1. Welcome to the Orange Islands! Please remember to read the rules. Come chat with us on our IRC channel and enjoy your stay!
  2. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  3. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Pokémon BW2 In-game Tier List Mark II [See Post #840]

Discussion in 'Orange Islands' started by SuperJOCKE, Oct 8, 2012.

  1. Its_A_Random

    Its_A_Random Solves issues recursively
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributor
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    2,307
    Going to reserve Alomomomomomomomomomomomomomomomomomomomomola. Putting up the template for now...

    [​IMG]
    Name: Alomomola
    Availability: Mid-Game. It is first found in Route 4, Virbank City, and outside the Virbank Complex with a 95% Encounter Rate in the Rippling Water. Requires Surf.
    Stats: It has the highest HP of all the Pokémon you can find in the game. It has okay Attack and Defense, but elsewhere, it is mediocre.
    Typing: Water is a solid typing offensively and defensively. You only need to worry about Electric-type and Grass-type Pokémon, but they are not very common after you capture it.
    Movepool: Terrible. It gets Aqua Jet and Protect early on, which is okay, but most of the decent attacking moves it gets come off its terrible Special Attack stat. It is an okay supporter, however.
    Major Battles: To put it simply, while Alomomola is not going to be dead-weight against any of the remaining major battles bar Colress, it is not going to be much of a help either.
    Additional Comments: Alomomola's fast experience curve helps alleviate the initial grinding needed to get Alomomola up to par with the rest of the team. Other than that, it can function as a somewhat helpful Pokémon in Doubles/Triples battles, thanks to Healer and its support movepool.
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2013
  2. TM13IceBeam

    TM13IceBeam

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,614
    Reserving Combee.

    Name: Combee
    Availability: You can get it by Elesa as a 10% encounter in Lostlorn Forest.
    Stats: Amazing bulk as a Vespiquen, with decent 80/80 offenses.
    Typing: Bug/Flying has an excellent Fighting resist, but has a crippling Rock weakness.
    Movepool: Vespiquen's movepool is loaded with support moves such as Toxic, Captivate and Swagger. Offensively, it has STAB moves, Poison moves, and Power Gem.
    Major Battles: Vespiquen is really bad against Elesa and Skyla, who has super effective moves against her. It's decent against most other trainers, but it's best to keep it away from Marshal, who packs Rock-type attacks.
    AC: While Vespiquen may seem decent, one fatal flaw is that it can only evolve from the otherwise-useless Combee when it is a female. Even after evolution, it is not worth the effort to find a female Combee, in a game where offense is heavily emphasised over defense.
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2013
  3. DHR-107

    DHR-107 Robot from the Future
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcher
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2008
    Messages:
    1,402
    Putting in a reserve for Skitty and Purrloin. Both are pretty terrible.

    [​IMG]
    Name: Skitty
    Availability: Early (Castelia Park, 15% White 2 Only)
    Stats: Abysmal. Even after evolving it caps out with two base 70 stats.
    Typing: Normal. Not all that terrible, but any fighting type move is going to kill you. Along with Normalize you get STAB on every move you learn.
    Movepool: Vast (Shallow if Normalize). If you have Normalize you are totally countered by anything Ghost-typed. It has access to a huge selection of TM Moves, but with it's stats you still won't be hurting anything even with the words "It's Super Effective" up on your sceen. Thunder Wave from Nimbasa is also pretty useful.
    Major Battles: You get it early enough for it to be of some use. Normalize Thunder Wave allows you to paralyze Elesa's Electric absorbing Pokemon, and also Clay's gym. This tactic works in pretty much every major battle left, just be aware of how slow Delcatty is.
    Additional Comments: You can evolve it after Route 6 (There is a Moon Stone there). The main reason to use Skitty is for Normalize Thunder Wave, allowing you to paralyze everything you come across.

    I'll do Purrloin later :)
  4. Tyranitarphantom

    Tyranitarphantom

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    398
    Trapinch (open)
    [​IMG]
    Name: Trapinch
    Availability: Mid-Game. Found in the Desert Resort, after the third badge
    Stats: Trapinch is very strong, but frail and slow. Once it gets to be Flygon, however, all of it's stats are
    respectable, with high Speed and Attack, and good stats everywhere else.
    Typing: Ground is a solid typing, but having some common weaknesses makes it have a hard time. As Vibrava and
    Flygon, it's secondary Dragon-type gives it some nice resistances, and a great secondary STAB.
    Movepool: Sadly, it can't get Earthquake during the main story unless you keep it as a Trapinch until level 55. Dig
    or Earth Power serve as decent substitutes, though, and it learns Dragon Claw by level. It also gets some nice
    filler moves, such as Fire Blast, Rock Slide, and U-turn. You can also use it for Fly.
    Major Battles: Trapinch functions very well against most bosses. It walls Elesa's Pokemon, it can destroy Skyla
    with Rock Slide, it can use it's own Dragon moves to beat Drayden and Iris, and it's Ground-type moves help out vs
    Colress. Especially once it becomes Vibrava, it's typing is so good that it doesn't have trouble in most major
    battles.
    Additional Comments: Flygon is amazing, but Trapinch evolves rather late, and having to put up with it as a
    Trapinch for so long is rather annoying. If you can put up with that, Flygon will be worth it, but there are other
    things that become just as good much faster


    Buneary (open)
    [​IMG]
    Name: Buneary
    Availability: Early. Found in Castelia Park, accessed through Castelia Sewers
    Stats: It's Speed is great, but it's Attack is decent at best, and it's defenses are similarly mediocre.
    Typing: Normal-type is decent, but coupled with it's overall poor defenses, it won't be taking too many hits. It does get a nice strong STAB in Return, however.
    Movepool: Very wide. However, because of it's very low Special Attack, it can't use most of it's TM movepool well. It's only viable attacking moves are Jump Kick, Bounce, Dig, and it's Normal STAB. If you can spare 10 Red Shards, you could tutor it any of the elemental punches in Driftveil City, but those Shards are probably better spent on something else.
    Major Battles: Because of it's decidedly neutral typing, it doesn't do well versus any bosses. However, as long as you keep it away from Shauntal and Marshal, it won't do too poorly.
    Additional Comments: Buneary's base happiness is 0, the lowest possible value. To get it to evolve, you must get it's happiness to at least 220. Because of it's low base happiness, you'll probably be stuck with a Buneary for a long time.


    I also went ahead and did one other Pokemon I've used, Skorupi

    Skorupi (open)
    [​IMG]
    Name: Skorupi
    Availability: Late. Found outside Reversal Mountain, right after beating Skyla.
    Stats: Good. It's fairly fast, has solid defenses, and a decent attack stat. Nothing exceptional, though.
    Typing: Skorupi is Bug/Poison, but shortly after you catch it, it will evolve into Drapion, which is Poison/Dark type. While Poison/Dark is a decent defensive typing, leaving it with only one weakness (Ground), it's not a very good offensive typing.
    Movepool: Fairly shallow. It gets nice STAB moves in Crunch and Cross Poison. It also learns the elemental fangs, but those are fairly weak, and it's only other usable moves are X-scissor and Dig.
    Major Battles: As a Dark-type, it fares well against Shauntal, Caitlin, and Marlon's Jellicent. Because of it's poor coverage, however, it doesn't do particularly well against any other important trainers.
    Additional Comments: Unless you teach it some of the elemental fangs, it won't be of much use against most normal trainers. Even with those moves for coverage, it's still not very powerful.
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2013
  5. Celever

    Celever

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,707
    Guys; you've forgotten Banette. I only noticed because I am going to use him on my next run but just bringing it to your attention -- I am testing him though.
  6. KurashiDragon

    KurashiDragon

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    828
    I'm reserving Roselia and Jolteon. I'll do them a little later.

    Name: Jolteon
    Availability: You can find Eevee at the Castelia Garden. You can find a Thunderstone in Nimbasa City.
    Stats: Jolteon's Spd is extremely high at 130 while it's Sp. Atk is a high 110. Jolteon's Hp is 65 base, and it's Def spread is 60/95
    Typing: Jolteon is a pure electric type. While it hits Flying and Water-types super effectively but it cant hit ground-types at all.
    Movepool: Jolteon has pretty much nothing in its early levels. You'll mainly want to aim for Thunder Fang and Work Up as this is your best method of attacking with your stab until you get discharge. You'll also want to look for the TM Shadow Ball and Signal Beam from the move Tutor.
    Major Battles: Skyla and Marlon are the two most major battles in which you can use Jolteon. You can also do fairly well against Elesa because of it's ability.
    Additional Comments: Jolteon is very difficult to work with early game because of the lack of good Special moves it can learn but it's very good late game once you start getting moves for it.

    and Roselia

    Name: Roselia
    Availability: You can find Roselia at the Lostlorn Forest.
    Stats: As a Roserade, it's Sp. Atk is very high at 125, it's Spd is an average 90 base, it's HP is a low 60 base, and it's defense spread is 55/105.
    Typing: It's typing is Grass/Poison. It'll do very well against Ground and Water-types, as well as resisting electric attacks but it's not so good against flying-types.
    Movepool: As a Roselia, you should be aiming for Giga Drain and Petal Dance. You should also aim for the tms Shadow Ball and Venoshock if you have poison point.
    Major Battles: You'll mainly be aiming for Clay and Marlon. You may also be going for Elesa.
    Additional Comments: Between Natural Cure and Poison Point. Poison Point gives venoshock a boost but Natural Cure is a good option over Full Heals. You shouldn't evolve Roselia as soon as you get the Shiny Stone. You should wait until at least level 40 when Roselia learn's Petal Dance before evolving it.
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2013
  7. Twins

    Twins

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2010
    Messages:
    113
    Pidove is definitely not high tier. It has a horrendous movepool, with half of its level up moves coming off its low special attack, and it's stats are unimpressive as well. The best it can do is a STAB combination of Fly/Return/Roost/(Filler move) from its decent 105 base attack. It's completely outclassed by Braviary, and Crobat and Sigilyph are better Fly users (even i it wasn't, it's not great).

    Mid tier at best.
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2013
  8. Its_A_Random

    Its_A_Random Solves issues recursively
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributor
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    2,307
    Gonna write up Gligar! :D
    [​IMG]
    Name: Gligar
    Availability: Mid-Late Game (Route 11, 15%)
    Stats: Gligar comes with impressive Physical bulk that can help it tank physical attacks easier, and an above average Attack and Speed stats to boot. Its special bulk is rather average, and its Special Attack is forgettable.
    Typing: Ground/Flying gives it unfortunate weaknesses to Water and Ice, but it gets two useful immunities to Electric and Ground, and just three resistances. Offensively it is no slouch, with very broad coverage and key Super Effective coverage.
    Movepool: Gligar comes with a broad movepool that gives it great offensive potential, getting the Elemental Fangs, Acrobatics, Swords Dance, U-turn, X-scissor, and Sky Uppercut from its Level-up movepool, as well as Bulldoze, Dig, and Rock Slide from its TM movepool.
    Major Battles: It fares poorly against Marlon and Zinzolin, but Gligar can handily take on Marshal and Caitilin, as well as do a good job against Colress. Gligar can do a decent job in all the other major battles left in the game.
    Additional Comments: Unless you can put up with Gligar until the endgame before getting the Route 11 Razor Fang, you can find its evolved form (Gliscor) at the same point in the game as Gligar in shaking grass, albeit at a 5% Encounter rate.
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2013
  9. TM13IceBeam

    TM13IceBeam

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,614
    also unfezant is actually pretty decent due to super luck + stab return coming stupidly early now. who cares if half your level up moves are off your SpA when you have all the TMs to work? you only have 4 moves in the entire game so unfezant can not give a shit about his shitty level up movepool if he so gladly wanted (which it would). so what if it's best at fly/return/roost? it's where unfezant works best, and it's good enough for him to be high, at least agreed by the bunch of dudes who posted earlier in this thread (and the last).

    christ, i understand if you really think pidove sucks and should be in mid, but at least make a coherent and well-thought argument that doesn't include shit statements like "my level up moves suck lolol" and "the best flying-type in the game beats me like how titania shits all over oscar"
  10. KurashiDragon

    KurashiDragon

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    828
    I'd like to recommend Espeon for Top tier. Espeon having a shallow movepool is just about the only thing wrong with it throughout the ingame but that doesn't matter much at all. You can get it really early in the game so long as your patient enough. 130 Sp. Atk is great for early game even with psybeam. It can solo the 3rd and 4th gym on it's own no problem. It'll have some trouble with the 5th gym if only because of excadrill and the 6th gym if only because of Swoobat. It also does well in the last two gyms. It helps you get through team plasma's Poison-types no problem and beats Marshall on it's own. It's very useful throughout the entire game so I really think Espeon should be Top Tier.
  11. cant say

    cant say

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2012
    Messages:
    647
    Espeon is no doubt High tier at best. You need to first find an Eevee which has a 5% encounter rate, then grind for happiness, its main STAB is 65bp (if you evolve in time), it needs TM and tutor support to function at all, you don't need it until the E4...

    I agree, with the right support and knowledge of the game it is very good, but for the purposes for the list it is not Top tier material
  12. KurashiDragon

    KurashiDragon

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    828
    You dont need braviary until the elite 4 either (and even then it's a "rocky" check to Marshall.) and you dont need minchinno at all for any major battle. 65 base power may not seem like much until you take into account it's massive 130 Sp. Atk which is so much more than most of the things you have by the time you can start grinding for espeon. Also, the magnemite line doesn't learn a good attacking move by level up until level 25. Magnet Shot, a 65 base 85 acc attack. (if you wanna call that good) Espeon also learns it's best attacking move, Psychic at level 37 which is about the same level magneton learns flash cannon (level 39). As for the grind to happiness you get the soothe bell in nimbasa city which really helps the grind if you dont wanna do it right away. Finally the 5% encounter rate.... I admit, that is a valid point.
  13. TM13IceBeam

    TM13IceBeam

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,614
    problem is that happiness is not assumed to be grinded so you're going to be sticking with eevee for roughly 13-14 levels (as an estimate). unlike other happiness evolutions (azurill, riolu, swadloon) eevee doesn't have an earlygame to easily grind happiness and fully evolve by like nimbasa. grinding happiness for just 3 levels for psybeam is effective for espeon's case, but the cost is too much for the high payoff to be worth in high, compared to other things like mag (he pays off almost immediately by shitting over the next two gyms) and braviary (yeah yeah this is so obvious i don't even need to elaborate). if im going to have to put off my pt for 1-2 hours just to evolve some random thing on time for STAB i really dont see why it's top. high sounds perfect for me imo as it already emphasises espeon's strengths enough already.
  14. cant say

    cant say

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2012
    Messages:
    647
    Yeah this doesn't need to be expanded on much more to be honest. I can see what you like in Espeon but it just isn't enough, like tm13 said, Magnemite kills it from the start, easy to find, and stays relevant all game. Braviary and Mincinno are fixed encounters with great stats and level up movepools, as well as their hidden abilities.. Like I said, Espeon will be a great cobtributor if are prepared to give it the support it needs, but those 'mons in top do it on their own
  15. IOS

    IOS

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2010
    Messages:
    127
    At this point I believe Drilbur should be a candidate for his own tier. The current speedrun of the game is essentially a Drilbur/Excadrill solo once he is obtained.




    I don't believe there's a single Pokémon in the game with better sweeping potential than Excadrill. Hone Claws and later Swords Dance boosts an already ridiculous 135 Base Attack, and Earthquake is obtained early at Level 36. Excadrill also has 11 resistances (2 of which are immunities).

    It takes a very special Pokémon to not be a starter and still be the most viable option in a speedrun. I believe Nidoking is the only other Pokémon with this honour.

    Easy to find/catch, requires no babying (in the speedrun, he gets stashed until Elesa and dominates the gym), I really see him in a league of his own.
    Alert to Sounds likes this.
  16. Lucchini

    Lucchini

    Joined:
    May 6, 2011
    Messages:
    312
    If we're running a full team (which is what our tier lists assume), then Excadrill's power is somewhat diminished, and Drilbur DOES have a fairly unspectacular start.

    Saying that he's better than the game's starters is not saying a whole lot considering they are all surprisingly mediocre this time around. We already know that.

    Anyway, his matchups are far from perfect (Burgh, Clay, Marlon, Marshal, Iris aren't exactly best handled with Excadrill).
  17. IOS

    IOS

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2010
    Messages:
    127
    The tier list is also assuming most trainer battles aren't being skipped, correct? Speedruns seek to minimize the amount of battles, decreasing experience. It balances out assuming a "tier list player" is participating in most trainer battles.

    As for his "unspectacular" start, stash him until Elesa to avoid any period of mediocrity.

    I don't think you understood my point. Even in Pokémon Black/White the starters are still used, as it is almost never worth switching to a lower levelled Pokémon with worse EVs. Speedrunners also often restart for higher starter IVs giving starter Pokémon a significant advantage. It says a lot that Excadrill is enough of an upgrade to overcome this.

    Watch the speedrun.
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2013
  18. Twins

    Twins

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2010
    Messages:
    113
    That was a coherent argument actually. You don't have to agree, but I made a valid point. No need to get so worked up about it. It was in Limbo tier before. I'm arguing it's not good enough for High, by virtue of the several reasons stated above. You, on the other hand, may find that its STAB moves and its good attack and speed and commonness and early game-ness warrant it being in High. I see that, and I never argued against those. Haven't used Pidove in BW2, but it wasn't very good in BW.

    Mid doesn't mean suck btw. It means decent, usable for the entire span of the game. High is really good, and Top is game winning. Mid is good too. Pidove is definitely mid tier, since STAB Return and Fly are pretty powerful. It's just not good enough to warrant high imo.

    I'm not saying it's mid because it's outclassed by a pokemon that is only available on a certain day in a certain game. It's because I just can't see how it fits into High tier. Like take Hydreigon. It's OU, despite being entirely outclassed by every other dragon. But it deserves being in OU, because it's stats and movepool and everything are really good. Flygon though, it's outclassed, and it can't be backed up by its niche (it has way more of one than Haxorus with U-Turn), thus it's in UU.
  19. cant say

    cant say

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2012
    Messages:
    647
    I would suggest giving it a go before making up your mind. We're not here to theorymon, people that used it voted a while back and was decided to be High
  20. TM13IceBeam

    TM13IceBeam

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,614
    i'm just going to quote your original argument

    your arguments for mid tier pidove

    1. horrendous movepool, half of its level up move comes off low SpA
    this point is completely irrelevant with the existence of infinite use TMs and just about every other method unfezant can use to salvage its movepool. heck your next point contradicts it:

    2. best movepool is fly/return/roost
    i see 2 physical moves and nothing about special moves. does unfezant care about the gazillion special moves it gets by level up? obviously not, because you just said so yourself. braviary's also stuck with this movepool for quite a fair bit of the game too, so i fail to see how this is really a big issue.

    3. unimpressive stats
    105 atk/93 speed isn't 'unimpressive'. it's workable for unfezant's uses, especially when it can use work up to fix some of its problems. it's not a permanent fix, but unfezant's stats aren't really bad.

    4. completely outclassed by braviary
    the best flying-type in the game beats me, move me down a tier pls because it completely wasn't already reflected in the tier list
    titania has greater contributions to an efficient fe9 clear than oscar, move oscar to low plz

    see? it's really dumb.

    5. crobat and sigilyph are better at fly

    wait what there's competition for hm utility now? besides i'd argue that tranquill is actually better because its offense is better due to stab return (i'm not calculating now but it shouldn't be weaker than sigilyph psybeam) and golbat just outright loses offense forever without acrobatics

    your argument wasn't really thought out well at all.

    also i have no idea how a metagame with tier lists based on not /viability/, but on /usage/, can be used as a suitable analogy to this. if i get together all my friends to troll the OU ladder by putting pichu onto every team for like two months, then we can have pichu in OU. considering people have trolled metagame ladders before (iirc molk did with ru metang or something like that) it's not a paragon of analogies... if everyone stops using hydreigon, it'd be nu. if everyone spams flygon, it can be ou.
    cant say likes this.
  21. IOS

    IOS

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2010
    Messages:
    127
    A few more things I'd like to say about Excadrill:

    Drilbur/Excadrill begins gym leader fights in the speedrun with the following level advantages/disadvantages in comparison to their highest levelled Pokemon:

    Elesa: -5
    Clay: -1
    Skyla: -4
    Drayden: -3
    Marlon: +2

    He's only "overlevelled" against Marlon, which isn't an anomaly. Between Drayden and Marlon, Excadrill only participated in 5 unavoidable Plasma fights and two unavoidable fights in the gym (all of which he easily swept without the use of Swords Dance BTW).

    Therefore, the argument that his value "diminishes" in a normal run doesn't really hold any water.
  22. TM13IceBeam

    TM13IceBeam

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,614
    The main thing Lucchini's probably referring to is that you aren't feeding all your EXP onto Excadrill, Excadrill is a whooping L60+ at the E4, allowing him to murder almost everything (though it should be noted that excadrill himself does struggle against marshal, since you need to spam guard specs and x defense just to stop the speed drops from bulldoze being fatal later when against HJK mienshao. the extra levels also help in surviving hydreigon's surf/flamethrower, something that'd have been at least a 2hko on a lv55 exca).

    Personally I'd say that Darmanitan has a similar hold on the game: having arguably the strongest unboosted attack in the entire game speaks for itself, while it comes around the same time as Excadrill's EQ (Flare Blitz at L33), and the only thing I'd fault for is that Hustle is an annoying bitch. I suppose if Drilbur really does /get/ an extra tier above top (no point needlessly complicating the list imo though), Darumaka should also be worth a re-look.
  23. IOS

    IOS

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2010
    Messages:
    127
    Elite 4 performance at a lower level is worth looking into. I do know that a wild Excadrill was used in the Elite 4 during a 0 EXP Challenge Mode run so I can imagine that he'll still be quite useful.

    Points I'd argue against Darmanitan:

    -80% accuracy until evolution is a huge bitch
    -Far greater chance of dying. 5 resistances to Excadrill's 11 and Flare Blitz's recoil result in a much greater chance of dying if he fails to OHKO, or the opponent has a priority move (like Aqua Jet)
    -No Swords Dance access
    -Poor coverage moves. Hammer Arm and Superpower both reduce crucial statistics (speed and attack) severely limiting his sweeping ability. Earthquake/Iron Head has perfect coverage for comparison

    I'm going to talk to the runner about if he considered using any other Pokémon to see if I can get a bit more insight.
  24. Twins

    Twins

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2010
    Messages:
    113
    I actually meant Haxorus there. Hydreigon has a cool typing and movepool that other Dragons don't get. Haxorus is just Outrage+Dragon Dance like everything else. I'll concede that that wasn't a great analogy though.

    I do agree with all your points, but I'm still not convinced its high tier. I'm not going to try and persuade anyone else otherwise though, since I haven't used it in BW2. Not one to replay games, especially something like pokemon.

    I'd like to see a summary for it in the OP. Someone should write one up. On paper it doesn't seem that good, but if someone can do the whole gym matchup and context analyses I might see it in High tier.

    Anyways, doing one for Litwick.
    [​IMG]
    Name: Litwick
    Availability: Mid-late game. Just before the sixth gym, found in Celestial Tower.
    Stats: Chandelure has a deliciously massive base 145 special attack. 80 speed is decent in-game, and it has enough bulk to take a few hits. Litwick is weak for when you get it, and may require strategic switching and Exp. Share so you can get it to level 41 and evolve it to Lampent. Then you can evolve is straight away to its final form with a Dusk Stone from the Strange House.
    Typing: Ghost and Fire don't have great synergy together, and its five weaknesses can hurt. Its two immunities and six resistances are nothing to scoff at though. Fire is always a good STAB.
    Movepool: Comes with Flame Burst and a Hex/Will-o-wisp combo. Doesn't learn any worthwhile moves before it evolves, and Chandelure doesn't learn anything. However, it is extremely well served by TMs. Shadow Ball is hidden right behind the Strange House (don't miss it), and Fire Blast is in the Lacunosa Pokemon Center. Energy Ball is obtained Surfing from your home in Aspertia. Some other interesting options are Will-o-wisp, Psychic, Overheat, Calm Mind, and Pain Split (tutored). It has really good coverage, and its attacks will very hard.
    Major Battles: Easily murders most run of the mill trainers, but doesn't shine particularly against the remaining gyms or Elite Four. Only advantageous match is versus Caitlin, but be careful of Shadow Ball on Gothitelle and Sigilyph. Colress goes down easily from its firepower.

    I'd put Litwick in High where it is now. Chandelure has some massive special attack, and well rounded other stats. Typing has more strengths than weaknesses. Its movepool is excellent, and it can take out most pokemon through its power, as well as coverage. But it's kept out of Top because it comes late, it requires some babyingm and it's disadvantaged in the Elite Four.
  25. Progeusz

    Progeusz

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2009
    Messages:
    122
    Pidove is in high tier? This Spearow-tier crap in Gen V which is so powerful? I find it very hard to believe... I'll playtest it on my next run, just like I'm doing now with Azurill (got lucky with Lonely nature and good IVs, so far it's doing well). I remember Pidove being terrible in Black and honestly, I can't see how things could change so drastically in BW2 for it to be considered High. If aformentioned split occurs i would think it would be put in middle-low. The only part of my several runs through Black, Black 2 and White 2 when I found Pidove line to be anything but laughable was the L67 Unfezant in Nimbasa which kept critting AND flinching at the same time my Samurott with Sky Attack.

    It's a shame Genesect isn't tiered, obvious top. By the way, I think it's worth considering putting Black 2's Petilil into top tier - it's guaranteed to have 1.5* exp growth, perfect ability, nature and very good IVs (20 everywhere except for perfect 31 in SpA). Countless Grass resistances are really meaningless when faced with +1/2 base power 120 STAB move coming from bulky (+1/2 SpD), extremely fast sweeper. Hell, random trainers don't even require use of Quiver Dance even if they resist Petal Dance. Anything not able to 2hko Lilligant is just free food for Giga Drain. I was trying to keep her at the level of rest of my party but Petulia still managed to be the MVP - even though I used Genesect, Magnezone, Starmie and Lucario in that run, Heracross helped a bit.
    BTW Elekid seriously needs babying (unlike Mareep or especially Magnemite), losing 2/3 of HP to Bite of lower level Patrat? Ridiculous.
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2013

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)