Moody (Ubers Edition)

[TM13IceBeam]

I just thought of this, but if Evasion clause is not enforced in Ubers, wouldn't Golurk be actually useful? Immune to Aura Sphere, Thunder and Chip Away, while being able to spam Double Team after a Rock Polish(which allows him to outrun a lot of stuff in Ubers IIRC)

Just theorymonning. Sorry if this doesn't belong here. >_>

 

[ZetoTarken]

I just thought of this, but if Evasion clause is not enforced in Ubers, wouldn't Golurk be actually useful? Immune to Aura Sphere, Thunder and Chip Away, while being able to spam Double Team after a Rock Polish(which allows him to outrun a lot of stuff in Ubers IIRC)

Just theorymonning. Sorry if this doesn't belong here. >_>

Moody wasn't banned under the evasion clause. Evasion clause only bans moves that specifically boost evasion. We still play with evasion clause.

 

[TM13IceBeam]

Ok...

I thought Evasion Clause wasn't enforced in Ubers because I lost an Ubers tourney due to someone spamming Double Team(and yes, it was the one guanlong mentioned ages ago)

 

[ZetoTarken]

It isn't enforced on the PO's server but it is on the Smogon's server AFAIK

 

[Nubagator]

alright, I'm a total lurker so please excuse the post # >_>. After being bored to tears of OU I thought I would give ubers a try. I love it, 3 weeks later and I haven't played any other tier. I've played a few hundred ubers matches in the past month or so, and in my opinion Moody has to go. It's broken, even in ubers. It gets a bit of evasion or speed on you and bam, your in a corner. All you can do is bring in a thunder/aura sphere-er and hope for the best. with a decent setup, lets say some t-spikes beating it becomes infuriating, as protect sub spam is sure to come. It is entirely luck based, and takes away from the strategy of the metagame. of course roar/whirlwind helps a bit, but they have accuracy too.... Some of you may disagree, but anyone who has played a team based around inconsistant in the hands of a skilled player knows how damn good it can be. Giritina can be a good stop, either pressure stalling, or cm boosting, but that's really one of the only pokes i can think of, aside from that are CM chansey/bliss and Lugia or Grass-ceus. and both the blobs and grassy can't come in and wall oct if t-spikes are up. Perish song, and red card work alright, but I really don't want to waste a slot on an item that goes away after being hit by anything. Perish song seems like the best idea but still.

 

[mudkipmaster]

Heck yeah! Bibarel be rockin Ubers now!

 

[2birds1stone]

I too am a bit of a lurker, but this topic caught my attention

I play ubers on a regular basis, and seriously, the idea of banning anything from ubers makes me wanna die. I have problems with moody, mainly the fact that it's luck-based and it can boost evasion. Bring in a clause by all means (or lump it in with the evasion clause), but remember that ubers is a banlist. It's inherently broken - Quagsire is a viable pokemon, and I've even seen people use Shedinja with more success than one would expect, all because of the overcentralized Kyogre. It's broken, and that's why it's so much fun, sometimes people just wanna watch behemothic OP pokes use broken strategies on each other. It's why people play Traditional Yu-Gi-Oh! from time to time, or Vintage Magic. So yeah, sure, an Inconsistent Clause would be great, but don't go banning banned Pokemon.

EDIT: I've seen a few people ranting about 'Smeargle with +6 evasion'. Just a small point, but Moody can't actually take a stat to stage six, according to bulbapedia.

ANOTHER EDIT: Banning inconsistent from ubers instead of making a clause would just create super-ubers. Bad idea, right?

 

[Focus]

There is already a precedent for the sort of ban from Ubers that is being suggested, as the OHKO and Evasion Clauses are currently enforced in all official tiers, including gen 5 Ubers. If you want to play in a tier without any sort of bans or clauses, then there is the so-called StreetPKMN tier for that purpose. Also, Moody can raise a stat TO +6, but it will not attempt to raise a stat already AT +6 at the end of the turn.

 

[Parasol_Kirby]

If this is ever going to be banned, it should only be banned after a PROPER suspect test. Right now, I see nothing to worry about, considering these Pokemon aren't that high in usage.

 

[Focus]

I actually cannot believe just how infrequently Moody users are used. Octillery is seen in 1 out of 742 battles (it was in 30 battles, tied with Electabuzz), and Bibarel was only used twice this past month! From that statistic, you are more likely to encounter a shiny Pokémon than see a Bibarel in Ubers. For comparison, Ditto was seen in 45 battles and Charizard was seen in 868 battles...

Just some interesting usage stats.

 

[~Golden Emp]

This is just INCONSISTENT!

Ubers is not supposed to be a Tier, but a place where the banned things from OU go. It was never meant to be balanced, or fair.

 

[Eriorguez]

Yet Darkrai can only sleep one Pokemon in the opponent's team, and not the whole team...

 

[truevillany]

Yet Darkrai can only sleep one Pokemon in the opponent's team, and not the whole team...

so true... so true...

clearly there should be a clause for inconsistent. this comment kinda puts things in prespective... inconsitent can shut down a team just as easily as sleeping everything that comes in

 

[TM13IceBeam]

I thought there WAS a Moody clause already?

I think it got too Moody...

 

[Arceusderp]

Just sayin i think moody was released for smeargle in "pokemon cafe" or whatever check on serebii.net it was released

 

[ZetoTarken]

I thought there WAS a Moody clause already?

I think it got too Moody...

Its on PO's server but not Smogon's iirc

 

[Parasol_Kirby]

Clearly the only issue here is that some "pros" got their egos busted when some "noob" handily won with a moody Pokemon. Must have been one of the two times Bibarel was used this month.

When Bibarel and Smeargle and Octillery start to actually be used, then we can talk about this being a problem. As it stands, anyone using these Pokemon is risking himself waaay more than the opponent, considering that he will be playing more or less with 5 usable Pokemon from the word go. (Assuming the statistically likely chance the Moody Pokemon gets "bad" boosts)

 

[ssbbm]

When Bibarel and Smeargle and Octillery start to actually be used, then we can talk about this being a problem. As it stands, anyone using these Pokemon is risking himself waaay more than the opponent, considering that he will be playing more or less with 5 usable Pokemon from the word go. (Assuming the statistically likely chance the Moody Pokemon gets "bad" boosts)

You have a 2/7 chance of boosting Evasion or Speed (Good Boosts). If you can switch in on a Pokemon safely, you have a 5/7 chance of not getting a good boost the first turn, then a 5/7 chance of not getting a good boost when you Protect. 5/7*5/7 = 35/49. If you can repeat this scenario a few times, like 2 switch-ins, that chance becomes 35/49*35/49, which is approximately 50% of getting a good boost, and if the boost is an evasion boost, then you have an approximately 60% chance of sweeping the opponent's team, while a speed boost basically gives you a very strong chance of sweeping any team that carries a pHazer that dies to Surf.

 

[LoveHurts]

Are you also accounting for the -1 boosts that accompany every turn? It's not as if you're only get +2 every turn, you can also get -1 in either attacking stat, evasion, speed, and either defense. When you look at all the Thunders, Aura Spheres, and generally hard-hitting attacks of all the pokemon (Thunder or Aura Sphere hitting SE against every Moody user, I might add), this is much less of a problem than you're 50%-chance-to-sweep-with-a-Bibarel/Octillery/Glalie-in-ubers makes it out to be.

 

[XienZo]

Are you also accounting for the -1 boosts that accompany every turn? It's not as if you're only get +2 every turn, you can also get -1 in either attacking stat, evasion, speed, and either defense. When you look at all the Thunders, Aura Spheres, and generally hard-hitting attacks of all the pokemon (Thunder or Aura Sphere hitting SE against every Moody user, I might add), this is much less of a problem than you're 50%-chance-to-sweep-with-a-Bibarel/Octillery/Glalie-in-ubers makes it out to be.

Since the attacks in Ubers are so massive, the -1 defenses are absolutely negligible; they were never going to survive a direct SE hit anyway, so they'll hardly care about the defense loss. Likewise with most of the other stats; they aren't doing much damage, avoiding much, or outspeeding much with just a +0 anyway, so if they get -1 in those, they're not actually losing anything that would make a difference.

 

[Parasol_Kirby]

Whatever guys. If I don't even SEE Bibarels in ubers, (nevermind actually losing to them) so how can I believe this is better than Kyogre? I'm done with this thread.

Just don't ban this without a proper suspect test.

 

[Nubagator]

Clearly the only issue here is that some "pros" got their egos busted when some "noob" handily won with a moody Pokemon.

I doubt it. Just slapping a moody poke on a team is fairly ineffectual, so a noob beating a skilled player is a pretty long shot. The issue is more with skilled players basing a team around inconsistancy. With the official release of smeargle it becomes even easier considering he has acsess to moves such as spore and baton pass. I believe Moody should be banned for the following reason. It is extremely luck based. The whole reason we play on smogon is for a balanced strategic metagame. Obviously the "balance" part really doesn't concern ubers, but the strategic element does. OHKO and evasion and hax items ex:bright powder are banned partly for their reliance on luck. We say this takes away from the strategy that makes competetive battling enjoyable. I feel moody should be blanket banned in all tiers. Despite how boss bibarel is.

 

[Ray Jay]

I doubt it. Just slapping a moody poke on a team is fairly ineffectual, so a noob beating a skilled player is a pretty long shot. The issue is more with skilled players basing a team around inconsistancy. With the official release of smeargle it becomes even easier considering he has acsess to moves such as spore and baton pass. I believe Moody should be banned for the following reason. It is extremely luck based. The whole reason we play on smogon is for a balanced strategic metagame. Obviously the "balance" part really doesn't concern ubers, but the strategic element does. OHKO and evasion and hax items ex:bright powder are banned partly for their reliance on luck. We say this takes away from the strategy that makes competetive battling enjoyable. I feel moody should be blanket banned in all tiers. Despite how boss bibarel is.

But at some point, Smogon battling becomes inaccurate to the actual game, which is wrong. That's why I disagree with even banning BrightPowder; you're removing a strategic element simply because it is not a very reliable strategic element. They don't ban full court shots from basketball just because one could once in a blue moon make them. And if a basketball team bases their entire strategy around trying to make full court shots, the defense has to be ready to handle such a strategy.

 

[calze6]

Yeah, but it is so easy to set up and works more often. If one says that the point of competitive battling is balance or fun, then moody really screws that up.

 

[ElDynamite]

In basketball, winning is a money situation. Luck is good. POKEMON is for FUN. Luck and hax make it boring. Yes, moody would screw over the metagame, it should become an anti-moody clause. That's the best solution, so both parties would benfit.