Because there are only two fully evolved ground/dragon. Flygon may be able to heal himself with roost but garchomp outspeed it and OHKO with outrage. I really like flygon and all, but it's just sad that it didn't for now, we can only hope that when grey version is released or when the remake of RSE is released he get actually get some cool new toys to play with, like DD
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Flygon
- Thread starter Shimrit As
- Start date
Because there are only two fully evolved ground/dragon. Flygon may be able to heal himself with roost but garchomp outspeed it and OHKO with outrage. I really like flygon and all, but it's just sad that it didn't for now, we can only hope that when grey version is released or when the remake of RSE is released he get actually get some cool new toys to play with, like DD
To some degree, however, there is no reason why Garchomp WON'T be banned again in Gen 5. Sand is going to be even more common to combat DrizzleToad and DroughtTails [Provided they too, do not go Uber, as in Gen 4, the abilities alone were proven Uber], which means Sand Veil hax will kick in more than in Gen 4.
Then, are there any new Chomp counters? No. Nothing showed up that is a soild counter to Chomp. There's no Ice-types which outspeed it and OHKO through Yache still.
Sure, the rest of the power creep may keep Chomp OU, but it's probobly unlikly, as no counters for Garchomp have arisen. [Except Scarf Ditto, but that counters everything...]
Anyway, I forsee Flygon jumping into UU, at least until OU stabilisies. If Garchomp turns Uber, Flygon will return to OU, back to his old job, only better, due to Onono and Sazzy.
And, while Garchomp > Flygon, why not use Scarfgon and YacheSD Chomp on the same team? Scarfgon handles other Dragons, YacheChomp kills stuff like before.
Then, are there any new Chomp counters? No. Nothing showed up that is a soild counter to Chomp. There's no Ice-types which outspeed it and OHKO through Yache still.
Sure, the rest of the power creep may keep Chomp OU, but it's probobly unlikly, as no counters for Garchomp have arisen. [Except Scarf Ditto, but that counters everything...]
Anyway, I forsee Flygon jumping into UU, at least until OU stabilisies. If Garchomp turns Uber, Flygon will return to OU, back to his old job, only better, due to Onono and Sazzy.
And, while Garchomp > Flygon, why not use Scarfgon and YacheSD Chomp on the same team? Scarfgon handles other Dragons, YacheChomp kills stuff like before.
I can't even feel bad for Flygon... at least it'll still function with a Scarf.
Kurimugan on the other hand... it's like GF designed this thing to suck. Too slow to Scarf, the only moves Encourage boosts are Flamethrower (60 Sp.A) and Rock Slide. Not even secondary STAB or an immunity. =/
Kurimugan on the other hand... it's like GF designed this thing to suck. Too slow to Scarf, the only moves Encourage boosts are Flamethrower (60 Sp.A) and Rock Slide. Not even secondary STAB or an immunity. =/
Derp.
And I'm not assuming that all of those will be banned. Where did I say that?
And to both of you, That's sad. doesn't really mean I think it's sad. It's just something like Wow or Awwww.
Azure Demon
Guest
This may or may not be true seeing as mence and garchomp look like they are putting their foot back in the standard metagame door
Poor Flygon. No one really wants to pay attention to what it can do outside SMASHOUTRAGERWARR. Of course he loses to Garchomp one-on-one. But that's because it's Garchomp's job to be the SMASHOUTRAGERWARR Ground/Dragon.
Claw Sharpen might have gave it a reason for improvement, if given the right moves to abuse it with.
Fire Blast being more accurate is great, but no one mentioned Stone Edge to hit...stuff that Stone Edge hits. If only it had Dragon Rush, the Gen IV 100 Base Power, 75 Acc, 20% flinch move that Dragonite had. Or DynamicPunch for the sheer awesomeness of confusion hax. Or Zap Cannon or Purgatory. They have decent accuracy after a Claw Sharpen. But no, TrollFreak trolled us all Flygon lovers.
Well, life's a bitch.
Fire Blast being more accurate is great, but no one mentioned Stone Edge to hit...stuff that Stone Edge hits. If only it had Dragon Rush, the Gen IV 100 Base Power, 75 Acc, 20% flinch move that Dragonite had. Or DynamicPunch for the sheer awesomeness of confusion hax. Or Zap Cannon or Purgatory. They have decent accuracy after a Claw Sharpen. But no, TrollFreak trolled us all Flygon lovers.
Well, life's a bitch.
A benefit is also on a Drought team it can run Fire Blast with better power, something it didn't have in OU last gen, also it gains a resistance to Water in the sun.
Alternatively, Flygon could use Stone Edge on a Rain team, as it has an easy switch into Thunder attacks, and can switch into EQs aimed at Tentacruel, Kabutops, Omastar, etc. It gains a resistance to Fire in the rain.
Alternatively, Flygon could use Stone Edge on a Rain team, as it has an easy switch into Thunder attacks, and can switch into EQs aimed at Tentacruel, Kabutops, Omastar, etc. It gains a resistance to Fire in the rain.
People have overlooked one of Flygon's most important traits - immunity to all forms of entry hazards.
Quite a few pokemon have Spikes in their breeding move repertoire now in 5th gen, the most notable of which is Nattorei (and it is literally everywhere thanks to its amazing resistances). While Garchomp may be able to pull of the bulky end-game cleaner with a Scarf gig more effectively, U-Turn and resistances to hazards make Flygon the superior scout, IMO.
And of the dragons, it makes it the most suited for a SubRoost set. Earthquake is scaring off the steels that resist Toxic, while Roost, Substitute, and high speed make Flygon pressingly difficult to take down. And it doesn't even miss out on a DW ability because, like all levitators, it didn't get one.
Quite a few pokemon have Spikes in their breeding move repertoire now in 5th gen, the most notable of which is Nattorei (and it is literally everywhere thanks to its amazing resistances). While Garchomp may be able to pull of the bulky end-game cleaner with a Scarf gig more effectively, U-Turn and resistances to hazards make Flygon the superior scout, IMO.
And of the dragons, it makes it the most suited for a SubRoost set. Earthquake is scaring off the steels that resist Toxic, while Roost, Substitute, and high speed make Flygon pressingly difficult to take down. And it doesn't even miss out on a DW ability because, like all levitators, it didn't get one.
This thing as a scarfer will be pretty brutally challenged by Sazandora, who gets much better stats, still has U-Turn, but has a special movepool instead of a physical one. A usable Draco Meteor, Dragon Pulse and Focus Blast (heck, even Charge Beam and Surf, as well as the elemental Fangs) will do wonders for him, whilst Flygon is limited to the elemental Punches for any kind of coverage. Sazandora even gets Earth Power, which is only slightly less powerful than Flygon's STAB Earthquake and has a good secondary effect. You should also bear in mind that Sazandora's physical attacks can be just as powerful as Flygons, if you decide to invest in them.
That said, Flygon does have an excellent niche in being able to outspeed and dent Sazandora with either Outrage or U Turn, so he might even become the Anti-Flygon of this generation. :P It also resists SR and is immune to Spikes and Thunder Wave unlike Sazandora, so he's still got potential.
Also, to whoever said it, Dragon Tail has negative priority, so using it on Flygon is a no-no.
That said, Flygon does have an excellent niche in being able to outspeed and dent Sazandora with either Outrage or U Turn, so he might even become the Anti-Flygon of this generation. :P It also resists SR and is immune to Spikes and Thunder Wave unlike Sazandora, so he's still got potential.
Also, to whoever said it, Dragon Tail has negative priority, so using it on Flygon is a no-no.
Wait, how, at all, is flygon outclassed? It outspeeds and almost always OHKO's every border-line (Ou-Uber) Dragon. ScarfGon always outspeeds and (If Adamant) OHKO's Chomp with Outrage, the only possible way it wouldn't, is if no hazards were up, Chomp took no previous damage, and Flygon is Jolly. Even Jolly Flygon has a good chance to OHKO a full health Chomp. It speed ties Salamence, after a dance, and OHKO's it if the tie is won. Sazandora is outsped, and, guess what, OHKO'ed. Not to mention Mence, and Chomp will likely go Uber anyways. Ononokusu is outsped, even after a dance, and OHKO'ed. Thing is, Scarfgon, although not "technically" is the fastest dragon in OU and checks all of the other dragons. Rain Kingdra is the only used pokemon/set that outspeeds flygon, and thats a problem all the other dragons have had to face.
Scarf Garchomp.
No Garchomp is better. He's faster, bulkier, and more powerful than Flygon, and can abuse SS with veil hax. Levitate just doesn't compensate for all of that.
U-Turn doesn't compensate for the vastly inferior BST, nor does Levitate.
Actually Kurimugan gets all the Elemental Fang moves boosted by Encourage, as well as Crunch and some other moves you haven't mentioned. It's also got Glare (with new improved 90% accuracy) to deal with it's slow speed, and it works well on Trick Room teams. Rough Skin + Rugged Helmet also helps it against physical attackers, and it can pull it off to varying degrees of success due to it's nice bulk. He's not nearly as bad as you think, and he's more BL than UU, but enough about him, this topic is about Flygon.
Flygon's existence in OU is really subject to Garchomp's existence in OU. If Garchomp goes away, Flygon's got some decent use, but as it stands, it's basically trying to be the fastest U-Turning dragon that's immune to ground type moves. Sazandora also can U-Turn, and does it with more power, but at lesser speed.
They both do. You can keep saying whatever you want, but in the end immunity to one of the most common moves in the game and one of the best utility moves in the game is well worth the lower stats.
I think scarfgon MIGHT not be effective this gen even if garchomp is gone.
Just a speculation. Then if most people still dont understand how scary Kurimugan is even outside trick room, UU player is going to have fun with a very beastly powerful dragon with high attack(in UU standard at least) and low speed and nice movepool (with priority) and a very useful dragon that usefulness rival that of scizor
yeah !!!
Just a speculation. Then if most people still dont understand how scary Kurimugan is even outside trick room, UU player is going to have fun with a very beastly powerful dragon with high attack(in UU standard at least) and low speed and nice movepool (with priority) and a very useful dragon that usefulness rival that of scizor
yeah !!!
Imo Flygon seems kind of outclassed now. Garchomp is better in every single way, it has much higher Attack, much more bulk and of course that base Speed of 102. Sure Flygon is immune to Spikes and Toxic Spikes and has U-turn, but still. ScarfGon may have some usage though. Only reason Flygon was OU in Gen IV was the banning of Garchomp (and the high usage because of Mence's ban).
ScarfChomp can revenge Flygon, but can't nescessarily switch into it. ScarfChomp can be easily picked off or switched into by Flygon, if locked into Quake (Levitate), or Stone Edge, (Where Gon takes a max of 25.6%, barely making the 4HKO if you're lucky). Plus, with Stealth Rock gone as a TM, Spikes have become more popular, giving Flygon another advantage. On the other hand, Chomp can be 2HKO'ed after a bit of residual damage with EQ, and if he tries to switch into the U-turn, Gon will get the switch advantage, he also OHKO'es Chomp with Outrage. Flygon stacks up pretty well against it's only competition, Speed wise.
Yeah, well, Scarfgon can't switch into 1/2 of Scarfchomp's moves, either, and other than that...I'm not sure what Scarfgon can revenge anymore. Plus, no one is mad enough to leave Garchomp in for two turns against a Flygon's Earthquake when the Garchomp is locked into Earthquake.
Anyways, no one is also mad enough to switch Garchomp until a Flygon who hasn't even picked a move yet. 3/4 of Flygon's moves decimate Garchomp.
I've never really seen stall too lately, either, with all of those Espeons running around.