Well, sometimes you don't have a choice. But here's the problem; if you have to 2hko, or kill 2 things in a row with Focus Blast, you have only a 49% chance of both hits connecting! That's terrible if you are trying to sweep. At least other moves, like Fire Blast and Stone Edge, have a greater than 60% of getting 2 hits in.
-
Check out the relaunch of our general collection, with classic designs and new ones by our very own Pissog!
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
The Uber Metagame: a Fun "Change of Pace"
- Thread starter Kir
- Start date
- Status
Well, sometimes you don't have a choice. But here's the problem; if you have to 2hko, or kill 2 things in a row with Focus Blast, you have only a 49% chance of both hits connecting! That's terrible if you are trying to sweep. At least other moves, like Fire Blast and Stone Edge, have a greater than 60% of getting 2 hits in.
The only problem with this is that Darkrai must have a speed iv of 30. : (
I have been using Wobbuffet and Giratina-O together, and it brutaly slaughters almost every stall team I have faced. Basicly, Wobbuffet encores something like Lugia, and sets up Giratina-O for a sweep. This works because stall teams don't have much of an answer for Giratina-O except Latias.
Focus Blast isn't awful. It provides great coverage alongside Dark Pulse with Darkrai, and perhaps most importantly, it can OHKO opposing Darkrai.
By your logical, I could argue that Hypnosis is AWFUL. Look how common Gengar was in OU before it got nerfed from 70% to 60%. If it missed, Gengar was dead thanks to paper defences. Focus Blast has the exact same accuracy, with a very high base power, great offensive typing, usually providing great coverage alongside other moves, and it has a 30% chance of lowering SDef.
However, Aura Sphere > Focus Blast in most scenarios. The only exception is on Scarf Mewtwo, when Focus Blast is needed to OHKO Darkrai, where as Aura Sphere ony has a 15.38% chance. There is no way I'm using Aura Sphere when I have the ability to outspeed and OHKO such a prominent threat. And in case of a miss, Darkrai will never OHKO; worse case scenario is Dark Void, and that move only hits 10% more often than Focus Blast.
If Giratina has Outrage, Latias won't want to swap into it. Use the mixed attacker set, as that works best against the majority of stall teams - Draco Meteor for Groudon and Giratina, Thunder for Lugia and Forretress, Outrage for Latias and Blissey.
Its probaly because Latias Can actully beat Kyogre with some prediction, plus trappers like Scizor and Tyranitar beat them.
IMO because it doesn't matter how huge SDef you have when almost every uber has something that hit you super effective. Things like Darkrai, Mewtwo, ScarfPalkia are faster than you and can OHKO you. You can't OHKO bulky mons like Groudon but they can OHKO you back.
L@tias have too many weaknesses and they need CM to really sweep.
No. Just no
Darkrai does <50% to Latias with unboosted Dark Pulse
4 Attack Mewtwo is beaten by Latias one on one unless it has Selfdestruct, but that obviousy means killing itself.
Scarf Palkia won't OHKO Latias and she'll OHKO Palkia back (unless Palkia has Outrage).
I don't think this applies to Latios though, hence its rairity.
Yeah. Latios, while being two sided in Suspect (either being too strong or underwhelming), does not seem to have a whole lot of luster in ubers because the 20 points drop in Special Defense turns 3HKOes into 2HKOes and is really dented by Kyogre.
Latias is about the closest thing you'll have to a true Kyogre counter. Besides Shedinja, who dies to SR.
Latias is about the closest thing you'll have to a true Kyogre counter. Besides Shedinja, who dies to SR.
^^^^ Eh, I think that throughout an entire game, Blissy is better, as long as you can weaken that Water Spout in some way. Because Latias is still 2hkoed rather easily by Ice Beam.
The main problem with Kyogre is that you need someone to absorb the Spout (or prevent it from pulling one off in the first place but that might not be so easy), and Blissey alone can't do that. Most Kyogres I've faced tend to spam Water Spouts until their HP is low enough.
Despite Latias getting 2HKOed by Specs Beam, I feel safer against Kyogre due to that factor. That and the fact that Latias stops pretty much Kyogre's whole moveset, unlike Bliss (who can't take on Rest/Talk or 101 HP Sub), or Palkia (who takes an insane amount from Thunder and can't really stop CM/Surf/IB/Thunder unless it decides to Specs itself)
Despite Latias getting 2HKOed by Specs Beam, I feel safer against Kyogre due to that factor. That and the fact that Latias stops pretty much Kyogre's whole moveset, unlike Bliss (who can't take on Rest/Talk or 101 HP Sub), or Palkia (who takes an insane amount from Thunder and can't really stop CM/Surf/IB/Thunder unless it decides to Specs itself)
Too be quite honest, I think Specsogre isn't as great as it use to be. While it is powerful, not only do most teams prepare for it, but its wall breaking powers vanish once its under 75%. However, CM ogre and its varients need to be used more, as they seem like they would destroy a lot of teams today. For example, Scarf Palkia often switches in to Kyogre expecting a Water Spout, but a Calm Mind could really screw him over.
I thought a life orbed dark pulse from a neutral nature darkrai always 2HKOs Latias with 112 HP / 0 sp.def EVs? Of course, if latias has already CM'd it can't 2HKO, but still...
Personally, I tend to switch my Blissey on the Kyogre instead of latias, because most of the kyogres I've faced carry thunder-wave, and that really cripples my latias every time she switches in (no, latias didn't carry refresh that time). Blissey doesn't really mind being paralyzed, unlike latias.
Just based on my experiences.
I was commenting on the fact that Latios is much rarer thanks to the fact that it can't survive as many hits as Latias.
But latios's higher special attack pays off more though, and calm mind can bolsten up Latios's special defense to take more special hits anyways.
Maybe it's because I use latios more in ubers than latias that's why.
The thing is...I can say the same about Latias except in reverse. CM lets Latias absorb even ridiculously powerful SE attacks, and bolsters her SA to kill stuff.
But really...Latias is being used more because she swaps into the #1 Pokemon and a few others easier than Latios. Latios can be OHKOed by Specs Ice Beam after SR damage, for instance. While the extra power is indeed threatening, a lot of people found it hard to sacrifice the need to survive for extra damage.
I said unboosted, and didn't mention Life Orb.
I've joined the revolution of those using Tickle Wobbuffet in Ubers to kill Blissey and Lugia, so I'd like to recommend Weavile as the Pursuiter of choice for finishing off those -6 Defense walls. STAB Ice Shard, Pursuit and a fast Night Slash are all godsends in the Ubers metagame revolving around Dragons and Psychics. I've been using Life Orb, and it's great so far. Perhaps not so obviously, Weavile is great insurance against Double Screen Mew Baton Pass teams, since it has Brick Break to take down screens and Night Slash for hitting Mew.
Edit: I should mention that Wobbuffet alone is good reason to use Shed Shell as your item of choice for Blissey. Lugia is a little harder, it needs Leftovers are bit more than Blissey does since fewer physical attackers are choiced or use stat-lowering moves like Dracor Meteor.
Edit: I should mention that Wobbuffet alone is good reason to use Shed Shell as your item of choice for Blissey. Lugia is a little harder, it needs Leftovers are bit more than Blissey does since fewer physical attackers are choiced or use stat-lowering moves like Dracor Meteor.
^^^^ Mmm, sounds quite good actually.
I should probabl incorporate Wobbafett somewhere on my team. The ultimate trapper.
I should probabl incorporate Wobbafett somewhere on my team. The ultimate trapper.
Wobbuffet in general needs to be used more, as he can benefit a lot of Uber teams. For example, he can help Offensive teams set-up by encoring a move a sweeper is immune to. He can also revenge kill several threats such as Scarf Palkia. Wobbuffet is also a great way to beat Lugia and Blissey, whether its via tickle or encore. Wobbuffet's main problem is that thanks to his lack of a recovery move, he really needs wish support to work well. Wobbuffet's other problem is that he can't take on some of the hardest hitters in Ubers, such as DD Rayquaza, Specs ogre, and Darkrai in general. But despite these big issues, Wobbuffet has been working wonderfully for me.
could someone test out a set ive been thinking of for me, as its midterms and i have absolutely no free time to play shoddy. anyways, here the set
latios@ soul dew
modest 252 Spd 252 SpA 4 Hp
-substitute
-draco meteor
-HP fire
-surf
So pretty much get this thing in and substitute if you do not know what your opponent is going to switch in. This thing pretty much kills everything not named blissey, and maybe a scizor in the rain.
a 210 power move off 591 SpA is scary and pretty much almost kills anything that does not resist it or is named blissey. For pokemon such as scizor, jirachi and forrestress that do resist it, Surf or HP fire are all 2HKO's depending on which type of weather is present.
This is all theorymon here, but i think that this set is a very good lure and can take out at least 1 pokemon on a team that lacks blissey. He could even be paired with a wobboffet to set up a RP groudon on a team that has blissey as his latios counter.
latios@ soul dew
modest 252 Spd 252 SpA 4 Hp
-substitute
-draco meteor
-HP fire
-surf
So pretty much get this thing in and substitute if you do not know what your opponent is going to switch in. This thing pretty much kills everything not named blissey, and maybe a scizor in the rain.
a 210 power move off 591 SpA is scary and pretty much almost kills anything that does not resist it or is named blissey. For pokemon such as scizor, jirachi and forrestress that do resist it, Surf or HP fire are all 2HKO's depending on which type of weather is present.
This is all theorymon here, but i think that this set is a very good lure and can take out at least 1 pokemon on a team that lacks blissey. He could even be paired with a wobboffet to set up a RP groudon on a team that has blissey as his latios counter.
- Status