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Metagame Trademarked
- Thread starter Whitephoenixace
- Start date
I present to you, "TooOpPlsNerf": The Movie: The Sequel: The Game: The Light Novel: The Manga: The Anime: The Anime Movie: The Live Action Anime Movie: The Cast: The RPG: The RP: The Deleted Room: The Forbidden Fruit: Your Mom: The Omega Core.
Let's start with the start of the show; Marowak-Alola. In Trick Room (and in some cases, outside of it), is a monster. Most of the meta is 1HKO, yeah. Not 1HKO, 2HKO. There a few Pokemon that can tank its stabs, but that's assuming its unboosted. This thing is a monster if you can't get rid of the +2. Now, before we get into what this thing does, let me state something.
Belly Drum ISN'T better.
A big problem with belly drum Marowak compared to sword dance Marowak, is longevity. You already hit a lot hard, why do overkill? Not to mention you can't switch out since even if you remove rocks, it's risky sending it back in. You want to be healthy, since relying on wish support while being rock weak is never fun. There are other problems, too. Haze, Heart swap, you name it. You're overall just better off with SD, though sure in some cases (maybe as a late game sweeper) belly drum could be considered better. But, I think SD works way better for the most part.
Marowak Alola can one hit almost anything. It reaches over 1k attack the minute it hits the field. It's slow, which means it LOVES TR. It's faster than a lot of pokemon in TR, including other TR abusers. Marowak Alola is the hardest Pokemon to state in on, and switch out on. A lot of struggles to beat it, but here's the problem. If your team relies on Marowak Alola, you're in a bad spot. Marowak Alola can easily be played around, though if you can't handle it properly, you'll usually have half your team down, or most of your team in range to be swept by "x" Pokemon. However, No Pokemon doesn't have its checks.
Heart Swap
Only mag and Manaphy have it, both dying to one of its attacks, but. For removing its sd boost, allowing it to forcefully switch out, or not be able to demolish your team in one hit, is always nice.
Haze Pex
For sure a counter. Comes in on the Wak, gets rids of the boost, tanks one hit, and can 2hko with scald. With provided support though, Pex is easily beaten. If Pex is done, Wak can run much more rampant.
Stealth Rocks
One of Marowak's biggest problems is being rocks weak. With provided support, this isn't a problem, however. Rocks can just beat wak if you can force it to switch enough. If you want to make sure Alola Marowak won't come out on the battlefield; just keep rocks up. Since for the most part, unless Alolan Marowak has the provided support, it can be worn down easily.
Set
Marowak-Alola @ Thick Club
Ability: swordsdance / bellydrum
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Brave Nature
- Knock Off
- Shadow Bone
- Fire Punch / Flame Charge / Flare Blitz /
- Brick Break / Low Kick / Stone Edge / Outrage / Boomerang / Iron Head
Let's start with the start of the show; Marowak-Alola. In Trick Room (and in some cases, outside of it), is a monster. Most of the meta is 1HKO, yeah. Not 1HKO, 2HKO. There a few Pokemon that can tank its stabs, but that's assuming its unboosted. This thing is a monster if you can't get rid of the +2. Now, before we get into what this thing does, let me state something.
Belly Drum ISN'T better.
A big problem with belly drum Marowak compared to sword dance Marowak, is longevity. You already hit a lot hard, why do overkill? Not to mention you can't switch out since even if you remove rocks, it's risky sending it back in. You want to be healthy, since relying on wish support while being rock weak is never fun. There are other problems, too. Haze, Heart swap, you name it. You're overall just better off with SD, though sure in some cases (maybe as a late game sweeper) belly drum could be considered better. But, I think SD works way better for the most part.
Marowak Alola can one hit almost anything. It reaches over 1k attack the minute it hits the field. It's slow, which means it LOVES TR. It's faster than a lot of pokemon in TR, including other TR abusers. Marowak Alola is the hardest Pokemon to state in on, and switch out on. A lot of struggles to beat it, but here's the problem. If your team relies on Marowak Alola, you're in a bad spot. Marowak Alola can easily be played around, though if you can't handle it properly, you'll usually have half your team down, or most of your team in range to be swept by "x" Pokemon. However, No Pokemon doesn't have its checks.
Heart Swap
Only mag and Manaphy have it, both dying to one of its attacks, but. For removing its sd boost, allowing it to forcefully switch out, or not be able to demolish your team in one hit, is always nice.
Haze Pex
For sure a counter. Comes in on the Wak, gets rids of the boost, tanks one hit, and can 2hko with scald. With provided support though, Pex is easily beaten. If Pex is done, Wak can run much more rampant.
Stealth Rocks
One of Marowak's biggest problems is being rocks weak. With provided support, this isn't a problem, however. Rocks can just beat wak if you can force it to switch enough. If you want to make sure Alola Marowak won't come out on the battlefield; just keep rocks up. Since for the most part, unless Alolan Marowak has the provided support, it can be worn down easily.
Set
Marowak-Alola @ Thick Club
Ability: swordsdance / bellydrum
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Brave Nature
- Knock Off
- Shadow Bone
- Fire Punch / Flame Charge / Flare Blitz /
- Brick Break / Low Kick / Stone Edge / Outrage / Boomerang / Iron Head
Medicham @ Medichamite
Ability: acupressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Zen Headbutt
- Ice Punch
- Bullet Punch
Honestly my favorite set so far. All stats except Sp.A is useful. +2 attack gives you well over 1k, +2 speed lets you outspeed some stuff (especially with extra support like Galvantula @ stickyweb], or you might even get evasion.
Ability: acupressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Zen Headbutt
- Ice Punch
- Bullet Punch
Honestly my favorite set so far. All stats except Sp.A is useful. +2 attack gives you well over 1k, +2 speed lets you outspeed some stuff (especially with extra support like Galvantula @ stickyweb], or you might even get evasion.
Peaked #1 yesterday on the Trademarked ladder. Here's the team: https://pokepast.es/9e4e2bcaf0620d39
Basically how this team works is you want to use Tapu Koko to paralyze all the faster threats like Kartana, Volcarona, Alakazam, Medicham, Scarf Hoopa-U, etc. and the TM setups like Shell Smash so that Hoopa-U and Victini can outspeed them. Magearna and Celesteela form my defensive core. Celesteela is your answer to Stakataka and most Physical mons. Magearna comes in and steals the boosts of anything. I went with Ice Beam to catch Landorus-T as they switch in predicting Volt Switch. Volcarona/Xurkitree gives this duo problems but I generally sack Kommo-o in those cases before bringing in Koko/Magearna. Speaking of which, Kommo-o is the standard OU set but with TM Rocks and Flamethrower for more coverage. Sub Hoopa-U is my first wallbreaker. I opted for Metronome as I didn't like being locked in with Band and Life Orb recoil is a huge con because Hoopa-U wants to come in and Sub multiple times. Just spam Hyperspace Fury or Drain Punch; Gunk Shot for random Tapu Finis. Victini completes the team with this AAA-inspired set. You want to bring it in safely and just click V-create. Short of Charm Vaporeon, everything on stall is getting 2hko'd.
Unfortunately, I didn't save any replays while laddering but here's two so you can get the idea:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-903792416
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-903820042
thot @ Mawilite
Ability: Swords Dance
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD (idk)
Adamant Nature
- Play Rough
- Sucker Punch
- Knock Off / idk
- idk too
(my English is horrible pls don't kill me)
in OU with 3 slots + SD that thing is a so strong wallbreaker, imagine with 4 free slots and entering +4 attack here?
the problem is: when it switch's, loses the SD buff and when returns cannot setup again and only the huge/pure (pure for Medicham, it needs attention too) power buffs attack
but it's so strong
repeating, my English is horrible. Btw that's my first post so idk how I organize this
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ih
I think your English and set are good.Fire Fang for Ferrothorn or Ice Punch against Lando-T could be useful options.Why not run it on a Trick Room team like I do?
thot @ Mawilite
Ability: Swords Dance
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD (idk)
Adamant Nature
- Play Rough
- Sucker Punch
- Knock Off / idk
- idk too
(my English is horrible pls don't kill me)
in OU with 3 slots + SD that thing is a so strong wallbreaker, imagine with 4 free slots and entering +4 attack here?
the problem is: when it switch's, loses the SD buff and when returns cannot setup again and only the huge/pure (pure for Medicham, it needs attention too) power buffs attack
but it's so strong
repeating, my English is horrible. Btw that's my first post so idk how I organize this
Good afternoon guys, first message in trademarked. It was to warn you that i think it is still possible to do an endless battle in this tier.
You have to play a mon with Ingrain in Ability and with Skill Swap in move + a wisher (ability) + A Heal Pulser (ability) + a way to dont lose hp with your wisher (for example Truant entrainment).
Ingrain Skill swap, as mentionned earlier in this thread, prevents the opponent to switch until it dies. After that,you just have to find a way that the opponent cannot removes 1 hp to your wisher (the easiest way is truant entrainment) and then you double switch infinitely between your wisher and your heal pulser.
Here is a replay of the strategy* :
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-903943109
*(In the replay, thunder wave and leech seed aren't necessary lol)
Ban heal pulse is perhaps the most obvious move to ban but i think the same strategy is however possible with Pain Split. Ingrain + Skill swap is probably the best way to prevent this strategy to happen. It's also the reflect of how wish has an insane mecanic in this tier.
Peace ~
You have to play a mon with Ingrain in Ability and with Skill Swap in move + a wisher (ability) + A Heal Pulser (ability) + a way to dont lose hp with your wisher (for example Truant entrainment).
Ingrain Skill swap, as mentionned earlier in this thread, prevents the opponent to switch until it dies. After that,you just have to find a way that the opponent cannot removes 1 hp to your wisher (the easiest way is truant entrainment) and then you double switch infinitely between your wisher and your heal pulser.
Here is a replay of the strategy* :
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-903943109
*(In the replay, thunder wave and leech seed aren't necessary lol)
Ban heal pulse is perhaps the most obvious move to ban but i think the same strategy is however possible with Pain Split. Ingrain + Skill swap is probably the best way to prevent this strategy to happen. It's also the reflect of how wish has an insane mecanic in this tier.
Peace ~
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very good find, this strategy is very hard to ban without banning ingrain, banning heal moves as TM’s isn’t gonna do anything as you could run a pokemon with lucky chant and one with recycle+leppa+heal move. recycle+leppa+heal move can also be an alternative to wish as you could just protect indefinitely and basically only being able to take damage every 10 turns if your opponent is lucky (this also stops pivot moves). ingrain loops are very easy to find and take 2 turns to activate (another one I can think off the top of my head is the infamous wish+sub combo which could be used as a possible loop if your opponent doesn’t have moves that bypass sub).
I've been playing with it and I've found it to be pretty great actually, super disruptive, free knockoffs and toxic
I suspect that a lot of people have caught on, but Mirror Move does work as a revenge killer trademark. Just send the guy in after one of your other mons is KOed and the Mirror Move guy will get a free shot in. Honchkrow has the best mixed offences for the Mirror Move trademark and gets additional priority to boot:
Honchkrow @ Life Orb
Ability: Mirror Move
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naughty Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Superpower
- Brave Bird
- Pursuit
Honchkrow @ Life Orb
Ability: Mirror Move
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naughty Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Superpower
- Brave Bird
- Pursuit
I'm getting really fucking tired of people using Substitute and being the most boring players on Earth, so I came up with this.
Chatot @ Choice Scarf
Ability: nastyplot
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Boomburst
- Heat Wave
- Chatter
- U-turn
Boomburst and Chatter hits through Substitute, and does WAY more damage than Noivern. Heat Wave is general coverage and U-turn is filler which also gives you momentum.
+2 252 SpA Chatot Boomburst vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Hoopa-Unbound: 288-339 (95.6 - 112.6%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Noivern Boomburst vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Hoopa-Unbound: 100-118 (33.2 - 39.2%) -- 100% chance to 3HKO
Chatot @ Choice Scarf
Ability: nastyplot
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Boomburst
- Heat Wave
- Chatter
- U-turn
Boomburst and Chatter hits through Substitute, and does WAY more damage than Noivern. Heat Wave is general coverage and U-turn is filler which also gives you momentum.
+2 252 SpA Chatot Boomburst vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Hoopa-Unbound: 288-339 (95.6 - 112.6%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Noivern Boomburst vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Hoopa-Unbound: 100-118 (33.2 - 39.2%) -- 100% chance to 3HKO
Remember all those overpowered fighting types in Trademarked? Here's another one!
Feminist (Lopunny-Mega) @ Lopunnite
Ability: Encore
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Power-Up Punch
- Quick Attack
- Return
- High Jump Kick
This is quite good. You can switch in on a setup sweeper and set up multiple times with Power-up Punch. After that, there is no Poke that resists you after Mega. Any faster threats or speed-boosted mons can be sniped with Quick Attack. Slower mons usually die to a +2 Return or High Jump Kick.
+2 252 Atk Lopunny-Mega Return vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Zygarde-Complete: 292-345 (50.9 - 60.2%) -- 89.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 252 Atk Lopunny-Mega Return vs. 252 HP / 76+ Def Slowbro-Mega: 178-211 (45.1 - 53.5%) -- 39.5% chance to 2HKO
+2 252 Atk Lopunny-Mega High Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Filter Aggron-Mega: 253-298 (73.5 - 86.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Calcs speak for themselves. 2HKOs the most bulky mon in SM with 0 HP / 0 Def investment, the most physically bulky Psychic type with the standard UU Tank EVS, and fully invested MAggron. Combined with chip damage from two Power-up Punches, when played with good prediction, this can get multiple kills every game it plays.
dies to topsy-turvy
Feminist (Lopunny-Mega) @ Lopunnite
Ability: Encore
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Power-Up Punch
- Quick Attack
- Return
- High Jump Kick
This is quite good. You can switch in on a setup sweeper and set up multiple times with Power-up Punch. After that, there is no Poke that resists you after Mega. Any faster threats or speed-boosted mons can be sniped with Quick Attack. Slower mons usually die to a +2 Return or High Jump Kick.
+2 252 Atk Lopunny-Mega Return vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Zygarde-Complete: 292-345 (50.9 - 60.2%) -- 89.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 252 Atk Lopunny-Mega Return vs. 252 HP / 76+ Def Slowbro-Mega: 178-211 (45.1 - 53.5%) -- 39.5% chance to 2HKO
+2 252 Atk Lopunny-Mega High Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Filter Aggron-Mega: 253-298 (73.5 - 86.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Calcs speak for themselves. 2HKOs the most bulky mon in SM with 0 HP / 0 Def investment, the most physically bulky Psychic type with the standard UU Tank EVS, and fully invested MAggron. Combined with chip damage from two Power-up Punches, when played with good prediction, this can get multiple kills every game it plays.
dies to topsy-turvy
on turn 17 wish didn't work plz explain or fix
(it probably had to do with sandstorm)
https://play.pokemonshowdown.com/battle-gen7trademarked-904709561
sorry, saved the replay wrong, will change the link when it happens again :/
(it probably had to do with sandstorm)
sorry, saved the replay wrong, will change the link when it happens again :/
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You didn't save the replay :/
I’d like to mention a nice bit of role compression I’ve been using to good effect lately.
Florges @ Leftovers
Ability: Wish
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Defog
- Protect/Synthesis/Aromatherapy
- Toxic/Aromatherapy/Calm Mind
- Moonblast
Florges is one of three viable users of Wish + Defog, the other two being Togekiss and Salamence, and due mostly to being pure Fairy type as well as overall bulk Florges does it best imo. The second and third moveslots are mostly filler, I’ve been opting for protect and toxic, since I use Heal Bell on my Magearna, but synthesis+CM could sometimes work for late game cleaning, though less so in this meta. If you’re strapped for pokes and need some solid role compression I’d give it a shot.
Florges @ Leftovers
Ability: Wish
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Defog
- Protect/Synthesis/Aromatherapy
- Toxic/Aromatherapy/Calm Mind
- Moonblast
Florges is one of three viable users of Wish + Defog, the other two being Togekiss and Salamence, and due mostly to being pure Fairy type as well as overall bulk Florges does it best imo. The second and third moveslots are mostly filler, I’ve been opting for protect and toxic, since I use Heal Bell on my Magearna, but synthesis+CM could sometimes work for late game cleaning, though less so in this meta. If you’re strapped for pokes and need some solid role compression I’d give it a shot.
How does this get +2 in Attack unless your opponent switches in a passive mon? I'd imagine that, after you switch Lopunny into a stat booster and they stat boost again, you can only Power-up Punch once as they switch in their check, and then if you try to go up to +2 by PUP-ing again, they'll pummel you right after you get +2.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-904903079 fun bro is back and better than ever, endless battle clause cannot stop it as heal pulse is considered an ability and abilities don’t have pps, even if you’re not healing your opponent you can still stall out 100+ turn with truant and spore, this is blocked by a pivot move, but if you manage to trap a pokemon that doesn’t have access to one you can pretty much stall out until 4 digit numbers. this is very unwelcoming to new players who are trying to learn the format. the only thing you can do to ban this is to ban ingrain, truant isn’t gonna do anything because all it does is just stall out more turns. basically if you start this combo you can’t be stopped. 252+ Atk Choice Band Kartana Struggle vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro on a critical hit: 118-139 (29.9 - 35.2%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
EDIT: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-904923580 https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-904918844 https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-904919979 I also thought of counterplay to uturn and ghost types, for ghost types you can just use soak tm, and for uturn you can use either lando-t with imprison and uturn or eject button’s weird mechanics+recycle tm to never let your opponent switch. shed shell is countered by embargo/magic room and a knock off. I don’t see an obvious counterplay here.
EDIT: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-904923580 https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-904918844 https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-904919979 I also thought of counterplay to uturn and ghost types, for ghost types you can just use soak tm, and for uturn you can use either lando-t with imprison and uturn or eject button’s weird mechanics+recycle tm to never let your opponent switch. shed shell is countered by embargo/magic room and a knock off. I don’t see an obvious counterplay here.
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I'm having fun using this
Vileplume @ Big Root
Ability: Strength Sap
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Aromatherapy
- Grassy Terrain / Sludge Bomb
- Giga Drain
- Leech Seed
Basically you yust recover your HP over and over again. This thing hates Weavile btw. I was able to 1v1 +3 Xurkitree with that.
Vileplume @ Big Root
Ability: Strength Sap
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Aromatherapy
- Grassy Terrain / Sludge Bomb
- Giga Drain
- Leech Seed
Basically you yust recover your HP over and over again. This thing hates Weavile btw. I was able to 1v1 +3 Xurkitree with that.
So saddens to me to say it , but do to the uncompetetive nature ingrain can bring on top of the realization that even if heal pulse went there is defintiely possibility for other similar setups that can be just as stally or initiate endless battles, I am banning ingrain as of today. Honestly even though there werent much abusing , it doesnt mean people wont start to , and there is potentially other setups outside of the move ingrain as a tm when used with skill swap. tagging The Immortal
Well in other news I like to formerly welcome the first new addition to the trademarked council SamHPL . He has been posting a bit iin this thread and has been helping me test things behind the scenes before this got omotm and seem to have a degree of overall ability to help.
I have something I plan on posting tomorrow (I would do today but I wanna look at a few things first) an event that most of you may have already heard already. Please look forward to it. Thanks once again for playing trademarked
Well in other news I like to formerly welcome the first new addition to the trademarked council SamHPL . He has been posting a bit iin this thread and has been helping me test things behind the scenes before this got omotm and seem to have a degree of overall ability to help.
I have something I plan on posting tomorrow (I would do today but I wanna look at a few things first) an event that most of you may have already heard already. Please look forward to it. Thanks once again for playing trademarked
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I think Mat Block is potentially an unnecessary ban. It's learned only by Greninja and all it does is get Greninja in safely. Greninja loses Protean as well. Best case it adds another usable Pokemon to the metagame.
Also Hoopa-U is broken
Also Hoopa-U is broken
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-905245687
Ban multiples of Me First/Mirror Move. It can create annoying loops.
Ban multiples of Me First/Mirror Move. It can create annoying loops.
1. Throh also gets Mat Block
2. Unlike King’s Shield, Pokemon outside of Smeargle get this move in the metagame. I think it’s best for it to stay banned.
Sorry in advance for the double post.
I think the way to go around this is to ban either King’s Shield, Mirror Move, or Me First. Not all three of them, just one will do. If one gets banned, the strategy gets crippled. I think Mirror Move / Me First is a neat gimmick as a trademark, personally.
As easy as setting hazards up can be in this meta, Mat Block and King's Shield form an infinite loop without hazards up, don't they? And as easy getting hazards up is, getting them off is also quite easy.
Doesn't the 1 trademark clause prevent that?