Metagame Trademarked

After a while of pondering, and also the fortune of parting shot being banned on ladder due to breaking the games, I was able to come to a conclusion on parting shots presence in the meta.

Now parting shot was something limited back in the prior generation when trademarks could be run as many times on your team as it wanted because you could basically reduce your opponents stats to an absolute low then send in your setup sweeper with complete safety.
Now that it has been limited it cant directly cause this without a few specific circumstances as some have shown. However, that isnt the reason I feel it needs to be banned.

After trademarked was given a ladder, it was not long before many how found various loops that could be abused alongside other trademarks with parting shot, such as wish, substitute or kings shield smeargle. There is even a team posted earlier on in this thread showing a gimic done with simple beam. Parting shot makes it extremely hard for you to ever break your opponents team as they can reduce two of your stats and then pivot out into something that your mon will be no longer be able to break after being debuffed, all in a single instant. You could even run one mon with a trademark that drops atk and one that drops spa alongside it and essentially prevent ur opponent from ever taking any major chunk out of your mons unless u run focus energy or laser focus as trademark. Parting shot provides more safety to switching in than anything ever should and especially in conjunction with other trademarks. And in all honesty, despite my request and especially after wading in and out of the server, there doesnt seem to be any real opposition to it leaving or any wants for it to stay outside of people wanting to abuse it themselves to their opponents displeasure. That and it was already breaking games as is cause of infinite loops lol

So to rap this all up, Parting Shot is now BANNED as a trademark. tagging The Immortal , though its already banned on main anyway, so it can just stay that way.


Now I also heard people complaining about substitute. Substitute I would rather wait at least about 3 days to see how it fits in the meta and properly see if many are considering it bannable (also dont wanna go on a ban happy run), at which I would rather hold a suspect for it. I would like to at least see feedback on it over that time and replays showing it being broken, as Im not free most of my day to confirm for myself and Trademark lacks a council as of the moment.

Nonetheless, thanks to those who read and are playing trademarked, any feedback given is greatly appreciated. Hope you all have a Blessed Day :D
 
i only have one reply at the moment showing this but wish seems to be bugged, its happened a few times and idk where its going, check turn 14-15 Whitephoenixace

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-902522423
Wish when switching in at battle start or coming in after a faint behaves differently from Wish when switching in normally (i.e. be delayed by a turn). The most intuitive explanation I can offer is that the switch in and move activation happens at the start of the next turn, rather than as part of the same turn when switching in normally. The confusion is mostly caused by the way in which PS! orders the turn text, with the pre-turn stuff being displayed in the previous turn's section (or before the first turn for start of game stuff).

By the way, here's some stuff I've been messing around with to fill the gaping void in my heart left by banning Parting Shot: Level 1 Meowth-Alola. Alolan Meowth manages to reach 11 HP at level one with 0 IVs, allowing it to make use of the Lefties-Substitute-Protect combo. It also has access to Parting Shot to use whenever it manages to get in with the sub intact, and is able to use Fake Out to recover an additional point of HP, allowing it to regain HP lost when coming in hard off a faint or when using Parting Shot without protecting first for momentum (E: or HP lost from entry hazards, of course). Especially effective when paired with slow U-turn shenanigans allowing it to Parting Shot effectively.
 
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E4 Flint

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Fun OM though I have only begun playing it in earnest. I like the synergy between Tailwind@Zapdos, Transform@Mew and Wish@Chansey and pretty much any of your Sub sweepers. I additionally tried Lagging Tail Uturn on the Tailwind mon to get that unexpected momentum on people and bring other things in safely.
 

Snaquaza

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I tested something today...

Smeargle @ Focus Sash
Ability: ingrain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spore
- Skill Swap
- Parting Shot
- Magic Coat / Lunar Dance / Memento / Anything

You simply Skill Swap your Ingrain onto the opponent, and Spore them for support. Then you pivot out to a different Pokemon, getting rid of your trap, while your opponent stays trapped (unless they can pivot too, or are a Ghost-type). After this, you can freely abuse the opposing Pokemon as they're completely trapped. You can set up on them, or just simply remove them from a defensive core if you're facing stall. It costs a teamslot, but I feel like this could be devastating when supported with other Pokemon that can take advantage of trapped Pokemon.

(Side note: can also be used on Lilligant with Healing Wish / Trevenant can Ingrain + Skill Swap and switch out due to Ghost-type)
 
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Mew @ Choice Scarf
Ability: transform
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psychic

I want to say why Mew Transform is strong

Transform :
Trick room : Stop Opposend Trick Room
Tail Wind : Use Tail Wind to
Terrain : Stop Terrain
Stat Boost : Double
Sub : Resub
Spikes : Respikes
Heart swap : Reswap
Destiny Bond : You know
 
I tested something today...

Smeargle @ Focus Sash
Ability: ingrain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spore
- Skill Swap
- Parting Shot
- Magic Coat / Lunar Dance / Memento / Anything

You simply Skill Swap your Ingrain onto the opponent, and Spore them for support. Then you pivot out to a different Pokemon, getting rid of your trap, while your opponent stays trapped (unless they can pivot too, or are a Ghost-type). After this, you can freely abuse the opposing Pokemon as they're completely trapped. You can set up on them, or just simply remove them from a defensive core if you're facing stall. It costs a teamslot, but I feel like this could be devastating when supported with other Pokemon that can take advantage of trapped Pokemon.

(Side note: can also be used on Lilligant with Healing Wish / Trevenant can Ingrain + Skill Swap and switch out due to Ghost-type)
How often do you hit an opposing Pokemon with U-turn or Volt Switch (or Parting Shot) with Skill Swap?
 
I've been playing around with this Duo a bit and would like to share it:

Infernape @ Fightinium Z
Ability: nastyplot
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fire Blast
- Focus Blast
- Vacuum Wave
- Grass Knot

Greninja @ Choice Scarf
Ability: spikes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- U-turn
- Ice Beam
- Scald
- Dark Pulse

Infernape is here because I wanted to use it. I thought about all the Kartanas I was seeing and realized that Infernape gets a special priority move that Kartana is weak to. Then I remembered that it gets Nasty Plot for an instant plus two and a decent speed tier. While Pokemon like Toxapex can switch into it, a lot of things on offensive teams don't look forward to taking a plus two fire blast or All Out Pummeling based on Focus Blast. The last slot is customizable, Grass Knot being there in case I think an opponent is going to try and switch in Rain Dance Swampert on the Fire Blast.

Spikes Scarfed Ninja is a great spiker. Able to get spikes up multiple times in one game, it can abuse U-Turn to hit Hoopa-U hard, keep momentum, and guarantee a second layer the next time it comes in. The move set itself is customizable, as is the case with Greninja generally although I opted for Ice Beam and dual stabs because of the loss of Protean.
 
Came up with a fun set, might be worth trying.

Araquanid @ Leftovers
Ability: Soak
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spider Web
- Toxic
- Rest
- Aqua Ring

Also question: How strong is magic bounce in this meta?
 
Came up with a fun set, might be worth trying.

Araquanid @ Leftovers
Ability: Soak
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spider Web
- Toxic
- Rest
- Aqua Ring

Also question: How strong is magic bounce in this meta?
Pretty strong, since it bounces back trademarks. Someone switched their crobat in on my Mega Sableye, immediately screeched, which bounced backed and halved its defense, and then dropped to knock off (to be fair it also crit). It's very useful for punishing hazard and status trademarks.
 
Charizard-Mega-X @ Charizardite X
Ability: Belly Drum
EVs: 252 Atk / 8 SpD / 248 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
- Roost
Very situational and I'm not sure how good this even is, but it's an ok sweeper.
 
Charizard-Mega-X @ Charizardite X
Ability: Belly Drum
EVs: 252 Atk / 8 SpD / 248 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
- Roost
Very situational and I'm not sure how good this even is, but it's an ok sweeper.
Why not 252 Speed? Looks like it could break stall teams that rely on defense boosts as opposed to haze/unaware.
 
Anyone else having trouble with ingrain (trademark) + skill swap? It's very uncompetitive, and I understand why it's not as bad as mean look in some ways (you need skill swap in your moveset, and you need an extra turn to use it). However, skill swap bypasses magic bounce; and, more importantly, the trapper can switch out after trapping the opponent, while they remain trapped. So for example, if you can check something with your trevenant, you can force it out, skill swap ingrain on the switch in, and switch to a check for that switch in (which can't switch out).
 
Anyone else having trouble with ingrain (trademark) + skill swap? It's very uncompetitive, and I understand why it's not as bad as mean look in some ways (you need skill swap in your moveset, and you need an extra turn to use it). However, skill swap bypasses magic bounce; and, more importantly, the trapper can switch out after trapping the opponent, while they remain trapped. So for example, if you can check something with your trevenant, you can force it out, skill swap ingrain on the switch in, and switch to a check for that switch in (which can't switch out).
Ingrain is very predictable and the pokemon who learn it usually don’t have any damage output, as long as you’re running a uturn/volt switch pokemon you’re gonna be fine.
 
So to rap this all up, Parting Shot is now BANNED as a trademark. tagging The Immortal , though its already banned on main anyway, so it can just stay that way.


Now I also heard people complaining about substitute. Substitute I would rather wait at least about 3 days to see how it fits in the meta and properly see if many are considering it bannable (also dont wanna go on a ban happy run), at which I would rather hold a suspect for it. I would like to at least see feedback on it over that time and replays showing it being broken, as Im not free most of my day to confirm for myself and Trademark lacks a council as of the moment.

Nonetheless, thanks to those who read and are playing trademarked, any feedback given is greatly appreciated. Hope you all have a Blessed Day :D
Gotta say, thanks for doing this. PShot was super-abusable and allowed easier offensive or defensive switchins almost for free.

Also, if you guys want an idea on how the "infinite loops" with Parting Shot worked, here's a sample team I crafted that exemplifies an near-infinite stall loop: https://pokepast.es/c314a1bac14ce8a8


Okay, onto the main point at hand. I'm just listing down things that people want to see suspected or banned so far. This is not a call for all of these to be banned on the spot, just a list of what people are talking about and have the possibility of becoming a major problem:
  • Substitute: Allows a free switchin or setup opportunity for almost anything. Can make some incoming threats nearly impossible to revenge kill as it grabs a kill almost for free. This gives the player ample time to control setup opportunities and snuff counterplay, sometimes enabling win conditions like Victini to go off uncontested. Especially problematic with...
  • Wish: Grants every Pokemon a recovery option, making Stall and balanced offense incredibly consistent. Chansey gives the team near-full heals for free while offering crazy cleric support. It just makes teams incredibly difficult to take down without a dedicated breaker.
  • Yawn: Kind of confused why this move is allowed when other sleep-inducing moves aren't. It forces the opponent into unfavorable situations that could either inconvenience their momentum, force undeserved switches, or change the game around completely. Frankly, this should have been banned with the other sleeping moves under principle and seems more like a loophole than a legit strategy.

  • Hoopa-U: Can break through just about anything and has almost no counters. It can come in with either Substitute for a free switchin or extreme difficulty revenge killing it, Laser Focus to gain a free power boost off a single crit (primarily for physical sets) that can't be removed by Haze or Heart Swap, or Nasty Plot for easier nuking capabilities (for special sets). Coverage and raw powerr means that almost nothing can safely switch into it boosted or not, which means it will almost always net a kill at the right moment.
  • Kartana: Much less so than Hoopa-U, but crazy for the same circumstances. Stupidly strong on its own and can nab free boosts off Trademarked mechanics for even more destruction.
  • Xurkitree: Mentioning this because it's on the original watchlist, but acts the same as Hoopa-U and Kartana despite its differences. Can completely break apart teams with raw power and access to Tail Glow. Unlike most other boosters, it has an exceptionally good matchup against most common Haze users, making it incredibly difficult to prevent the sweep.
 

The Immortal

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I've been informed that the current mechanics are correct. If Stealth Rock for example were an ability in-game, the opposing Pokemon would take damage in the case of a double switch.

Also, I've played a lot of TM games and imo after the Parting Shot ban, there isn't really a pressing issue. Meta is mostly fine and I would let it develop.
 
How does Endure work? I’d assume it works like normal, but does it fail ever? Also, King’s Shield isn’t mentioned to be banned in the OP. Is it meant to not be banned?
 
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How does Endure work? I’d assume it works like normal, but does it fail ever? Also, King’s Shield isn’t mentioned to be banned in the OP. Is it meant to not be banned?
King’s shield isn’t banned because smeargle is the only pokemon that can learn it and most of the time all it does is use hazards
 
So, I've been using this anti-breaker set, but unfortunately I haven't gotten much use out of it. Perhaps the threats it is meant to check (Xurkitree, Hoopa-U, and Blacephalon) just aren't that popular. Anyway, because I haven't gotten much use out of it, I was thinking of replacing it. But I'm also reluctant to do so. What do you think?

Shuckle @ Assault Vest
Ability: Power Split
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Earth Power
- Knock Off
- Bug Bite
- Rock Slide

Because of Shuckle's terrible offensive stats, power split nearly halves the opponent's offensive stats. Furthermore, because the Pokemon it checks have such high offensive stats, Shuckle gets decent offensive stats to work with.

Bug bite targets Hoopa's low defence, and hits 4x effectively. Assault vest allows it to check specs Xurkitree, which is 2HKOed by earth power after power split. Knock off helps Shuckle and the team better wall the threats it checks, as they rely on choice items to even get close to 2HKOing Shuckle. Rock slide is mostly filler; it would hit Blace hard, but Blace tends to minimize attack, making Shuckle's attack poor. Ancient power is only as strong as earth power, so that's pointless. It could be useful for Volcarona, but that's not particularly hard to wall with other Pokemon anyway.

Does Shuckle have a place in this meta? What could I have in the 4th move slot?
 
So, I've been using this anti-breaker set, but unfortunately I haven't gotten much use out of it. Perhaps the threats it is meant to check (Xurkitree, Hoopa-U, and Blacephalon) just aren't that popular. Anyway, because I haven't gotten much use out of it, I was thinking of replacing it. But I'm also reluctant to do so. What do you think?

Shuckle @ Assault Vest
Ability: Power Split
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Earth Power
- Knock Off
- Bug Bite
- Rock Slide

Because of Shuckle's terrible offensive stats, power split nearly halves the opponent's offensive stats. Furthermore, because the Pokemon it checks have such high offensive stats, Shuckle gets decent offensive stats to work with.

Bug bite targets Hoopa's low defence, and hits 4x effectively. Assault vest allows it to check specs Xurkitree, which is 2HKOed by earth power after power split. Knock off helps Shuckle and the team better wall the threats it checks, as they rely on choice items to even get close to 2HKOing Shuckle. Rock slide is mostly filler; it would hit Blace hard, but Blace tends to minimize attack, making Shuckle's attack poor. Ancient power is only as strong as earth power, so that's pointless. It could be useful for Volcarona, but that's not particularly hard to wall with other Pokemon anyway.

Does Shuckle have a place in this meta? What could I have in the 4th move slot?
Maybe Infestation so that when the opponent switches out to something that can deal with Shuckle, you can then switch without fear of the opponent double switching?
 

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