defeats EVERY SINGLE Wonder Guard in the meta with a bit of RNG, Draco Meteor beats everything it can hit, and Volt Switch is a great momentum tool to pivot+ and hit Primal Kyogre.

Terror (Giratina) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Destiny Bond
- Encore
- Toxic
- Roost

Non-Curse Giratina? I found out Curse really isn't needed on this team. Toxic provides valuable support to chip and support your Rayquaza for the sweep. Toxic is also especially good against HO teams, where if they don't have an Aromatherapy user, toxic is lethal. Giratina is here if you make a mistake, and their Mold Breaker has a +2/+3 boost. Just one Destiny Bond/Encore; you get a get-out-of-jail-free card.


Some Notable Battles:
1. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2258895862-7xulqufr6m7cksp30l1ybqansyikeqxpw (Sheep•Liver)
2. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2259061224 (lag=bad)
3. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2259514144 (Aldente Fettucino)
4. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2259516814 (zapdeez)
5. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2259524476 (Illouri)
6. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2259527084 (Toxtricity☃InDbMaj)
7. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2260137444 (Afox7654)
8. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2260140914 (mrmediocreteams)
9. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2260933599 (RL)
Thanks to lag=bad for helping me see those awful spreads!


Edit: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2260808026

From this battle, you can see chatter is extremely painful for this team. Especially bulky Chatter users like Registeel or Audino. To play against Chatter, only Gulp can deal with it well. So you have to play careful if opponents have it.

 

[LycanrocWastaken]

Updated Post:
I've been a Room Prize winner for 4 consecutive months until it got removed. (mainly playing gen 6 ph)
I've been testing a team, which won me several tours until I found out it worked very well. Since I've stopped playing PH for a while, I might as well do a sample submission.

Team: https://pokepast.es/6da030e1940654f6

Radiant (Diancie-Mega) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpA
Lonely Nature
- Fake Out
- Extreme Speed
- Boomburst
- Toxic Spikes

MMX was originally used as an offensive Wonder Guard; but it can't output pressure to opposing MMX, and neither can the rest of my team. So diancie is here. It does pressure to both Rayquaza and MMX.

Mega Terrabbit (Audino-Mega) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Baton Pass
- Defog
- Aromatherapy
- Recover

Mega Audino, no need for explanation; it's here as the only defensive mon (except for Giratina).

Gulp (Gyarados-Mega) @ Lum Berry
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Water Shuriken
- Beat Up
- Pursuit
- Spore

Our team is relatively weak against Primal Groudon if Mega Rayquaza is somehow gone. A reminder to NEVER play mind games with Primal Groudon and use Water Shuriken every time. Gyarados is the perfect answer to Primal Groudon and its Pursuit pretty much take care of every single sweeper Pokémon in the meta. Spore can be used instead of Sucker Punch because Pixilate Diancie easily deals with those meta threats.

Destiny (Lucario-Mega) @ Flame Plate
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flash Cannon
- Taunt
- Judgment
- Shell Smash

Now, the controversial pick. My team is clearly weak to Xerneas, so I thought of two mons: Mega Scizor and Mega Lucario. But Mega Scizor's terrible speed allows it to get easily destroyed by any Mold Breaker fairy, which will easily end up in a full sweep, simply by pressing Spore/Dark Void. This Lucario set not only beats Mold Breaker Xerneas but also Impostor Chansey/Blissey. This set also beats defensive Wonder Guard users with Taunt like Audino and Primal Kyogre. While Fire Judgment makes MBeedril prone to its attacks.

Boss Battle (Rayquaza-Mega) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Volt Switch
- Chatter
- Flash Cannon

This set is just meant to be annoying. Chatter defeats EVERY SINGLE Wonder Guard in the meta with a bit of RNG, Drac o Meteor beats everything it can hit, and Volt Switch is a great momentum tool to pivot+ and hit Primal Kyogre.

Terror (Giratina) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Destiny Bond
- Encore
- Toxic
- Roost

Non-Curse Giratina? I found out Curse really isn't needed on this team. Toxic provides valuable support to chip and support your Rayquaza for the sweep. Toxic is also especially good against HO teams, where if they don't have an Aromatherapy user, toxic is lethal. Giratina is here if you make a mistake, and their Mold Breaker has a +2/+3 boost. Just one Destiny Bond/Encore; you get a get-out-of-jail-free card.


Some Notable Battles:
1. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2258895862-7xulqufr6m7cksp30l1ybqansyikeqxpw
2. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2259061224
3. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2259514144
4. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2259516814
5. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2259524476
6. https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen6purehackmons-2259527084
Thanks to lag=bad for helping me see those awful spreads!

I chose the 9 that best represents this team.

 

[mayonnaise. mayo.]

I have played exactly 1 Gen 4 PH game and now know exactly what the meta is about.

non-existent
ddance huge power fire fang yummers
this is the only gen where weather is real in ph
best wg tie no question
2nd best because it doesn't tank fire fang that well

This is arguably the 2nd best PH meta (behind USUM the OM goat).

 

[adriancosmoem]

hey it's av. the samples are reaaaally outdated (sball spore slak? mixed sub mewtwo? dd kabu? tg ray? ho-oh in general?) so i made some new ones. idk if i have sample powers but if i do then these should replace the old samples. i left off some mons that are difficult to use, agg and wobb in particular.

 

[aerobee]

Glory has been added to the ORAS PH council. They've continued to be a competent and avid builder in a metagame that's, unfortunately, not gotten very many plays post-HPL. Welcome!

In other news, I'm stepping down from council. I haven't actually enjoyed playing the meta for a couple of years now, not really building much aside from for HPL and only sporadically playing friendlies and testing new ideas. I'd hesitated to step down for a long time, putting it off until HPL then staying on for a couple more months, but I feel I can do so now thanks to our current council members. It's been a pleasure!

 

[Sheep Liver]

I have played exactly 1 Gen 4 PH game and now know exactly what the meta is about.

non-existent
ddance huge power fire fang yummers
this is the only gen where weather is real in ph
best wg tie no question
2nd best because it doesn't tank fire fang that well

This is arguably the 2nd best PH meta (behind USUM the OM goat).

have you ever heard of swadloon? weather is absolutely real in gen 6 ph, which is NOT gen 4 ph

 

[LycanrocWastaken]

have you ever heard of swadloon? weather is absolutely real in gen 6 ph, which is NOT gen 4 ph

What team do you have that actually has weather? I want to know how it is real LOL (Weather Ball SUN Pdon?)

 

[Electra102]

What team do you have that actually has weather? I want to know how it is real LOL (Weather Ball SUN Pdon?)

Swadloon in gen6ph runs Primordial Sea to “counter” Groudon-Primal by taking 1/4 damage from Thousand Arrows and blocking V-Create. While Sheep Liver is technically correct in that weather exists in gen6, from my experience and knowledge it is very different compared to the complete weather teams in gen4.

 

[Sheep Liver]

What team do you have that actually has weather? I want to know how it is real LOL (Weather Ball SUN Pdon?)

it's literally just swadloon it's not real in the slightest

 

[LycanrocWastaken]

it's literally just swadloon it's not real in the slightest

Fine, im using weather. (I will try one last time)

 

[Ransei]

quoted

Official ORAS Hackmons Viability Rankings
Originally ran by Bahamut​

Welcome to the ORAS Hackmons Viability Rankings. The goal of this resource is to provide an accurate ranking of used Pokemon in the metagame, and the most common abilities those Pokemon use. Pokemon ranked below A are ranked alphabetically within their tiers. Abilities in Bold are seen very commonly on that Pokemon and are considered staples. Abilities in italics are other abilities that one might need to prepare for or keep in mind if you see the Pokemon in team preview, but are not very common or are more niche.

Why Does Wonder Guard Get Its Own Viability Rankings?
Because of the immense amount of Pokemon that effectively use Wonder Guard, and due to a lot of the roles of said Pokemon overlapping while they run Wonder Guard, we thought it would be appropriate to rank every commonly used Wonder Guard user as well, and put it at the top of the VR.

Feel free to respond with Pokemon you think should be added, or sets that a Pokemon should have.

S Rank
S+
Wonder Guard

Wonder Guard Viability Rankings

S

Beedrill-Mega

Xerneas

A

Arceus

Audino-Mega

Blissey

Deoxys-Attack

Ferrothorn

Kyogre-Primal

Mewtwo-Mega-X

Sableye-Mega

Slaking

B

Deoxys-Speed

Escavalier

Gengar-Mega

Groudon-Primal

Manectric-Mega

Ludicolo

Scizor-Mega

Swampert-Mega

Thundurus

C

Cresselia

Gardevoir-Mega

Gyarados @ Gyaradosite

Landorus-Therian

Lucario-Mega

Mewtwo-Mega-Y

S

Giratina ......................... Prankster, Magic Bounce, Poison Heal

S-

Rayquaza-Mega ........... Mold Breaker, Gale Wings, Aerilate, Shadow Tag

Mewtwo-Mega-X ........ Huge Power, Shadow Tag, Wonder Guard, Mold Breaker

Gyarados-Mega ........... Huge Power, Poison Heal

A Rank
A+

Xerneas ......................... Wonder Guard, Mold Breaker

Groudon-Primal .......... Mold Breaker, Shadow Tag, Huge Power

Beedrill-Mega .............. Wonder Guard, No Guard

Audino-Mega ............... Wonder Guard

Chansey ........................ Imposter

A

Gengar-Mega ............... Wonder Guard, Mold Breaker, No Guard

Diancie-Mega ............... Pixilate, Mold Breaker

Slaking .......................... Shadow Tag, Huge Power, Wonder Guard

Kyogre-Primal .............. Wonder Guard, Mold Breaker, Magic Bounce

A-

Regigias ........................ Shadow Tag, Huge Power

Sableye-Mega ............... Wonder Guard

Latios-Mega ................. Mold Breaker, Protean

Blissey ........................... Wonder Guard, Imposter


Reminder that Pokemon after this point are ranked alphabetically~

B Rank
B+

Aegislash ..................... Magic Bounce, Prankster

Arceus .......................... Wonder Guard, Mold Breaker, No Guard

Deoxys-Attack ............. Wonder Guard, No Guard

Escavalier ..................... Wonder Guard

Ferrothorn ................... Wonder Guard

Mewtwo-Mega-Y ........ Shadow Tag, No Guard, Mold Breaker, Protean, Wonder Guard

Scizor-Mega ................ Wonder Guard

B

Deoxys-Speed ............. No Guard, Wonder Guard

Dialga ........................... Mold Breaker, Magic Bounce

Gyarados ...................... Wonder Guard, Magic Bounce, Prankster, No Guard

Ludicolo ........................ Wonder Guard

Manectric-Mega .......... Wonder Guard

Registeel ....................... Magic Bounce, Prankster

Swampert-Mega ......... Wonder Guard

Thundurus .................... Wonder Guard

B-

Garchomp-Mega ........... Mold Breaker

Metagross-Mega ........... Prankster

Tyranitar-Mega .............. Mold Breaker, Huge Power, Poison Heal

Yveltal ............................. Magic Bounce, Magic Guard, Regenerator

Zekrom ........................... Mold Breaker

C Rank

Abomasnow-Mega ........ Refrigerate

Cresselia ......................... Wonder Guard

Gardevoir-Mega ............ Wonder Guard

Ho-Oh ............................. Magic Guard

Kyurem-Black................. Refrigerate

Kyurem-White................ Mold Breaker

Landorus-Therian.......... Wonder Guard

Lugia................................ Shadow Tag

Lucario-Mega................. Wonder Guard

Changelog

October 20, 2024

• Fixed Xerneas being at top of A instead of top of A+ by accident
• Imposter added as bolded ability for Blissey
• Magic Bounce added as italic ability for Dialga
• Regigigas added to top of A-

October 25, 2024

• Moved Mega Beedrill in 3rd in A+, above Mega Audino. This change was to fix an inconsistency related to the WG VR.
• Moved Mega Gengar to 1st in A, above Mega Diancie.
• Moved Primal Kyogre to 4th in A-, below Slaking.
• Made Wonder Guard a bold ability on Slaking.

Regarding the ORAS Pure Hackmons viability rankings, there's a lot of Pokemon I feel are missing and there's many of them who could reasonably serve a niche in the metagame strong enough to be worth ranking, however I'm mostly here today to propose just a few rank changes from the upper end of the viability rankings.

Primal Groudon: A+ -> S-
While its counterplay is quite effective at taking down Primal Groudon, the counterplay is highly limited and cannot fit into every team composition. When there's a lack of this counterplay, this Pokemon instantly becomes the most dangerous beast in the game to overcome and can easily overwhelm everything more effectively than either Mega Mewtwo X, Mega Rayquaza, or Mega Gyarados could otherwise. It should be worth mentioning that said counterplay could possibly be pressured and lost early on in games involving Primal Groudon, giving Primal Groudon a much easier time winning under the right plays. One could even per say run Shadow Tag with Fighting STAB, Fairy-type coverages, or any type of move Mega Gyarados is weak to, in order to get rid of it before Primal Groudon sets up a Shell Smash.

Primal Groudon is extremely important to answer in ORAS Pure Hackmons as not doing so renders this the most unstoppable Pokemon in the game imo and Primal Groudon will keep existing to show this. Despite that its best countermeasure by far is reduced to one particular Pokemon, Huge Power Mega Gyarados. The rest aren't as effective in the overall metagame and could add further liabilities to overall team compositions, such as Mega Abomasnow, Chesnaught, Ludicolo, and the likes. This Pokemon is broken and in a way that simply does not compare with the rest of the Pokemon within the A+ range but very easily does with the rest of S-. If this is ordered by viability, Primal Groudon should be the lowest S-, due to its ability to be easily shut down when having the right preparation, but if you lose that preparation early in the game or are unable to bring it, it's genuinely the biggest monster ORAS has to offer. Revenge-killing it is super difficult without that Gyarados as Primal Groudon is a tank who loves running King's Shield to neutralize Attack, and it can run an assortment of items like Lum Berry or Mental Herb to make Giratina frown. Being a tank makes it hard to even appropriately outspeed and KO Primal Groudon when it has x2 Speed x2 Atk and just 0.67x of what's base 160 Defense.

Slaking: A -> A+
Regigigas: A- -> A
Shadow Tag fakespeed is absolutely ridiculous and is immensely effective at revenge killing the likes of Mega Mewtwo X and Mega Rayquaza, the two of the most major offense threats in the whole game. Most other attackers not named Primal Groudon or holding Wonder Guard really hate these guys as well as they cannot escape getting heavily chipped/knocked out by fake out + extreme speed. With Silk Scarf, one fakespeed already takes down Mega Mewtwo X or Mega Rayquaza unless they carry the rare King's Shield, but this sacrifices options for coverage or set up in a way that hinders their performance in some games.

I've been given many test games against Glory over the past couple of months and have realized how arkeis managed to reach 97.6 GXE using Regigigas in far more games than any other Pokemon he uses, to the point where it felt like he was carrying that Pokemon around religiously. Its ability to revenge kill the most dominant offense threats in the game and more, outside Primal Groudon and Wonder Guards really, provides these two Pokemon overwhelming effectiveness unlike anything seen in Pokemon below A- rank.

Slaking should still be separated from Regigigas if the base rank continues to include Wonder Guard, as Slaking serves a better role as Wonder Guard than Regigigas. Otherwise there isn't a large inherent advantage in running Slaking over Regigigas in the vast majority of cases.

 

[Electra102]

My teambuilding process for my gen4ph Sand team​

Introduction​

Hai! i haven't made a non-resource post for gen4 in a while, so I thought I would take my current team and explain the process I went thorugh with creating and editing it. This post is going to be one of what I hope to be a series for gen4ph- a series where I try to explain how I approach and understand gen4ph, so that way others can (hopefully) learn the meta for themselves. With that being said, onto the first draft of my Sand team. It features Darkrai!

Note- this team is probably not going to become a sample. We already have a Sand team, and it still works to this day.

Drafts​

Draft 1- Darkrai Sand​

This is the first draft, so my explanation is going to be a bit longer than the others.

- My standard lead for most teams. Deoxys-Speed not only provides a lead but also provides a win condition in the case that Darkrai fails to sweep. Using Focus Sash on a Sand team was certainly a choice I made, though.

- An alternate Sand setter to Probopass. It has an even slower pivot than Probopass, and trades some SpD for some more Def. I honestly don't know why I put Aromatherapy on this, but I didn't really realize it until my last draft. Spoiler alert: Bastiodon doesn't usually stay on the field for very long.

- A Pokemon I had wanted to try for a while. It takes Fire Fangs very well with its massive base 200 Def, and gets a 1.5x boost to its SpD in the Sand (and its base SpD is already 100). I have seen this thing shrug off +6 Fire Fangs from Slaking before, but considering I'm also running an Arceus on this team, I should have ran a Swampert over Regirock so that way I didn't lose as hard to Huge Power Close Combat (which was a lesson I had to learn the hard way).

- I badly wanted a sleep answer, so I chose Toxic Orb + Magic Guard Ho-Oh, a set I had been thinking about for a while. The idea is that since it can almost never be Spored, I can click Aromatherapy on it semi-freely to wake everything up. Psycho Shift lets me spread around Toxic, and U-Turn lets me punish a Latios trying to trap me. I made it Adamant for some reason, though (although it did come in handy once when I was U-Turning on a Latios).

- Arceus needs no introduction. On this Arceus I ran a SubPass set I had been using for a while at this point on some other teams, and had quite a bit of success with it. Taunt is a surprise option that helps shut down any annoying mons reliant on their status moves, and it comes in handy almost every battle, even if the opponent knows it is coming. The main thing you want to SubPass to is Darkrai, so it can safely set up and start sweeping, but a SubPass to Deoxys-Speed could also work. This is the only set that received zero changes across all of the drafts.

- I'm not sure when I decided to add Darkrai, but the drafts of this team became how it proved itself to me. Darkrai serves as a Mold Breaker Rapid Spinner that can severely punish Ghost-types attempting to spinblock. It also serves as a wincondition for this team, becoming a sweeper with Nasty Plot. With +Spe you outspeed almost everything you want to, and a +2 Dread Plate Judgment hits rather hard. The main problem this Darkrai set has is that it slowly dies in Sand, but I fixed that in the next draft.

Draft 2- Copy of Darkrai Sand​

Time for my second draft! Here are the changes I made-

- Deoxys-Speed was removed, and now Bastiodon is the lead. It usually switches out turn 1, though. Bastiodon now also has Stealth Rock over Spikes.

- Replaced Protect with Magic Coat (so I could counter my own Wonder Guard Belly Drum Slaking set), and I replaced Baton Pass with U-Turn. That choice was (for some reason) reverted in the next draft. Mail was also given to Regirock so that way I don't lose as hard to TrickScarf leads, and even if they Baton Pass to something like a Shadow Tag Latios, Regirock can take a Seed Flare or a Focus Blast if it is in the Sand.

- Was accidentally made Adamant in the original draft, so I fixed it (it is now Impish). A +SpD nature could also work.

- Swapped out Dread Plate + Judgment for Leftovers + Dark Pulse. Now it no longer slowly dies in the Sand! However, this comes at the cost of no longer OHKOing Latios at +2. For comparison-
+2 252 SpA Dread Plate Darkrai Judgment vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Soul Dew Latios: 398-470 (109.3 - 129.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ SpA Darkrai Dark Pulse vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Soul Dew Latios: 290-344 (79.6 - 94.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

- I found I was somewhat struggling against Fire Fang (especially from my own sample team), despite my Regirock, so I decided to run a Flash Fire set with my newly-freed teamslot. Rapid Spin allows me to clear hazards for a weakened Darkrai to come in and receive a Wish, Whirlwind denies setup, and Spikes was moved from Bastiodon onto this. If you can surprise a Fire Fang sweeper with the wrong coverage, you can set up a layer or two of Spikes before you have to Whirlwind them.

Draft 3- Tyranitar Sand​

- Only change I really made was swapping out Nasty Plot Darkrai for Dragon Dance Tyranitar. Tyranitar does the same thing Darkrai does, just with sweeping with Crunch and Dragon Dance instead of Dark Pulse and Nasty Plot. My justification for using Tyranitar was that it dealt more immediate damage and was immune to Sand. Unfortunately, I lost all of the benefits Darkrai had because of its speed, which means I now lose even harder to Huge Power + Close Combat.

Draft 4- Updated Sand​

This is the final iteration of my sand team.

I rebuilt part of this team to include a new win condition- Toxic Spikes. Now, even if my Mold Breaker sweeper faints, I can still pull off a win. Failing to sweep has lost me a game before, so having a second win condition is very nice. Also I finally realized I had Aromatherapy twice, and gave Bastiodon Taunt instead (still subject to change).

I noticed (with help from AV Cosmoem and NToTheN) that my Huge Power + Close Combat matchup was horrible. Both of my Wonder Guards couldn't last against it, and depending on the coverage, the rest of my team could be shredded.

- Swampert was chosen to replace Regirock for a few reasons- it still resists Fire Fang and still has a Sandstorm immunity. Unlike Regirock, however, it is not weak to Close Combat, and its ONLY weakness is to Grass. This puts a Huge Power in a situation where they either have to sacrifice hitting one of my mons, or they can no longer set up. Leaf Blade/Power Whip is needed to hit Swampert, Close Combat is needed to hit Arceus, Thunder Punch is needed against Ho-Oh, and they need to run Fire Fang or else they lose the ability to hit very many Wonder Guards. This adds up to four moves, which means something has to go, whether it be coverage or a setup move.

- Darkrai returns to replace Tyranitar mainly because of its speed. It crucially outspeeds Infernape, which means I could theoretically pick it off after it takes quite a lot of chip and has some SpD drops from using Close Combat. For reference- 252 SpA Darkrai Dark Pulse vs. -1 252 HP / 252 SpD Infernape: 99-117 (27.8 - 32.8%) -- guaranteed 4HKO. Flinches could also save my ass if I get lucky enough. Tyranitar also needs several boosts to start OHKOing things, whereas Darkrai only needs a single Nasty Plot to start OHKOing. Darkrai also doesn't need a boost to outspeed most things- base 125 Spe goes crazy. Since I'm relying more on Toxic Spikes now, I dropped Spore for Recover, so that way I no longer need to pass it any Wishes.

- I gave Arceus Mail over Swampert because Swampert will be outsped and OHKOed by Seed Flare from Shadow Tag Latios. Arceus outspeeds Latios and can pivot out with Baton Pass, and can even take a Focus Blast or fish for misses with Substitute.

Conclusion​

This team was a lot of fun to make, and I feel like I learned quite a bit about the format while doing so. I hope this post is helpful for anyone trying to learn teambuilding in gen4ph. I also want to thank lag=bad, AV Cosmoem, and NToTheN for all of the help they gave to me and my team- the team would not have been nearly as good without you three.

Finally, I have no idea what the next post will be about, nor when I will have it ready.

Thank you for reading
-electra​

 

[isleep2late]

Hello everyone! I don't come here very often, and I was even MIA for the last few years due to drama from another community, but I wanted to share something that I've shared on the Pure Hackmons discord server that I don't think many people are aware of: In Pokemon Red/Blue/Yellow, there is a save editor that lets you modify a Pokemon's typing, and more! Here is a proof of concept. I modified a Snorlax to be Ghost/Flying, ran it through a link cable battle, and this is what happens:

As you can see, Snorlax is immune to both Earthquake AND Body Slam. It's pretty incredible, because I thought this was an in-game glitch that would only work vs Gym Leaders and trainers, but you can actually do this against other players via link battles.

Anyway, the program that lets you do this is called Pikasav, created by Ritchie / xJakub on github. It's out there on the internet and can be found via simple online search. The program also lets you modify a Pokemon's sprite, which means you can effectively build-your-own Pokemon, using a Pokemon's sprite, any pre-existing Base Stat spread, and choose whichever Pokemon typing combination you want.

IDK if this would be appropriate to mention, but I thought I'd mention it here. IDK if anyone here is responsible for Pokemon Showdown, but I think there is some level of interest to have this feature of Gen 1 Pure Hackmons accurately reflected on the Showdown servers (since this is technically within the ability of the Gen 1 mechanics and would be within the spirit of what Pure Hackmons stands for). It is unclear how much this actually matters... as I'm sure the Gen 1 PH playerbase is in the dozens.

If this were actually implemented in a tournament setting, I'm sure it would have a lot of interesting consequences. For example, some in the server have pointed out that this basically gives every pokemon immunity to Quick Attack. It also means that any pokemon can have a base speed stat of 140, and more interestingly, every pokemon has some form of Zoroark's Illusion ability (if we implement the sprite hack).

Let me know your thoughts. Thanks for reading,
-IS2L

 

[Crep50]

Let me know your thoughts. Thanks for reading,
-IS2L

This will be Balanced Createmons in 1998

Jokes aside, this is quite the development! So, here are some thoughts from someone way under-qualified

If I recall, isn’t it (supposedly) also possible to start pre-statused in a link battle? This is something not implemented onto showdown, and so it makes me wonder if the type changing will ever be added, either.

If both get added, this leads to some strange implications/impacts on the meta.
Spore becomes wildly less useful because of everything starting with a better status, rest becomes actively bad (especially when everything gets soft boiled), and I’m guessing Ghost/Normal runs amuck, with no weaknesses, two resistances (which don’t matter) and two immunities (of which only one - maybe two if counting HJK - matters, being normal)

Like mentioned, Every pokemon can look like another pokemon - this means that every pokemon will likely do this, to disguise what it is.

Most Pokémon probably run mewtwo stats, or something bulkier like snorlax/chansey, every fast special attacker prefers to start the match burned, instead of paralyzed, and hyper beam Ghost/Normals likely either start poisoned or start without status.

Finally - Psychics beware, for pin missile can be put onto multiple actually viable stat spreads, not just jolteon anymore!

Quick side note: please fact check what I have said here - I’m very unfamiliar with Gen 1 as a whole and probably got something very wrong

Quick question too: why would many pokemon be immune to quick attack? Is that just due to ghost being common or is there some other, more jank reason for it?