New and 'creative' moveset/EV spread thread Mk. 5

[Shizzle]

Dude, are you even serious about Fearow?? Its a complete joke, Heatwave???? of 61 SpA, LOL, thats quite simply not even worth looking t, especially since you are only running one SpA move, 108 EVs for it?

Staraptor would work much better as a general sweeper, CC, Return, Brave Bird, U-Turn, what else would you need?

Oh, and Crobat EASILY outclasses Fearow, just look at bulk. Fearow is not netting many OHKOs, and Crobat's extra power is more than worthwhile. Don't disrespect Brave Bird, here is proof

Just a random calc vs a 200 Def/300 HP pokemon, with the spreads both shown.

Crobat Brave Bird (Naive 204 Atk LO) = 267 Atk vs 200 Def & 300 HP (120 Base Power): 223 - 264 (74.33% - 88.00%)

Fearow Drill Peck (Naive 252 Atk LO) = 279 Atk vs 200 Def & 300 HP (80 Base Power): 156 - 184 (52.00% - 61.33%) I know you have expert belt, but I put LO just so you can compare.

With this in mind, lets look at bulk!
Fearow 65 / 61 / 61
Crobat 85 / 90 / 80

So Crobat deals MORE damage than Fearow, is MUCH faster, has more attacking and set options, more bulk. What more needs to be said? Fearow just sucks in comparison

 

[CRASHiC]

Metagross@ Iron Ball
252 ATCK 252 SPDF 4 DF
Earthquake
Meteor Mash
Exploison
Trick

The idea here is simple but gimicky. Iron Ball combined with Trick to trap pokemon that would otherwise counter Metagross. Crippling their speed, taking their item, and removing them of their power to levitate. This set does have its problem, because after you trick, while you have crippled one of their pokemon, you suddenly aren't too effective yourself, unless on your Trick you picked up something useful. This isn't a one stop lure train either, as Heatran can still screw you over, even with the investment in SPDF. This does however provide a way to deal with Skarmory, Zapdose, Rotom forms, Bronzong, and Jirachi, and many other pokemon.

 

[I Am Doz]

Yanmega
Nature:
Mild
EV’s:
Attack:48
Special Attack:240
HP:44
Speed:176
Item:
Focus Sash/Insect Plate
Ability:
Speed Boost
Moves:
*Bug Buzz
*U-Turn
*Air Slash
*Roost

The idea is a normal Yanmega, if used as a lead has focus sash, if not uses insect plate to ensure big damage from bug buzz, the main difference in this set to others i have seen is using a boosted U-Turn thanks to it's ev's and nature. Also with the plate as the item this yanmega can hit 30-40% on pokemon resistant to the attack, example being a normal Empoleon, while hitting between 40-60% on lead Metagross(obviously depending on ev spreads).

 

[DDRMaster]

I don't see why you would want to use U-turn on a Pokemon that's 4x weak to SR. Even with Roost, you'll have to use it every time you come in just to break even. You could try to use a Spinner but with the prevelance of Rotom-A it will be hard to get it off. If you want a Pokemon that's fast, can hit hard with Special attacks, and can learn U-turn, you should go with Azelf or Infernape (Azelf's U-turn is actually stronger than Yanmega's).

 

[Myrmidon]

Metagross@ Iron Ball
252 ATCK 252 SPDF 4 DF
Earthquake
Meteor Mash
Exploison
Trick

The idea here is simple but gimicky. Iron Ball combined with Trick to trap pokemon that would otherwise counter Metagross. Crippling their speed, taking their item, and removing them of their power to levitate. This set does have its problem, because after you trick, while you have crippled one of their pokemon, you suddenly aren't too effective yourself, unless on your Trick you picked up something useful. This isn't a one stop lure train either, as Heatran can still screw you over, even with the investment in SPDF. This does however provide a way to deal with Skarmory, Zapdose, Rotom forms, Bronzong, and Jirachi, and many other pokemon.

looks interesting, I may make this build myself...

just as a note; if the Heatran is switched into the trick, they'll have a slow Heatran and you'll have their Shuca/Scarf...toss in a fire lure on he team, and it looks solid.

 

[wavedash]

Metagross@ Iron Ball
252 ATCK 252 SPDF 4 DF
Earthquake
Meteor Mash
Exploison
Trick

The idea here is simple but gimicky. Iron Ball combined with Trick to trap pokemon that would otherwise counter Metagross. Crippling their speed, taking their item, and removing them of their power to levitate. This set does have its problem, because after you trick, while you have crippled one of their pokemon, you suddenly aren't too effective yourself, unless on your Trick you picked up something useful. This isn't a one stop lure train either, as Heatran can still screw you over, even with the investment in SPDF. This does however provide a way to deal with Skarmory, Zapdose, Rotom forms, Bronzong, and Jirachi, and many other pokemon.

Considering that some of Metagross's most common switch-ins are Rotom-A, Zapdos, Skarmory, and Magnezone, this set could work great for luring out, crippling, and killing key threats.

Also I had no idea Iron Ball removes Ground immunities.

 

[CRASHiC]

Too bad the only other two pokemon that would ever likely see the use of Iron Trick in OU is Dusknor, Gallade, and best user being Metagross. Even when looking at the possibility for Ubers play use, Metagross still appears to be the best user, though Mewtwo and Latias and Latios are also interesting when you consider the utility behind not only shutting down a pokemon's speed and taking away their essential item, but getting rid of their ground immunity for the rest of the game. Still Metagross, with his likely hood to lure out Ho-oh still remains one of the best Iron Trick applicants.

 

[Efemera]

Stop theorymon'ing, it doesn't
Fearow needs every bit survivability it can get.

Fearow does not need survivability, because Fearow has three weaknesses to very common attacks, and will die in one hit to just about any powerful neutral attack anyway.

Damage from common OU Ground/Fighting attack users:
0 Impish Hippowdon Stone Edge: 83.1%-97.8%
- Adamant Metagross Meteor Mash: 1HKO
84 Sassy Bronzong Gyro Ball: 73.2%-86.4%
40 Jolly Gliscor Stone Edge: 75% - 89%
64 Naive LO Infernape Close Combat: 96.3% - 113.6%
160 Adamant Machamp DynamicPunch: 87.5%-103.7%
252 Naive LO Heatran Fire Blast: 1HKO

Fearow dies in one hit to every single one of these attacks after SR damage, and does not have the power/speed to beat the owners. What exactly does Fearow do, anyway?

Anyways, it still isn't hell of tons of damage (You do like 35-% to swampert (life orb'd), while drill peck does like 20%+ (expert belt'd, no bonus); it seems like some difference but in the long run it doesn't matter at all, same when you brave bird steel types: You're just killing yourself

Im not saying brave bird it's bad, but Drill peck it's not bad either and it can be better in this scenario.

Drill Peck does less than Brave Bird in every situation. If Crobat only does 35% to Swampert, then Fearow does even less. Also, using Brave Bird's recoil is proportional to how much damage you do. If it's resisted, then you hardly hurt yourself at all.

Think again

Credits: 2

Well, I'll give you a hint: The special attack isn't that important. (It's important, that's why I give Fearow special attack EVs, but not that crucial. However Heat wave is)

I am still not following. You don't win an argument by not making any sense.

Moves you listed for Fearow:
Drill Peck - Brave Bird is better
U-turn - Crobat has it
Heat Wave - Crobat has it. I don't get it. Have you not looked at Crobat's move listing? I've said this multiple times. Fearow is not the only flying type Pokemon that has Heat Wave.
Quick Attack - Crobat has it

Well, well. Here's one of the main problems I see in pokemon players: You divide things into sweeper, tank/wall, hit & run. Probably you couldnt classify a HP Grass/Ice beam/Counter/Rapid Spin Delibird into one of these other than a joke-tier like "trash" even if it's useful as hell.

Back into Fearow, it fits more into hit & run, but the point it's mainly to tease the pokemon of the opponent. Fearow it's a good pokemon to lure Steel types and for that you don't WANT to go all "allah ackbar" like Brave bird does, also, specially since most steel types have a way to OHKO/2HKO both Fearow and Crobat, meaning roost it's useless.

Perhaps I'm ruining the fun here, but whatever.

You've got to be kidding me. There are much better Steel lures than Fearow. Brave Bird isn't going to do much back to you if you hit something that resists it. If lack of survivability bothers you, don't use Fearow in the first place.

And that Delibird is a joke. Stats of an NFE, worst typing ever, nothing that Starmie can't do better.

About Jirachi, I wouldnt stay on that uber anyways. Most run scarf so that would be meaningless, besides, it got 100 in everything meaning heat wave will do like 35% only, unlike other steels.

That's why I said outspeeding neutral 252 speed ev base 100s doesn't make any sense. You rarely see anything running that.

Fearow is completely outclassed by Staraptor. This Crobat comparison confuses me.

He's trying to use a mixed set with Heat Wave for Steels and physically bulky Pokemon. Staraptor does have Close Combat, Intimidate, and much more attack, so it does outclass Fearow, but I was trying to use a Pokemon that actually ran the same set he was running more effectively.

 

[Bribery]

Metagross@ Iron Ball
252 ATCK 252 SPDF 4 DF
Earthquake
Meteor Mash
Exploison
Trick

The idea here is simple but gimicky. Iron Ball combined with Trick to trap pokemon that would otherwise counter Metagross. Crippling their speed, taking their item, and removing them of their power to levitate. This set does have its problem, because after you trick, while you have crippled one of their pokemon, you suddenly aren't too effective yourself, unless on your Trick you picked up something useful. This isn't a one stop lure train either, as Heatran can still screw you over, even with the investment in SPDF. This does however provide a way to deal with Skarmory, Zapdose, Rotom forms, Bronzong, and Jirachi, and many other pokemon.

There's already an analysis on this set: http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=69501. It just hasn't been uploaded for whatever reason. It's a very good set.

This set works really well with Gyarados, Lucario and Salamence since it can dispose of a lot of their counters.

 

[Mazaki Anzu]

Haters gonna hate

Anyways, just will leave this and post tomorrow.

Begin Turn #14
Fearow used Heat Wave!
(44% damage)
It's super effective!
Skarmory fainted!

 

[Myrmidon]

Defending Pokemon:
252HP/252SpD Careful Skarmory

Attacker:
108 SpA Naive Fearow w/expert belt
Heat Wave: 40.1% - 47.9%

0 SpA Adamant Machamp w/Life Orb
Fire Blast: 41.9% - 49.7%

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't this Machamp used a good while ago to take out Skarmory?

let's try something a little more accurate to the era...

Defending Pokemon:
252HP /176 SpD Impish Skarmory

Attacking Pokemon:
108 SpA Naive Fearow w/expert belt
Heat Wave: 54.5% - 64.7%

0 SpA Adamant Machamp w/Life Orb
Fire Blast: 57.5% - 67.7%

I'm not trying to be "hating", as you put it...personally, I like Fearow...but...the Machamp was taken down for a reason...

 

[Joel]

MixedAgiliLuke

This isn't too much different from the regular Agility set. It's just hitting from both sides of the spectrum.​

Ability: Inner Focus
Nature: Naive
EVs: 252 Atk / 162 SpAtk / 96 Speed
Moveset: Agility / Close Combat / Crunch / Hidden Power Ice

This set is fairly simple. 252 Atk to hit STAB Close Combat and Crunch as hard as possible, and 96 Speed EVs to outspeed +Speed natured Gengar after only one Agility. The rest of the EVs were thrown into SpAtk to hit with HP Ice as hard as possible. Swampert and Gyarados could easily force a switch, but I don't see too many other problems for this version of Lucario.​

 

[Shizzle]

@skippy the great, IMO not effective.

Lets think, all of its checks actually do better against this set, such as Gyarados or Vaporeon, or even Celebi! Because they are not taking a +2 offensive hit, but rather a +0 neutral/STAB hit, which they can survive fairly easily.

HP Ice is killing Dragons, but after a Swords Dance Extremespeed would have the same affect.

The only thing I can see that set useful for is killing Gengars.... So yeah.

A short list of Lucario's checks:
Vaporeon [not after an SD], Swampert, Gyarados, Celebi, Rotom-H, Gliscor, and probably a few more.

However after a Agility you still cannot beat any of them bar Gliscor. Basically SD gives Lucario the power he needs to OHKO almost everything, without it he loses to most physical walls, unless they take SE from his STAB Close Combat

 

[Darkamber8828]

Why aren't you using Ice Punch? What's the point? I'd want to outspeed Starmie. Gliscor still dies after Stealth Rock IIRC, and I'm pretty sure Mence/Gon do too.

 

[Shizzle]

If you are assuming you are faster than Starmie, you are assuming you have Agility up, if we look at an LO Adamant Swords Dance set, vs 0HP/0Def Starmie
700 Atk vs 206 Def & 261 HP (80 Base Power): 254 - 299 (97.32% - 114.56%)

 

[Lucalibur]

i tried this set already, you are better off running the mixed life orb set for 3 reasons.

1:you hit rotom with shadow ball, who dont take heavy damage from hp fire or grass knot, you hit skarm with hp fire, who dont take heavy damage from grass knot or shadow ball, you hit swampert with grass knot, who dont take heavy damage from shadow ball or hp fire. get my point? you are using specs so you cant change moves.

2:bliss wall you to death since you dont even got trick.

3:there is no 3.

 

[STEELDRAGON]

Agile Raptor

So, I was fooling around with some move sets and I think this one deserve a mention, it has helped me on many occasions. So your thinking, WTH, why use heat wave with a Pokemon with only 50 base special attack. With with 218 Sp. Atk+LO=283 sp. atk. Heat wave is necessary because it OHKOes Scizor, Fortress who want to stop your sweep. It also can 2ko, Skarmory, and even Metagross, who dare to switch in. It also only takes one turn to set up, to be effective. with +2 speed, it reaches 472 speed, even out speeding Ninjask.It also out speeds many choice scarf Pokemon, to note scarf Heatran, and Tyrannitar and swiftly OHKOed with CC. Staraptor has great attack, 339 Atk+LO=441 atk+ a 180 base power move. This thing could probably sweep a weakened team. Also to note, this set requires Stealth rock, for the said OHKOs or 2KOs to occur.

Staraptor@ Life Orb
Nature: Naughty
Ability: Intimidate
252 Atk/212 Sp. Atk/44 Spe
~Agility
~Brave Bird
~Close Combat
~Heat Wave

 

[DDRMaster]

CB Scizor's Bullet Punch does 69.6% - 82.1% to that Staraptor which is a guaranteed kill after SR and LO recoil/Sandstorm, so you'd have to use Heat Wave on the switch-in. (Edit: Actually, it does 77.2% - 91.3% because it's Mild, which is a OHKO after SR and a possible OHKO after LO recoil.) It might be more effective if you drop Agility for U-turn or Roost and just fire off a Heat Wave when you come in so you can OHKO Scizor and 2HKO Skarmory and Metagross before they kill you or force you out. Rotom-H will still be a pain but it counters that set just as well and you could use something like Tyranitar to take it out.

 

[Lucalibur]

2 problems in there.

first:adamant brave bird already ohko scizor, and he always bullet punch you.

second:staraptor has a horrible time setting up anything because of subpar typing and defenses and he dont even make good use of agility, all he can do now is have a chance to beat metagross and skarmory if they switch into heat wave(what IMo is not suppose to be there in the first place)

i also noticed you run NO speed evs, regardless of agility you should try to reach a speed mark to what you want to outspeed after aglity rather then just max out both atacking stats(also naughty or lonely work better in there, you get the same kos with heat wave).

 

[asdfrozen]

Lead Gengar
Gengar @ Focus Sash
4 HP, 252 SpA, 252 Spe, Timid
Hypnosis
Counter
Destiny Bond
Shadow Ball

This can beat most leads...if Hypnosis hits. Unlike most other sleep leads, Gengar has something for Lum leads, such as Machamp, which it beats one-on-one.
Unfortunately the lack of Life Orb means it can't score very many KOs.

 

[Master Of Puppets]

^^^^ The problem with that is Hypnosis's accuracy is 60%, which means the lead will only work 60% of the time.

 

[STEELDRAGON]

2 problems in there.

first:adamant brave bird already ohko scizor, and he always bullet punch you.

second:staraptor has a horrible time setting up anything because of subpar typing and defenses and he dont even make good use of agility, all he can do now is have a chance to beat metagross and skarmory if they switch into heat wave(what IMo is not suppose to be there in the first place)

i also noticed you run NO speed evs, regardless of agility you should try to reach a speed mark to what you want to outspeed after aglity rather then just max out both atacking stats(also naughty or lonely work better in there, you get the same kos with heat wave).

With, LO+339 attack, brave bird doesn't OHKO the bulky 252 HP scizors, and Heat Wave, is better for it, because it doen't have any recoil damage. I have used this set before, and it usually has a decent time in setting up, because most people think it has either a choice scarf or a choice band, so they switch, intimidate also helps. I also don't think needs any speed Evs, because it outspeeds nearly everything(except fast choice scarfers). It could have 44 Speed evs, to outspeed scarfed, + natured, flygon, salamence, shaymin and jirachi. The absloute MIN. special atk, it should have, would it gurantee a 2ko with heat wave on the standard metagross and bulky scizor. if it has any remaing Evs, they should probably go to HP.

 

[Lucalibur]

if you notice i said ADAMANT brave bird ohko, 339 is jolly/mild/whatever, i also said reach a speed mark with agility, not pump 252 evs.

heat wave is there only for skarmory and maybe metagross(who dont enjoy switching into life orb CC anyway) , yes brave bird recoil is a pain, but staraptor wont survive a hit in the first place, and if he is a later game sweeper then he will clean the enemy team before die by recoil.

 

[asdfrozen]

^^^^ The problem with that is Hypnosis's accuracy is 60%, which means the lead will only work 60% of the time.

I know, that's rather unfortunate, but it still does well against a lot of leads, as long as they're not expecting it (it's not standard, after all...).

Azelf: Shadow Ball 2HKOs.
Aerodactyl: If he Taunts and you Hypnosis, You can still Shadow Ball and then Counter. If he Taunts and you Shadow Ball, expect the SR next turn, and then Counter. If he SRs and Hypnosis hits, good for you. If he SRs and Hypnosis misses, you can Counter his next move. If he SRs and you Shadow Ball, you can Counter his attack.
Swampert: Hypnosis, Counter
Metagross: Hypnosis, Counter
Jirachi: Ugh... I don't like dealing with Jirachi leads.
Infernape: Shadow Ball 2HKOs, I believe.
Machamp: Counter

 

[Ericcc]

Asdfrozen, I don't think you'll win against Swampert with Counter. I mean, most Swamperts run Ice Beam + EQ. You'll only see a Swampert with Waterfall once in a while, so Counter wouldn't be the smart choice. And if Hypnosis misses, then he gets rocks up, and then he'd just switch to his status absorber.

And besides, this set is complete set up bait for DD TTar (whom it can out stall on DB, and then just sweep your team)