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WishiWashi Discussion

Stairs Of Learning said:
almost every wild pokes can call help. they also can do this multiple time in 1 battle. not every attempt are succeeded tho. solo wishiwashi from the trial (not totem wishiwashi) succeded at calling for help 4 times.... in a row.... in one battle
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Oh... another feature from MOTHER that has reached Pokemon.
 
So "hordes" are somewhat back. That's kinda nice.

Either way... I don't think Wishiwashi will be used much. It's gonna be one of those mons you only see in metas that change abilities or stats (speed/HP). But it sure is a monster at over 25% hp. Also I just noticed it has U-Turn. Nice
 
Stairs Of Learning said:
Schooling and Wishiwashi in battle: https://vid.me/Nq1h

if you choose to attack instead of helping hand (assuming the wingull survives it) it would be:

>wingull used quick attack
>wishiwashi's health down to below 25%
>wishiwashi used brine (or whatever)
>wishiwashi reverts back to solo form
>end of the turn
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Better, but still pretty damn bad. Sure, you can recover its School Form but for that Wishiwashi has got to survive a full turn in its base form which is, mind you, weaker than Sunkern. RestTalk seems like the best set for it, but again, it is abysmally weak outside its school form and no where near fast enough to even recover hp before getting bopped.

Something that learns both Trick Room and Heal Pulse could work as a partner for it in doubles; Mega Audino comes to mind, however viable that may be.
 
Corrin said:
Better, but still pretty damn bad. Sure, you can recover its School Form but for that Wishiwashi has got to survive a full turn in its base form which is, mind you, weaker than Sunkern. RestTalk seems like the best set for it, but again, it is abysmally weak outside its school form and no where near fast enough to even recover hp before getting bopped.

Something that learns both Trick Room and Heal Pulse could work as a partner for it in doubles; Mega Audino comes to mind, however viable that may be.
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Ribombee could work with Speed Swap, Pollen Puff, and Sweet Scent. Speed Swap for semi-permanent speed boost, Pollen Puff for healing, and Sweet Scent because Wishiwashi may need to run Muddy Water instead of Surf to avoid murdering Ribombee.
 
Love the design don't think it will be good in doubles in the grand scheme of things but I'll definitely be trying it out. With redirection from like Amoonguss or Clefairy(friend guard+heal pulse?) could be usable. Limited move pool unfortunately, probably will be using Hydro, Ice Beam, Hp Fire, Protect because it literally doesn't get anything better :(
 
low speed is easily fixable, and low HP is not bad combined with those beastly defences and huge attacks. This guy will be fine. Solo its a little harder but in doubles this thing will kill everything. Ribombee is probably a match made in heaven for this guy. Speed swap to make it increadibly fast(still want to know if the turn you do the speed swap will count for its speed, so it will go right after the bee, or will it still be using the 45 at the time), and pollen puff to heal any sort of damage it takes.
 
This thing looks incredible and reinforces to me that speed management is going to be a huge part of the meta going forward, tailwind, quash, Trick Room, Weather speed-boosting, status z-move side effects, priority, and anti-priority are going to be really important this gen. I agree that this mon will probably be a good sitrus berry user, leftovers are another possibility to increase the number of turns until this thing stops schooling, and even punish enemies for switching and such by potentially bringing it back up, in that case, i'd be tempted to run it with protect, attack every other turn to keep it's health up.
 
A Healing Wish user would really benefit Wishiwashi. If I understand it correctly, a solo fish that receives a Healing Wish would school up when it comes in, when the turn ends.
 
Hourai said:
I'm surprised nobody has noticed that its normal form has dethroned Sunkern for the dubious "honor" of being the Pokemon with the lowest BST. I'm not joking, it has 5 lower BST than Sunkern.
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Oh I noticed.

Anyway...

But when it is in School forme, it seems pretty good. It gets a quite a few STAB options, particularly Scald, Hydro Pump, or Waterfall. However, it lacks coverage, with it's only main options being Earthquake and Ice Beam. The HP and Spe are not good at all, but 130 and 135 and the defensive stats (not including HP is nuts), and isn't a fat annoying wall considering it has 140 in each of the offenses. Overall, I think this thing has a lot of potential to succeed, but also has the potential to fall flat on the ground.

However, it's ability is EXTREMELY gimmicky, don't know what there thing is with mid-battle forms, along with Ash-Greninja and Zygarde. Depending on how gimmicky it's ability, it could go anywhere from OU-NU, I believe.
 
Is it me, or did GameFreak just made a giant 26'11 ft (8.2 m) sardine/pilchard Pokemon with 45 HP base? Come on. This fish would of been decent if at least had Aqua Jet.

Highly above average attack, defense, special attack, and special defense + 30 speed base? Well, this Pokemon is no threat once its HP is down. RU worthy.
 
That HP is absolute trash which sadly makes sense in order to balance this Poke. I'm fine with this being slow as crap. Though that extremely abysmal HP stat ruins it's great defenses and good typing to go along with it. At least the Schooling gimmick isn't as bad as Darmanitan Zen Mode, this little fish is at the very least usable to some extent.
 
Agent Gibbs said:
The good news is that its speed is so awful that you might as well just go mixed with a Quiet or Brave nature, which alleviates the movepool problem somewhat. Pick either Scald/Hydro Pump or Waterfall depending on whether you want to put a larger emphasis on physical or special offense, and then pad the rest of the moveset with U-turn/Ice Beam/Earthquake. Not that you have many other options anyway. Maybe Endeavor? It'd let Wishiwashi at least pose somewhat of a threat when it drops to 25% or less.

It's a shame that it doesn't have any more of a "wow" factor because this is one I was really looking forward to, but there's definitely potential here. 140/140 dual offenses are scary, and its 45/130/135 bulk should let it take hits reasonably well with HP investment. The only question is whether it's worth the risk of fielding one of the weakest Pokemon imaginable when it drops below 25%. Might be too risky to see a lot of OU use, but you have to like its chances in lower tiers with those kinds of stats.
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If you were to go Brave with Wishiwashi as you mentioned and tack on a Band onto it, could you see it as a wallbreaker as well for other possible options? I could see it working with your set and Endeavor over U-Turn for those low HP situations, but with U-Turn support to get it in safely. Ice Beam could still be used for coverage with 60 SpA investment since Wishiwashi's offenses are downright amazing.
 
I just love GF's logic. Multiple smaller units coming together as 1 = huge HP on Zygarde but not so in this case for whatever reason.

Regardless, the stats tell the story. Earthquake is rather unorthodox on a Water-type but other than that its move pool is rather average.
 
Ooh... well below 25% is better than 50% and does get quite the defense boost. Still, that Speed isn't doing it any favors unless in a Trick Room set.

Has STAB options for both categories so that's nothing to worry about. Coverage is low with Ice Beam, Earthquake, and U-turn (which is also good for getting out of their when close to 25%). Utility has Aqua Ring for some healing, Tearful Look (if you don't know, it lowers opponent's Attack and Special Attack)... and that's really it from anything unique.

I can maybe see Wishiwashi being useful to applying pressure at the very beginning of a battle, but has no place when things are set up.
 
OK, so the status Z moves have varying additional effects which are pretty cool. One for some status moves is healing a Pokemon back to 100% HP. There are about 10 of these and one of them is Mist, which Wishiwashi gets. So, perhaps Wishiwashi can get back to full with Z-move mist???
Here is the site where all Status z-move effects are: http://pastebin.com/d5Hed1cw
 
I am using Resttalk Wishiwashi in the story mode so far (you get both TM's just after getting Wishiwashi). As soon as I have Wishiwashi lose school form and regain it from healing, I'll confirm that's how it works here.

In the meantime, this also happens right after getting Wishiwashi:

Rv8jAAs.png

Seriously though, if you want Wishiwashi in the story mode, this is kinda important:

As you probably already know from the trailers and other leaked info, you have to fight Wishiwashi during a Trial. You have very few opportunities to catch a Wishiwashi before the trial captain tells you that you cannot catch pokemon anymore until the end of the trial, and once the trial ends no more Wishiwashi appear in that area. If you did not catch one when you had a chance, you will not be able to encounter a wild Wishiwashi again for a somewhat significant amount of time, at least another trial and then some.

So, if you want a Wishiwashi, catch the first one you see or you'll be out of luck until you get to where they appear in the wild.
 
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feel like Solo form shouldve had high speed.. at LEAST 90. so that the following strategies could work (seeing as how it has the moves)
-endeaver, drop opponents health
-rest, so you can reset. chesto berry basically required. w/out it use sleep talk
-u-turn, for healing wish strats or wish. (other z-move wish counterpart)
-Z-Mist (to get full health)
-toxic/scald burn, i favor the burn
-Tearful Look, lower opponents atk/sp.atk. would work just like Parting Shot. (bulldoze speed drop works too)
-rain dance/hail, partner set up. (weather wars are coming back ;-) )

if you are feeling brave though you can try this with the 40 base speed.

ACTUALLY hey, custap berry helps make Solo form a little viable (beware priority tho) :) man i feel excited now
 
I want to call this generation the Trick Room generation. Literally at least a quarter of the new pokedex has decent/great stats everywhere else but their speed. School-forme Wishiwashi is probably the poster boy of this; everything but hp and speed is over 100 it will hit like a tank with whatever it throws out.

45 base hp doesn't help it though, with how its ability works getting it out of school forme doesn't seem as hard as it could be.
 
November Blue said:
A Healing Wish user would really benefit Wishiwashi. If I understand it correctly, a solo fish that receives a Healing Wish would school up when it comes in, when the turn ends.
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yup. transform at the end of the turn
because of this running protect would be necessary.

but then i suppose a slow wish baton passer would be better :)
 
This thing is a monster (literally, Gyarados are afraid of it.) xD

With HP EVs it shouldn't be that squishy, what with those high defenses. You'd definitely want a Brave nature so you can slap on an Ice Beam or something for coverage; as well as allowing it to work in Trick Room teams.

But it shines most in Doubles, especially alongside a Ribombee (who can Speed Swap, give it Powder Immunity, and keep it healed up to stay Schoolin' dem fools.)
 
Not convinced this thing is gonna be relevant at all, as its ability is actually more crippling than Defeatist.

On the bright side, his defenses are admittedly better than Archeops's and he has a much better defensive typing, but that abysmal Speed and low HP are going to cripple it. Plus in its solo form, it's completely and utterly useless in just about any format. RU at most, I would say.
 
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