Community Create-A-Team: Forgotten Wonders (LC)

Which Pokemon should we base the CCAT around?

  • Life Orb Eevee

    Votes: 117 56.5%

  • Wynaut

    Votes: 90 43.5%
  • Total voters
    207
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I voted for SubPunch Gunk. This guy is really a force in battle and was a vital piece in the tam hyu and I made. If the opponents Gligar is gone, Gun can easiley set up its sub and proceede from there causong total hell. It also benefits nicely from people being used to Mixed Priority Gunk all the time.
 
Why not make a Wynaut team?

Seriously, Wynaut is so, so good. You can basically take apart any team that relies on revenge killing from Fighting-types, and in order to lure it in you can use stuff like Gligar, Munchlax, etc. Wynaut is amazing, and can either eat their revenge killer or let you set up something far more dangerous.
 
Hmm, I've just gotten into little cup again recently and I would like a clear-cut answer to my question.

I see the suggestion of Wynaut as an option on this poll however there is a bit of discrepancy when it comes to clearly defining what is uber. The ruleset topic says that any pokemon on the ubers list is banned(which can be somewhat misleading because it doesn't clearly state if they are referring to the standard ubers list or the one they just posted) . The little cup guide doesn't reference it at all. The topic regarding how to approach how to apply characteristics of whether or not something is uber didn't reference Wynaut as an uber; to show what a pokemon perhaps needs to be classified as one.

So if someone can answer my question, I'd be grateful and, I think that it's somewhat necessary to make a clarification because I've been asked and asked if it's uber or not and the answer isn't definitive and the other threads should be edited to show clearification on this matter.
 
LC has it's own ubers list, completely independent of smogon's. in LC, wynaut is restricted to level 5 just like all the pokes, which mean its health maxes at 29 and its defense max at 15 (with a + nature, or 14 without). it can die just as quickly as anything else, so its not as bad here.
 
ferron said:
LC has it's own ubers list, completely independent of smogon's. in LC, wynaut is restricted to level 5 just like all the pokes, which mean its health maxes at 29 and its defense max at 15 (with a + nature, or 14 without). it can die just as quickly as anything else, so its not as bad here.
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Thank you for answering my question directly and without being vague. My apologies for hijacking the thread, I just thought it would be a good place to bring it up to settle all confusion on the matter.
 
Wynaut is really pulling away with this one, I'm surprised people aren't voting for SubGunk, it was getting a lot of support. I guess the people who don't want Wynaut are just voting LO Eevee. I haven't voted yet, I haven't decided.

Make sure to get your votes in! If Wynaut's (or any other Pokemon's) lead gets too big, then I will 'close' the poll and we can start on the team.
 
I'm not sure how you are gunna do this. But I think it would be nice to have one more poll over the top two... unless Wynaut really pulls away.
 
IMPORTANT: THE POLL HAS BEEN RESET WITH EEVEE AND WYNAUT AS THE OPTIONS, SO MAKE SURE TO VOTE AGAIN!

Lets take a closer look at our two options:
Life Orb Eevee:

Eevee (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 236 Atk/36 Def/236 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Quick Attack
- Return / Double - Edge
- Bite
- Iron Tail / Hidden Power Grass
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How could something with an Adaptability STAB Quick Attack be forgotten!? Eevee is often looked over because it isn't the 'fastest or strongest', people underestimate Adaptability. QA OHKOes almost everything faster than Eevee, making it an excellent late-game sweeper for when Eevee's very specific counters have been removed.
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Eevee has really surprised me for getting this far, but it could have been people simply trying to vote against Wynaut.

Anyway, Eevee is going to be really interesting to build a team around because of its normal typing. With some Missy users using HP Ground, a nice bonus to using Eevee with Stunky is that if Stunky doesn't work, Eevee will get a free attack vs Missy (bad news for the opponent).

On to the actual role of Eevee (imo):

Eevee is unique in the sense that its STAB moves are SO much more powerful then its coverage moves. This is good and bad news for Eevee. Return will hit stupidly hard while Iron Tail doesn't even always OHKO the Rock-types that could switch in. Eevee is great at wearing down the opponents Pokemon who can actually 'take' an attack (unlike Pokemon such as Dratini), and then using its awesome priority attack to sweep late game.


Wobbuffet Jr. (suggested by MGX):

Wynaut @ Oran Berry
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 76 HP / 212 Def / 212 SDef
Impish Nature
-Counter
-Mirror Coat
-Encore
-Safeguard / Destiny Bond

Wynaut is the ultimate teammate for set up Pokemon and for counting Scarfed Pokemon. With it's very respectable HP and defenses, Wynaut can take a hit and use Encore, allowing you to Counter physical attacks, Mirror Coat special attacks, Safeguard vs status attacks, and / or switch out to a Pokemon who is barely touched by the attack being used by your opponent. This gives set up Pokemon a free turn to set up whatever they want, meaning it could get very dangerous really fast. Wynaut has always been forgotten because of the fact that it doesn't have great defensive typing (e.g., is weak to U-turn), is slow, and will likely get KOed before it does something. However, when Wynaut is placed on the right team, with the right pokemon, it will likely help another one of your Pokemon end the game, or come close to it on a regular basis.
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Wynaut is probably the most hit and miss Pokemon in Little Cup. It can win you the match or lose it for you, meaning there is a right way to use Wynaut and a wrong way. The right way: using it to trap scarfers and setting up your own Pokemon late game while keeping it alive with wish support. The wrong way: using it to revenge kill hard-hitters who will do a shit-ton of damage to you, and switching it in on unresisted hard hits. Coupled with a set up sweeper or two (or three...or four..), Wynaut is terribly dangerous for your opponent.
 
Voted Wynaunt, reason being it can create so many different openings for other pokemon to set-up and sweep which is priceless in LC.
 
I voted Wynaut because, even though Eevee is awesome, Wynaut has endless possibilities for team building (which is what we do here).
 
The Poll is officially 'closed'! Congrats to Wynaut!

Alright, so the community has chosen Wynaut for the first CCAT, and what Pokemon would be better?

The next step is the quickest one, especially for Wynaut, because it really only has one roll to play. Anyway, here is step 2:

Step 2: We select what style of team we want to make. This will likely include something along the lines of Offense, Bulky Offense (closest form of stall..), Weather, Trick Room, and possibly more.
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Now I think we can rule out Trick Room, Stall, Sandstorm, and Hail right away, because they hinder Wynaut more then help him. This is really irrefutable, so I don't think anyone would disagree.

So that leaves us with two options:

Offense (Bulky or Not)

Offense is the common team style in Little Cup, and for good reason. It utilizes various lure + sweep (like double Ghost) strategies along with various Pokemon combinations (like Gligar + Missy + Munch, and Pursuiter + Fighter) that either sweep or have great defensive (yes, defensive) synergy. Defensive synergy is important on an offensive team because synergy makes sure YOU are always on the offensive, and gives your opponent a hard time putting pressure on your team. Wynaut's roll in an offensive team is to take out the Choice Scarfers and lets you set up your own Pokemon as well.

Rain and Sun

These function as HyperOffensive teams, which Wynaut can support surprisingly well. With Wynaut on your weather team, you will use similar tactics as a regular offensive team BUT instead of setting up a stat-boosting sweeper, you set up Sun/Rain. Basically Wynaut has the same role in both teams.

So now lets start discussing which we would rather use and why. If we don't reach a consensus we may have to have another poll (so hopefully we reach a consensus).

Discuss!
 
I would pick a Rain team. Rain is dying in LC for some reason and we should see how effective it can be.
 
Bulky offense is what the metagame is leaning towards now, so I think that we should make a team based on that to give newer players a better feel for it.

Wynaut functions well on these kinds of teams because it helps create opportunities for your own team to come in and set up for a sweep. Something like RP Aron could be an example.
 
Wynaut + SD Gligar is probably my favorite combo in LC right now. In the combo, Wynaut provides Encore support (to aid setup), and is your one-stop shop for all your scarf revenge killing needs. Generally once a team loses its scarfer(s), it is huge HUGE Gligar bait. You can try it out with the new NP Misdreavus, but I find that Gligar is far more effective, as it is harder to KO and susceptible to nearly no priority (doesn't need to predict&pray against Sucker Punch, as most do only ~40%).
 
Seven Deadly Sins said:
Wynaut + SD Gligar is probably my favorite combo in LC right now. In the combo, Wynaut provides Encore support (to aid setup), and is your one-stop shop for all your scarf revenge killing needs. Generally once a team loses its scarfer(s), it is huge HUGE Gligar bait. You can try it out with the new NP Misdreavus, but I find that Gligar is far more effective, as it is harder to KO and susceptible to nearly no priority (doesn't need to predict&pray against Sucker Punch, as most do only ~40%).
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This is one of the reasons why I want to use a normal offense team over a weather team. The possibilities of sweepers are endless, and picking them would be a fun process. Not to mention its probably best to create a slightly more 'simple' team for the first LC CCAT.

Anyone disagree with using Offense over weather? If not then we can go right into pairings.

Also, I'm updating the OP now.
 
I feel that Rain and Sun are wastes of Wynaut's massive potential. It is piss easy to set up Rain / Sun in this metagame, with Voltorb providing RainBoom and Exeggcute being a bulky fool and Sunny Daying before exploding. Having worked with both teams extensively in the past, Wynaut is a really mediocre setup for the team type in general. Better to use it with something like an attack booster (Gligar / Misdreavus come to mind, but anything else with decent speed and Swords Dance / Nasty Plot can work) that really profits from getting scarfers removed.
 
If you're going to use Gligar/Misdreavus as well, then I say that you should have something like Aron, who can lure Scarf Close Combats and maybe set up on a Scarfed Ice Punch.

Maybe a Gligar/Wynaut/Aron core?
 
MetalGarX said:
Supporting Rain / Sun .

The whole point of this CCAT is to bring out the potential in a forgotten Pokemon. Since we're at it then why not try out a "forgotten" concept ?

(Bulky) Offense is something every team is prepared for nowadays, every one uses Stunky / Lax, we always have a Gligar check, and to be fair anything in Little Cuo that boosts speed is often unable to OHKO the stronger mons or isweak to priority: Gligar, Rhyhorn, Cranidos, Aron. Only thing I can think of is Mantyke, but that too is walled by Munchlax and dealt with by Thunder Punch Croagunk (unless you have HP Flying) or even Chinchou as HP Grass is failr uncommon nowadays.

However, most people will agree that Rain and Sun teams are utterly devastating if not prepared for. Sweepers like Buizel and Kabuto under Rain and Bellsprout and Scarf Houndour under the sun are terrifying to face. Rain teams also get access to a boosted priority in the form of Aqua jet, and LO Sub Punch Gunk works great under Rain teams with its power to take out opposing Croagunk and Mantyke.

Rain teams will also increase variety in the metagame, as currently only 3-4 people use Rain Dance teams. This way we can get new players to understand that there is more to Little Cup than Misdreavus and Gligar.

Wynaut also makes for a great mon as it guarantees a set up turn for your sweeper, and often will help set up twice for a late game cleanup with Horsea or Goldeen while Buizel and Kabuto wreck stuff midgame.

I say use Rain / Sun team, this brings out the true potential in some other pokemon as well as Wynaut.
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I tend to agree with SDS on this one:

Seven Deadly Sins said:
I feel that Rain and Sun are wastes of Wynaut's massive potential. It is piss easy to set up Rain / Sun in this metagame, with Voltorb providing RainBoom and Exeggcute being a bulky fool and Sunny Daying before exploding. Having worked with both teams extensively in the past, Wynaut is a really mediocre setup for the team type in general. Better to use it with something like an attack booster (Gligar / Misdreavus come to mind, but anything else with decent speed and Swords Dance / Nasty Plot can work) that really profits from getting scarfers removed.
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Rain and Sun are indeed forgotten, but the goal of this CCAT is to show someone a standard building process for Little Cup. Rain and Sun are slightly more complicated and would work great for later CCAT's.

So, we are officially going to go with 'Standard Offense'.

031ap said:
If you're going to use Gligar/Misdreavus as well, then I say that you should have something like Aron, who can lure Scarf Close Combats and maybe set up on a Scarfed Ice Punch.

Maybe a Gligar/Wynaut/Aron core?
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I was going to say for these comments to wait until we have officially decided on a team style, but since I sort of just decided that we will be doing a standard offense team, I'll take this suggestion.

Aron and Missy work great together, but the only problem is I think we are using too many team slots too fast. We need to go one by one, picking Pokemon who work well with Wynaut.

So far I think the top contenders for getting a slot are:

NP Missy
SD Gligar
RP Gligar

And I'm going to suggest DD Tini right now. I think DDtini completely wreaks of 'give me a turn to set up' because of the sheer sweeping power it has. After one Dragon Dance, entire teams can we swept because of XSpeed and 25 Attack (along with 21 Spe).

If we use DDtini and Gligar, we really need an Ice resist as well.

Anyway, so officially start talking about Step 3.
Step 3: We select Pokemon that work well around our Pokemon and fit the team style and test it.
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Let's do this in an organized fashion. Lets start by picking 2-3 sweepers alongside Wynaut for a solid offensive core. Next we can pick the lead and revenge killers / support Pokemon / whatever.
 
Scarf Chinchou makes a fantastic cleanup / OHSHITPANIC mon, is bulky, resists Ice, etc.

Personally, I'm leaning toward SD Gligar since it cleans up hard against teams whose scarves are surgically removed by Wynaut, but NP Missy is solid. Rock Polish Gligar really doesn't need the support, IMO.
 
Whoa I think we're going abit fast here. The style choice has been up for less than 2 days, and only two people apart from TL have voiced their opinions

I bet hardly half of the community has actually had a look at this decision, and IMO we should wait for a bit longer, considering this is meant to be as community friendly as possible. Even if we do stick to Offense, we should still see what else other people have to say

People are going ot enter and go "hey, when did we pick the team style?", or "hey, where do I get a say in this?" etc.

We have no reason to rush now, lets just wait to get as many people involved as possible
 
I would like to try making a weather team at some point, but kinda agree that Wy is not the best base for it.

I kinda think Trick Room should be on the list, a combo like TR/BD Slowpoke and Encore Wynaut could be quite deadly (and even if you don't have time to fully set up, TR should be up and you'll probably get a hit in). Wynaut is not exactly helped much by TR (fast Destiny Bond with shadow tag looks fun though), but nor is it hindered and it could be a great general purpose revenge killer for a TR team for when Trick Room is not set up, that functions well enough with TR as well.

Offence could work too I suppose, but it seems very general and would need to be narrowed down a lot in future polls.

Anyway, I'm mostly for Trick Room, with offence second and rain/sun last.
 
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