fucking noctowls
thanks thorns
thanks thorns
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(Archive) Small Objective Changes Thread
- Thread starter eric the espeon
- Start date
It seems that someone changed Salamence to Dragonite after it was moved to Ubers, but forgot to change the rest of the sentence. Everthing from the comma on should be deleted.
This is for Shaymin's Choice Scarf Set.
EDIT: Also on Shaymin, on the bottom of the Growth Set:
I recommend just changing Salamence to Flygon here.
On the Team Options:
1st: Deleted
2nd: Deleted
3rd: Changed to Dragonite, or deleted after comma in that sentence.
4th: Delete the whole sentence.
5th: Delete the whole sentence.
The main Pokemon who give Shaymin trouble are Heatran, Dragonite, and Blissey. Heatran is generally partnered by Scizor and Celebi. Therefore, a Heatran of your own works well here. Dragonite is often seen alongside Scizor, Gyarados, and Heatran. Starmie works well against Dragonite, Gyarados, and Heatran, and Heatran does well against Scizor. Blissey tends to be partnered by powerful physical walls, such as Hippowdon and Skarmory, but Seed Flare and Hidden Power Fire work wonders against them.
These are just what I would do.
EDIT: I'm just obsessed with Shaymin. On the Damage Calculator, there aren't any sets made for Shaymin, yet there is a whole Shaymin page(link above.)
EDIT: Still some stuff left for Shaymin. XD. On the first section of the EVs.
The hardest part about moving Salamence to Ubers....taking it off all the OU pokes. Celebi, Jirachi, or even Flygon could replace it in this sentence.
On the Counters:
I'd just edit out the bold and make "work" "works" in this situation.
EDIT: Well, at least it's not Shaymin. This time, it's Mesprit.
There's a missing space between hit and Steel-types. This is on the Special Choice set, first paragraph, last sentence.
Then, same set, third paragraph, first sentence.
Extra period and space at the end.
got it, thanks ^_^
Under the "SubRoost" set
A revision may look like this: With maximum speed, Zapdos can freely set up a Substitute before taking hits from threats such as Jolly Lucario.
The current EV spread which is 192 HP / 64 Def / 252 Spe already has the speed maxed out.
A revision may look like this: With maximum speed, Zapdos can freely set up a Substitute before taking hits from threats such as Jolly Lucario.
Sorry about that mingot. Here are the ones not changed yet.
I'm just obsessed with Shaymin. On the Damage Calculator, there aren't any sets made for Shaymin, yet there is a whole Shaymin page(link above.)
Still some stuff left for Shaymin. XD. On the first section of the EVs.
On the Counters:
Well, at least it's not Shaymin. This time, it's Mesprit.
Then, same set, third paragraph, first sentence.
I'm just obsessed with Shaymin. On the Damage Calculator, there aren't any sets made for Shaymin, yet there is a whole Shaymin page(link above.)
Still some stuff left for Shaymin. XD. On the first section of the EVs.
The hardest part about moving Salamence to Ubers....taking it off all the OU pokes. Celebi, Jirachi, or even Flygon could replace it in this sentence.
On the Counters:
I'd just edit out the bold and make "work" "works" in this situation.
Well, at least it's not Shaymin. This time, it's Mesprit.
There's a missing space between hit and Steel-types. This is on the Special Choice set, first paragraph, last sentence.
Then, same set, third paragraph, first sentence.
Extra period and space at the end.
fixed all of these, thanks.
ete edit: other than the damage calc thing, which needs doug to refresh the sets.
ud edit: yeah, there was a mistake in the set formatting :V
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/feraligatr
Just a small typo, on the first set "Dragon Dance", in the 4th sentence "With Low Kick, Toxicroak can OHKO Registeel (after Stealth Rock) before it paralyzes Feraligatr, but Feraligatr loses coverage and power on Toxicroak and some Water-types such as Azumarill, Slowbro, and Slowking." calls Feraligatr Toxicroak, when it should obviously be "Feraligatr can OHKO Registeel"
Just a small typo, on the first set "Dragon Dance", in the 4th sentence "With Low Kick, Toxicroak can OHKO Registeel (after Stealth Rock) before it paralyzes Feraligatr, but Feraligatr loses coverage and power on Toxicroak and some Water-types such as Azumarill, Slowbro, and Slowking." calls Feraligatr Toxicroak, when it should obviously be "Feraligatr can OHKO Registeel"
Fixed.
http://www.smogon.com/gs/moves/substitute
Hey doods, Substitute only blocks Swagger's confusion, it doesn't stop Swagger from boosting Attack. It might be worthwhile for someone to test if the same behavior still exists in RSE and DPP, likewise with Flatter since it's the same deal.
Hey doods, Substitute only blocks Swagger's confusion, it doesn't stop Swagger from boosting Attack. It might be worthwhile for someone to test if the same behavior still exists in RSE and DPP, likewise with Flatter since it's the same deal.
I got a friend to test this for me, and the result is that Substitute does block both the confusion and the boost. Where did you find out that Substitute doesn't ignore the boost?
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/swampert
Under the "Opinion" for Swampert, the last sentence says, "Overall, Swampert is an solid choice on any team, and will rarely let you down." It should be "a", if my grammar is correct (summer has that effect on me)
Sorry for the small nitpick and if it's not a big deal.
Under the "Opinion" for Swampert, the last sentence says, "Overall, Swampert is an solid choice on any team, and will rarely let you down." It should be "a", if my grammar is correct (summer has that effect on me)
Sorry for the small nitpick and if it's not a big deal.
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/mismagius
In the Bulky Ghost and also the Counters, it lists Umbreon as if it were still UU when its OU.
In the Bulky Ghost and also the Counters, it lists Umbreon as if it were still UU when its OU.
Done, thank you.
Hi,
I noticed this when I was seeing how much speed Dragonite needed to outspeed Superachi after a DD...
The Superachi spread has 180 EVs...this means 4 are wasted as 176 EVs gives the SAME speed of 308.
So yeah...4 wasted EVs.
New spread should be 80HP / 252SpA / 176Spe (all the other spreads are fine, not sure why this one has those extra 4)
EDIT:
Also noticed the Cleric Dancer set for Dragonite says:
With that being said, by using an alternative EV spread with just 44 Speed EVs, Dragonite is guaranteed to outpace 176 Speed Jirachi, Jolly Lucario, and most importantly, Salamence.
This is incorrect because with just 40 speed EVs, Dragonite reaches 309 speed after a DD, 1 point ahead of the 308 speed Jirachi. Jolly Lucario is 306, Salamence...well the only set that is relevant is the Classic Mixmence with +speed but thats in the same situation as Jirachi. I also don't know when Salamence is being taking out of Mon's analysis' but yeah....
I noticed this when I was seeing how much speed Dragonite needed to outspeed Superachi after a DD...
The Superachi spread has 180 EVs...this means 4 are wasted as 176 EVs gives the SAME speed of 308.
So yeah...4 wasted EVs.
New spread should be 80HP / 252SpA / 176Spe (all the other spreads are fine, not sure why this one has those extra 4)
EDIT:
Also noticed the Cleric Dancer set for Dragonite says:
With that being said, by using an alternative EV spread with just 44 Speed EVs, Dragonite is guaranteed to outpace 176 Speed Jirachi, Jolly Lucario, and most importantly, Salamence.
This is incorrect because with just 40 speed EVs, Dragonite reaches 309 speed after a DD, 1 point ahead of the 308 speed Jirachi. Jolly Lucario is 306, Salamence...well the only set that is relevant is the Classic Mixmence with +speed but thats in the same situation as Jirachi. I also don't know when Salamence is being taking out of Mon's analysis' but yeah....
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/bronzong
The "Team Options" subheading lacks a capital O; it currently reads as "Team options".
The "Team Options" subheading lacks a capital O; it currently reads as "Team options".
Hi,
I have spotted a few things that need changing/updating.
Let's start with hippowdon
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/hippowdon
The physical wall set suggests 88 sp.def for a tyranitar Boah's ice beam. Now boah still exist, but a max special attack tyranitar ice beam is still rare, and since platinum a choice band aqua tail has been more threatening. Sp.def is useful however, so I think this needs looking into as it has been there for a long time and has been unnecessary for a long time.
I think 252 hp/180 defence/76 special defence would be much better, it garuntees hippowdon to live a adamant life orb lucario close combat after a sword dance and stealth rocks. While still providing a bit of special bulk.
Next is Gliscor
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/gliscor
The offensive sword dance set claims that EQ + Stone edge hits every OU for neutral damage bar brongong and brelloom. This is just a minor nit pick, but flygon also resists the combo.
Now for Metagross
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/metagross
The lead set has 24 ev's in speed and does not explain why. Probably because there is no reason, so I suggest recomending 0 speed ev's for metagross, cus otherwise people will start using max speed metagross in order to outspeed that set and it will affect the metagame.
Smeargle
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/smeargle
The lead set I think needs updating. First of all, taunt is useless tbh, stopping sleep talkers wastes a turn of sleep when you could be spike stacking. Encore can be used to lock an oponent into stealth rocks, saving your spore and getting you a free turn to stack some more spikes. U-turn can also be used to break the focus sash off azelf and aerodactyl, who will always taunt and if you bring in something faster they will die without setting up stealth rocks.
I think a moveset of:
- Spikes/Stealth rock
- Encore/Stealth rock
- U-turn/Stealth rock
- Spore
Setting up Stealth rock and spikes together is not realistic, I don't know why it's the main suggestion. So I think stealth rock should just be a side option in my opinion. The set here is just much more effective mid game and as a lead. Encore is for abusing slower leads like swampert who like to set up stealth rock, as you encore that, and then spike up some more as he is forced to switch. U-turn is for breaking a sash on taunt leads, and spore is the best move in the game.
Next onto lead smeargles ev's. Why lol, 252 speed and a Jolly nature, it achieves nothing. In fact no speed ev's at all and a neutral nature outspeeds the same leads. Nothing sits in that speed zone, apart from dragonite, who may have a lum berry so you should run away anyway.
The top 20 leads:
- Azelf
- Aerodactyl
- Swampert
- Metagross
- Jirachi
- Infernape
- Ninjask
- Roserade
- Hippowdon
- Tyranitar
- Heatran
- Smeargle
- Uxie
- Starmie
- Dragonite
- Abomansow
- Crobat
- Bronzong
- Skarmory
With there standard sets, smeargle is gaining nothing with max speed, except abomasnow, who you can encore as it subs up to block your spore. With almost 0 bulk, smeargle has no use mid game, except death fodder.
So I suggest a spread of
252 hp/100 defence/156 sp.def
Careful nature
The ev's make a metagross bullet punch 3hko and a heatran earthpower 3hko. But a better ev spread could be found, this was just something I quickly thought up. You still have 186 speed, still outspeeding metagross, skarmory etc. while not loosing anything.
Next is Skarmory:
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/skarmory
mainly the taunt set. "The selected EV spread allows Skarmory to outspeed Adamant Tyranitar" ... ? why lol, no one uses max speed and adamant. It's either max jolly with dragon dance or a choice scarf. After a dragon dance or a scarf boost its gonna outspeed anyway. That just seems dumb in my opinon. The set really doesn't need speed, and isn't outspeeding anything useful or common with speed ev's, so why bother. Even suicune is running timid alot more now, so outspeeding 209 suicune is getting rare. So I suggest wacking them in sp.def tbh. cus they are 99% wasted in speed.
Well thanks for reading. The few points have bugged me for a while and I never knew threads like this existed. It's just a few nitpicks, but I hope I helped.
I have spotted a few things that need changing/updating.
Let's start with hippowdon
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/hippowdon
The physical wall set suggests 88 sp.def for a tyranitar Boah's ice beam. Now boah still exist, but a max special attack tyranitar ice beam is still rare, and since platinum a choice band aqua tail has been more threatening. Sp.def is useful however, so I think this needs looking into as it has been there for a long time and has been unnecessary for a long time.
I think 252 hp/180 defence/76 special defence would be much better, it garuntees hippowdon to live a adamant life orb lucario close combat after a sword dance and stealth rocks. While still providing a bit of special bulk.
Next is Gliscor
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/gliscor
The offensive sword dance set claims that EQ + Stone edge hits every OU for neutral damage bar brongong and brelloom. This is just a minor nit pick, but flygon also resists the combo.
Now for Metagross
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/metagross
The lead set has 24 ev's in speed and does not explain why. Probably because there is no reason, so I suggest recomending 0 speed ev's for metagross, cus otherwise people will start using max speed metagross in order to outspeed that set and it will affect the metagame.
Smeargle
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/smeargle
The lead set I think needs updating. First of all, taunt is useless tbh, stopping sleep talkers wastes a turn of sleep when you could be spike stacking. Encore can be used to lock an oponent into stealth rocks, saving your spore and getting you a free turn to stack some more spikes. U-turn can also be used to break the focus sash off azelf and aerodactyl, who will always taunt and if you bring in something faster they will die without setting up stealth rocks.
I think a moveset of:
- Spikes/Stealth rock
- Encore/Stealth rock
- U-turn/Stealth rock
- Spore
Setting up Stealth rock and spikes together is not realistic, I don't know why it's the main suggestion. So I think stealth rock should just be a side option in my opinion. The set here is just much more effective mid game and as a lead. Encore is for abusing slower leads like swampert who like to set up stealth rock, as you encore that, and then spike up some more as he is forced to switch. U-turn is for breaking a sash on taunt leads, and spore is the best move in the game.
Next onto lead smeargles ev's. Why lol, 252 speed and a Jolly nature, it achieves nothing. In fact no speed ev's at all and a neutral nature outspeeds the same leads. Nothing sits in that speed zone, apart from dragonite, who may have a lum berry so you should run away anyway.
The top 20 leads:
- Azelf
- Aerodactyl
- Swampert
- Metagross
- Jirachi
- Infernape
- Ninjask
- Roserade
- Hippowdon
- Tyranitar
- Heatran
- Smeargle
- Uxie
- Starmie
- Dragonite
- Abomansow
- Crobat
- Bronzong
- Skarmory
With there standard sets, smeargle is gaining nothing with max speed, except abomasnow, who you can encore as it subs up to block your spore. With almost 0 bulk, smeargle has no use mid game, except death fodder.
So I suggest a spread of
252 hp/100 defence/156 sp.def
Careful nature
The ev's make a metagross bullet punch 3hko and a heatran earthpower 3hko. But a better ev spread could be found, this was just something I quickly thought up. You still have 186 speed, still outspeeding metagross, skarmory etc. while not loosing anything.
Next is Skarmory:
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/skarmory
mainly the taunt set. "The selected EV spread allows Skarmory to outspeed Adamant Tyranitar" ... ? why lol, no one uses max speed and adamant. It's either max jolly with dragon dance or a choice scarf. After a dragon dance or a scarf boost its gonna outspeed anyway. That just seems dumb in my opinon. The set really doesn't need speed, and isn't outspeeding anything useful or common with speed ev's, so why bother. Even suicune is running timid alot more now, so outspeeding 209 suicune is getting rare. So I suggest wacking them in sp.def tbh. cus they are 99% wasted in speed.
Well thanks for reading. The few points have bugged me for a while and I never knew threads like this existed. It's just a few nitpicks, but I hope I helped.
Hippowdon is currently undergoing an analysis update located here. The EV spread for the Physical Wall set has been updated.
Good catch. Added in Flygon.
I don't know what the 24 EVs in Speed are for myself, but I did a bit of research and noticed that those Speed EVs allow Metagross to outpace 20 Speed Skarmory, 100 Speed Empoleon (standard lead), and allows Metagross to Speed tie with 96 Speed Tyranitar (standard Choice Band). However, 28 Speed makes sense because you get to outpace the aforementioned Tyranitar, so I'll change the EV spread to reflect that.
That set is actually being updated here. It covers most of your issues.
Max Speed is basically used for general purposes. Like if you switched Smeargle out of a lead that beats it, you can bring it in late-game and potentially outpace someone with all of that Speed to set up. Investing heavily in bulk is not going to really help Smeargle much because its overall bulk is absolutely pathetic.
That spread loses to those two Pokemon all the time. With Metagross, Earthquake + Bullet Punch kills Smeargle, and Heatran's Fire Blast is an almost OHKO. You're better off using Focus Sash.
Skarmory is being updated here. The Speed EVs help it outpace most Choice Band Tyranitar.
Thank you for your comments. Next time, however, use the subjective changes thread when bringing up controversial updates. Most of your edits are controversial.
Thanks,
Btw the smeargle still has a focus sash, but the bulk let's it set up on weaker walls mid game. You could probably drop the speed down to 245 to outspeed the 243 tyranitar and the 244 walls outpacing tyranitar. But I still feel max speed is pointless and I can't think of any OU's that are just bellow smeargle in terms of speed.
Also do people use max speed choice band tyranitar? I thought 96 speed was the most CB t-tar's used.
I'll check out the links, and use the subjective thread next time
Btw the smeargle still has a focus sash, but the bulk let's it set up on weaker walls mid game. You could probably drop the speed down to 245 to outspeed the 243 tyranitar and the 244 walls outpacing tyranitar. But I still feel max speed is pointless and I can't think of any OU's that are just bellow smeargle in terms of speed.
Also do people use max speed choice band tyranitar? I thought 96 speed was the most CB t-tar's used.
I'll check out the links, and use the subjective thread next time
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/hariyama
Under the Hariyama Choice Band set, it lists Ice Punch/Thunderpunch, and Stone Edge as its last two moveset options. However, "The last two attacking slots can be juggled with; any combination of the four moves works... Fire Punch will hurt Toxicroak decently as well as the same Bug-types Stone Edge hits." Fire Punch was not mentioned in the moveset selection.
Under the Hariyama Choice Band set, it lists Ice Punch/Thunderpunch, and Stone Edge as its last two moveset options. However, "The last two attacking slots can be juggled with; any combination of the four moves works... Fire Punch will hurt Toxicroak decently as well as the same Bug-types Stone Edge hits." Fire Punch was not mentioned in the moveset selection.
Hi. Under the "Defensive Duck" entry for Porygon2, I noticed that:
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/porygon2
Possibly due to Salamence's departure, only two threats are now listed, not three. In the next paragraph:
Heatran has already been mentioned in the first paragraph so perhaps mention of it should be confined to only the first.
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/porygon2
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/magcargo
"With 172 EVs invested in Defense, its Defense reaches a stat of 352, netting an extra stat point. Max HP bolsters Magcargo's ability to take physical hits even more. The remaining EVs are placed into Special Defense. Thanks to Flame Body, Magcargo has a 30% chance of inflicting a burn upon contact."
Sorry for looking like kind of a dick with all the posting, but does this seem a little awkward? It might be better to insert the last paragraph after listing the Defensive EV spread.
i.e. "With 172 EVs invested in Defense, its Defense reaches a stat of 352, netting an extra stat point. Additionally, thanks to Flame Body, Magcargo has a 30% chance of inflicting a burn upon contact. Max HP bolsters Magcargo's ability to take physical hits even more. The remaining EVs are placed into Special Defense."
Again, my apologies :(
"With 172 EVs invested in Defense, its Defense reaches a stat of 352, netting an extra stat point. Max HP bolsters Magcargo's ability to take physical hits even more. The remaining EVs are placed into Special Defense. Thanks to Flame Body, Magcargo has a 30% chance of inflicting a burn upon contact."
Sorry for looking like kind of a dick with all the posting, but does this seem a little awkward? It might be better to insert the last paragraph after listing the Defensive EV spread.
i.e. "With 172 EVs invested in Defense, its Defense reaches a stat of 352, netting an extra stat point. Additionally, thanks to Flame Body, Magcargo has a 30% chance of inflicting a burn upon contact. Max HP bolsters Magcargo's ability to take physical hits even more. The remaining EVs are placed into Special Defense."
Again, my apologies :(
http://www.smogon.com/ingame/guides/secret_base
(R/S/E) should be (FR/LG).
Should be Route 116 and Rustboro City, respectively.
Should be 5 instead of 7.
Thanks a lot, and don't worry about posting too much. It's good. :)
I also fixed your post Death.
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/lucario
Under the Swords Dance set, it states that:
Under the Swords Dance set, it states that:
I don't think anybody would use Extremespeed against a Dragonite. Close Combat, on the other hand, has a chance to KO. Here are some calcs:
252/0 Careful is the only "defensive" set in the analysis.