DP Research Thread #5 (Newest yet)

obi · Jan 18, 2009

Hello, and welcome to the newest (and possibly final) DPP research thread! We need your help testing this stuff out, so don't be intimidated. Many of the things still in this thread will take about a minute to test. Even the stuff that requires a lot of testing can still be accomplished by a couple of guys testing while they wait for their pizza rolls to finish in the toaster! A few people submitting trials of 15 or so hits at a time can really add up. If you are unsure of how to test something, don't hesitate to ask. It's a lot better to ask how to test something than to spend an hour setting up an elaborate test only to find out that your results are inconclusive.

However, that doesn't mean you just post anything here. Questions about breeding chains and the like belong in the "Ask a Simple Question" thread. This thread is reserved for questions about game mechanics.

You must test this in-game. Testing on Shoddy is completely irrelevant. Future posters who attempt to justify a test with Shoddy results will be infracted.

Here's a link to the old threads, in case you want to double-check something that was posted there, since I didn't copy over how they proved anything, just the findings.

DP Research Thread #4 ("Newer still")
DP Research Thread #3 ("Newer")
DP Research Thread #2 ("New")
DP Research Thread #1 ("Old")

DP Resource Thread: has valuable information for testing, such as the damage formula.

Abilities
Items
Moves

General Mechanics

(this must be tested in Wi-Fi / link battle, as the Battle Tower has different mechanics for this sort of thing)

End-of-turn-effects with multiple rounds of fainting:

Graviton: Metagross uses Explosion, both Pokemon faint
Graviton: Both people try to send in, say, Shedinja
Graviton: And boht sides have SR down
Graviton: Do both sides then pick a new Pokemon?
Colin: Actually I asked something like this before
Colin: And I remember what the verdict was
Colin: the turn proceeds as normal, with end of turn effects taking place with no pokemon out
Colin: (so reflect can still fade)
Colin: then they both choose

http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1634036&postcount=453

I'm going to need some time to consider all of this.

Freeze: What is the defrost chance?

Peterko said:
ice ice baby

first DP freeze test ever

two level 100 chansey, serene grace ice beaming each other in an in-game double battle
L = left chansey
R = right chansey, faster

number of turns where the pokémon didn´t attack because of being frozen in 3 battles (zero means defrosted right away)

L1 - 1,4,3,6
L2 - 0,4,3,15,7,0,2,1,0,2,6,4
L3 - 1,6,4,4,1,2,3,11,0,1,1
L = 27 times frozen, 92 turns

R1 - 1,2,5,4,2,0,0,0,0,7,6,3
R2 - 4,5,0,0,0,2,2,1,6
R3 - 4,14,2,3,1,3,9
R = 28 times frozen, 86 turns

ColinJF said:
According to this, the best value of r for this data is 23.190067%.

In other words, the defrost rate is probably somewhere between 20% and 25%, possibly at 60/256 (the GSC defrost rate, according to X-Act). However, Chrisisme makes the case for 60/255: http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1183344&postcount=178

obi · Jan 18, 2009

Abilities

http://www.smogon.com/dp/abilities/

Check this page for what we currently know first.

Early Bird: How does Early Bird work if a Pokemon is sleeping, and then gains Early Bird? My guess is that it divides the remaining turns by 2 and rounds down. My next question, then, is what happens if a sleeping Pokemon loses Early Bird? Is the remaining time multiplied by 2?

Wonder Guard: Do any moves, aside from Fire Fang and the typeless moves (Beat Up, Doom Desire, Future Sight, and Struggle), always hit through Wonder Guard? Trace Gardevoir / Porygon2 would likely be the best way to test this for moves that are super-effective on Shedinja (or are Normal / Fighting).

Can Counter, Mirror Coat, Metal Burst, Sheer Cold, Fissure, or any other non-regular damage move hit through Wonder Guard if the type would render it super-effective?

obi · Jan 18, 2009

Items

http://www.smogon.com/dp/items/

Go here first for most of the item information.

King's Rock: What moves aren't given a chance to flinch? Is it all moves that can already flinch or all moves with a secondary effect (or something else?)? Do multi-hit moves like Icicle Spear and Fury Swipes have multiple chances to activate? Beat Up and Triple Kick do.

Amazing Ampharos said:
I have failed utterly to find an easy list of the moves affected by King's Rock (and hence Razor Fang). The only solution was to download the raw databases for veekun's Pokedex and painstakingly make a list by hand. Smogon's datadex pages should change this by having this list under both King's Rock and Razor Fang:

Pound, Karate Chop, Doubleslap, Comet Punch, Mega Punch, Pay Day, Scratch, Vicegrip, Razor Wind, Cut, Gust, Wing Attack, Fly, Bind, Slam, Vine Whip, Double Kick, Mega Kick, Jump Kick, Rolling Kick, Horn Attack, Fury Attack, Tackle, Wrap, Take Down, Thrash, Double-edge, Pin Missile, Sonicboom, Water Gun, Hydro Pump, Surf, Hyper Beam, Peck, Drill Peck, Submission, Low Kick, Seismic Toss, Strength, Razor Leaf, Solarbeam, Petal Dance, Dragon Rage, Fire Spin, Rock Throw, Earthquake, Dig, Quick Attack, Rage, Night Shade, Bide, Selfdestruct, Egg Bomb, Waterfall, Clamp, Swift, Skull Bash, Spike Cannon, Hi Jump Kick, Barrage, Sky Attack, Psywave, Crabhammer, Explosion, Fury Swipes, Bonemerang, Slash, Struggle, Triple Kick, Snore, Flail, Aeroblast, Reversal, Mach Punch, Faint Attack, Bone Rush, Outrage, Rollout, False Swipe, Fury Cutter, Steel Wing, Return, Frustration, Magnitude, Megahorn, Dragonbreath, Rapid Spin, Vital Throw, Hidden Power, Cross Chop, Twister, Extremespeed, Whirlpool, Beat Up, Uproar, Spit Up, Revenge, Brick Break, Endeavor, Eruption, Dive, Arm Thrust, Ice Ball, Blast Burn, Hydro Cannon, Meteor Mash, Weather Ball, Air Cutter, Overheat, Silver Wind, Signal Beam, Shadow Punch, Sky Uppercut, Sand Tomb, Muddy Water, Bullet Seed, Aerial Ace, Icicle Spear, Dragon Claw, Frenzy Plant, Bounce, Mud Shot, Poison Tail, Volt Tackle, Magical Leaf, Leaf Blade, Rock Blast, Shock Wave, Water Pulse, Psycho Boost, Wake-up slap, Hammer Arm, Gyro Ball, Brine, Pluck, U-turn, Close Combat, Payback, Assurance, Trump Card, Wring Out, Punishment, Last Resort, Sucker Punch, Force Palm, Aura Sphere, Poison Jab, Dark Pulse, Night Slash, Aqua Tail, Seed Bomb, Air Slash, X-scissor, Dragon Pulse, Dragon Rush, Power Gem, Drain Punch, Vacuum Wave, Brave Bird, Earth Power, Giga Impact, Bullet Punch, Avalanche, Ice Shard, Shadow Claw, Thunder Fang, Ice Fang, Fire Fang, Shadow Sneak, Mud Bomb, Psycho Cut, Zen Headbutt, Mirror Shot, Flash Cannon, Rock Climb, Draco Meteor, Discharge, Lava Plume, Leaf Storm, Power Whip, Rock Wrecker, Cross Poison, Gunk Shot, Iron Head, Magnet Bomb, Stone Edge, Grass Knot, Judgment, Bug Bite, Charge Beam, Wood Hammer, Aqua Jet, Attack Order, Head Smash, Double Hit, Roar Of Time, Spacial Rend, Crush Grip, Magma Storm, Seed Flare, Ominous Wind, Shadow Force

obi · Jan 18, 2009

Moves

http://www.smogon.com/dp/moves/

Check here first.

Gravity: The issue of how Gravity raises your effective accuracy is still unknown. How I would test it is by using Double Team once under Gravity. If it's actually -2 evasion for all, moves would have 4/3 their normal accuracy, but if it's * 5/3 accuracy, moves would have 3/4 * 5/3 = 5/4 their normal accuracy, meaning a 75% accurate move (Sleep Powder without CompoundEyes) would have 100% accuracy for -2 evasion, but 93.75% accuracy (possibly rounded to 93%) for * 5/3, as I suspect it is. If you ever miss Sleep Powder, it's not a -2 evasion stage change. What is known that it is not a +2 accuracy alteration, meaning it affects evasion or it is * 5/3 accuracy. The only difference between the two (* 5/3 accuracy or * 3/5 evasion) is possible rounding issues, but I don't think there is enough information on how accuracy works to determine that.

Mimic: What can't it select?

Pursuit: Does Pursuit against a faster U-Turner still have a chance to hurt itself in its confusion (assuming the Pursuiter is Confused, of course)?

Rage:

I think I have come across a bug involving Rage, Sub, and any other move:

I was using a Kangaskhan with the the move set: Sub, Sucker punch, Rage, and focus punch.

One battle, something strange happened:

Kang used substitute.
Krabby used mud shot!
Sub takes damage for Kang.

Kang used Rage!
Damage dealt yay!
Krabby used Mud shot!
Sub takes damage. (Rage is not boosted) (SUB IS NOT BROKEN)

Sub doll slides out, Kang does the focus punch animation thingy, sub slides back.
Krabby Used Mud Shot!
Kang takes damage (though the sub sprite is still there), loses a stage of speed, Rage builds, loses focus.

Now Kang's sprite is the Substitute doll, if I use substitute a new substitute doll comes in like normal. Kang is still the sub doll (it looks hilarious when a sub doll changes places with a sub doll and uses focus punch, then slides back again).
When switched out and back in, kang is back to normal.

I tried it again with rage, Sucker punch, and Sub and got the same result of bugged sprites. In fact, I was able to Rage, Sub, Rage, Sub, and a new sub would be made each time (The opponent never hit me, it was busy being a retard at the time). I was able to Sub, rage, rage, rage completely normal though.

So basically, if I use rage while behind a sub, then try to use any move other than rage, the sub disappears with no message or animation, and my pokemon is now the doll sprite.

And another bug with Rage and Confusion status:

Kang used Rage!
Damage dealt.
Nidorina used double kick.
2 hits, 2 boosts.

Kang used Rage.
Damage dealt.
Nidorina used flatter.
Sp atk up, Kang becomes confused.

Kang used Sub (no confusion message whatsoever)
Nidorina used Double kick.
Sub breaks on last hit.

Kang used sub (confusion completely gone).
Flatter fails.

Kang used rage.
Nidorina used Double kick.
sub breaks on last hit.

Kang used sucker punch. Fails.
Nidorina uses Flatter.
Kang is confused.

Kang uses sub (confusion message comes up).

So basically, if I use rage before I get confused, the message comes up, but no confusion actually happens. (I really hope this isn't a bug and is actually another awesome boost for rage)

Both of these were done in Diamond in the battle tower. When I went into wild battles and double trainer battles, I got all the same results.

I would really like someone else to recreate and confirm what happened here (or if someone already discovered this, that would be awesome too), because for all I know I'm actually asleep right now and this is a fucked dream, which explains the inconsistent capitalization of these words.

Edit: All this stuff happens on PBR also, except the dolls sliding in and out (because in PBR the dolls are present to do the attacks).

TheMaskedNitpicker · Jan 18, 2009

Obi said:
Gravity: The issue of how Gravity raises your effective accuracy is still unknown. How I would test it is by using Double Team once under Gravity. If it's actually -2 evasion for all, moves would have 4/3 their normal accuracy, but if it's * 5/3 accuracy, moves would have 3/4 * 5/3 = 5/4 their normal accuracy, meaning a 75% accurate move (Sleep Powder without CompoundEyes) would have 100% accuracy for -2 evasion, but 93.75% accuracy (possibly rounded to 93%) for * 5/3, as I suspect it is. If you ever miss Sleep Powder, it's not a -2 evasion stage change. What is known that it is not a +2 accuracy alteration, meaning it affects evasion or it is * 5/3 accuracy. The only difference between the two (* 5/3 accuracy or * 3/5 evasion) is possible rounding issues, but I don't think there is enough information on how accuracy works to determine that.

http://upokecenter.com/games/dp/guides/timing.html

This page has a complete accuracy check formula. I can't vouch for its accuracy, but if we're trying to figure out the formula, it's probably the best place to start.

If it turns out to be accurate, it's interesting to note how accuracy and evasion levels are added together before being applied.

lati0s · Jan 19, 2009

Has it been tested whether 2 and 3 turn outrages (and thrashes/petal dances) occur with equal probability?

It seems like they should, but its never good to assume things

TheMaskedNitpicker · Jan 19, 2009

Obi said:
Early Bird: How does Early Bird work if a Pokemon is sleeping, and then gains Early Bird? My guess is that it divides the remaining turns by 2 and rounds down. My next question, then, is what happens if a sleeping Pokemon loses Early Bird? Is the remaining time multiplied by 2?

As far as I understand it, when a Pokémon is put to sleep with a move other than Rest, it gets a sleep counter that starts at a random number between 2 and 5. Right before the Pokémon's turn, the counter is decrased by 1. If the counter is then less than or equal to 0, the Pokémon wakes up and takes its action. As far as I always understood it, if the Pokémon has the Early Bird ability when its turn comes up, the counter gets decreased by 2 instead of 1. I don't think the counter gets divided or multiplied by 2 at any point.

This requires some testing to confirm, but it is to my mind the most likely mechanic.

obi · Jan 19, 2009

Sleep was shortened to 1-4 turns in DP, but yes, that does seem to be the most likely mechanic.

AJC · Jan 19, 2009

Could someone see how frequent the triggering of the "acid/killer rain" glitch happens?

twash · Jan 19, 2009

Obi said:
Wonder Guard: Do any moves, aside from Fire Fang and the typeless moves (Beat Up, Doom Desire, Future Sight, and Struggle), always hit through Wonder Guard? Trace Gardevoir / Porygon2 would likely be the best way to test this for moves that are super-effective on Shedinja (or are Normal / Fighting).

Can Counter, Mirror Coat, Metal Burst, Sheer Cold, Fissure, or any other non-regular damage move hit through Wonder Guard if the type would render it super-effective?

If I remember correctly, RB Golbat started this list? Unless there are any objections, I will dig up the list and continue with it within the near future.

RBG · Jan 19, 2009

http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1458474&postcount=346

http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1458485&postcount=347

Wonderguard and kings rock tests that never really got going.

TheMaskedNitpicker · Jan 19, 2009

Obi said:
Sleep was shortened to 1-4 turns in DP, but yes, that does seem to be the most likely mechanic.

I didn't say a Pokémon actually sleeps from 2-5 turns. I said the counter starts between 2 and 5. Notice that the counter is decremented right before the game checks to see if the Pokémon should wake. Hence, if the counter started at 1, the Pokémon wouldn't miss a turn due to sleep.

obi · Jan 19, 2009

Ah, that makes sense. That explains how Early Bird Pokemon can sleep for 0 turns.

TheMaskedNitpicker · Jan 19, 2009

Obi said:
In other words, the defrost rate is probably somewhere between 20% and 25%, possibly at 60/256 (the GSC defrost rate, according to X-Act). However, Chrisisme makes the case for 60/255: http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1183344&postcount=178

Do you have any idea the kind of sample size we'd need to state with even 95% confidence whether the rate is 60/256 or 60/255? Sadly, I find I don't remember enough math to tell you but suffice it to say that it's large enough that I don't care to test it. I'll continue to test the rest of the things on these lists.

obi · Jan 19, 2009

lol yeah, the difference between the two is
23.5294118%
23.4375%

Put another way, compared to the 256 thaw rate, the 255 thaw rate will occur .3921569% more often. That's more of a question for someone who can access the game's data directly and manages to find where this is stored.

TheMaskedNitpicker · Jan 19, 2009

The questions about Early Bird reminded me of something. The Smogon Status Guide (and prevailing wisdom) maintain that confusion has no set counter, but rather a Pokémon has a set chance to be freed from confusion with each action it takes. In this way, it is like the 'frozen' status ailment.

I've seen a lot of confused Pokémon and I could not for the life of me ever remember a Pokémon immediately snapping out of confusion (spending 0 turns confused). Nor could I ever recall confusion lasting longer than 4 turns. Not wanting to rely on my memory (especially about the 4-turns bit), I ran some simple tests. I battled the two Pachirisu on Route 104 with my Staraptor and Spiritomb. The Spiritomb used Confuse Ray on the Staraptor whenever necessary and the Staraptor used Foresight on the second Pachirisu after KOing the first one. I confused the Staraptor 24 times. My results were as follows:

0 turns confused: 0 occurrences
1 turn confused: 8 occurrences
2 turns confused: 3 occurrences
3 turns confused: 7 occurrences
4 turns confused: 6 occurrences
>4 turns confused: 0 occurrences

Just for comparison's sake, here are what the approximate average results should be using the prevailing theory:

0 turns confused: 6.0 occurrences
1 turn confused: 4.5 occurrences
2 turns confused: 3.4 occurrences
3 turns confused: 2.5 occurrences
4 turns confused: 1.9 occurrences
>4 turns confused: 5.7 occurrences

Just to give you an idea about how unlikely the current theory is to be true, the chance of the Staraptor always spending at least one turn confused in 24 trials is 0.75^24, or 0.00100, or about 1 in 1,000.

The chance of the Staraptor never spending more than 4 turns confused in 24 trials is (1 – (0.75^5))^24, or 0.00150, or about 1 in 667. In fact, if you take the first turn of confusion as a given, the chance of never spending more than 4 turns confused drops to 1 in 9222.

So, yeah, I don't know where we got our current idea about this mechanic, but it's wrong. I think it's far more likely that confusion lasts 1-4 turns, just like sleep.

EDIT: Ah, looking at the Shoddy code, it appears that confusion already has a turn-decrementing implementation. This leads me to believe that the results of my tests are already known. In that case, we just need to update the site's Status Guide.

MagicMaster87 · Jan 19, 2009

Not really anything big, but I tested the Rage + Substitute glitch myself since you had asked for someone else to confirm it. I used a female Beedrill for my testing, with Pursuit and Twin-Needle as its other two moves.

The battle went like this:

Beedrill use Substitute. *Sub appears as normal*
Staravia used Growl. *failed*

Staravia used Quick Attack. *Sub did not break*
Beedrill used Rage. *Sub slid out, attack proceeded as normal, Sub slid back*

Beedrill used Pursuit. *Sub did not slide out as the attack animation occurred*
Staravia used Tackle. *Beedrill took damage even though it still had the Sub sprite*

So it appears that there truly is a glitch with Rage and Substitue + other moves, and it's not limited to just Kangaskhan.

I wish I could've provided more information, but unfortunately I have no WiFi access here, nor a second DS and game. ;_;

AJC · Jan 19, 2009

one for the "acid rain glitch"

how does fire and water moves behave under the hail version of the glitch are they boosted reduced or not changed at all?

what is thunder and blizzard acc during this glitchy weather?

does solar beam need to charge or does it instantly fire?

are all the related weather traits triggered in this form of the glitch?

poccil · Jan 20, 2009

TheMaskedNitpicker: The effect of Early Bird that you describe is correct, at least in the Advance generation. I word that ability accordingly: "The sleep count declines by 2 instead of 1 in bearer's sleep checks." A wiki site in Japanese, linked from pokemon-master.com, mentions details on how confusion works now: During each of a Pokemon's turns, there is a 50 percent chance that the Pokemon will deal confusion damage to itself; and a 25 percent chance that the confusion effect ends.

TheMaskedNitpicker · Jan 20, 2009

poccil said:
A wiki site in Japanese, linked from pokemon-master.com, mentions details on how confusion works now: During each of a Pokemon's turns, there is a 50 percent chance that the Pokemon will deal confusion damage to itself; and a 25 percent chance that the confusion effect ends.

Hmm... Well, I suppose that might be one of the sources of our erroneous understanding of how confusion is supposed to work now. I think I showed pretty conclusively that that can't be the actual mechanic.

twash · Jan 20, 2009

Wonderguard test.

Just posting the list so far. If anybody wants to help, you can use the Trace Gardevoir / Porygon2 with two DS, or you can use a Spiritomb with Wonderguard, and go to the south of Floroma and battle the twins, and just attack your own Spiritomb. If using the latter, do not test Fighting, Psychic, or Normal-type moves on it. If you have any results, PM them to me, thanks.

List so far:

Code:

Absorb
Acid
Aerial Ace - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Aeroblast
Air Cutter
Air Slash
AncientPower
Aqua Jet
Aqua Tail
Arm Thrust
Assurance
Astonish
Attack Order
Aura Sphere - Palkia on Gardevoir [B]NO[/B]
Aurora Beam - Octillery on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Avalanche - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Barrage
Beat Up - Already known [B]YES[/B]
Bide
Bind
Bite
Blast Burn
Blaze Kick
Blizzard
Body Slam
Bone Club
Bone Rush
Bonemerang
Bounce
Brave Bird
Brick Break
Brine - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Bubble
BubbleBeam
Bug Bite
Bug Buzz
Bullet Punch
Bullet Seed - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Charge Beam - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Chatter
Clamp
Close Combat
Comet Punch
Confusion
Counter
Covet
Crabhammer
Cross Chop
Cross Poison
Crunch
Crush Claw
Crush Grip
Cut
Dark Pulse – Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Dig - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Discharge
Dive
Dizzy Punch
Doom Desire – Already known [B]YES[/B]
Double Hit
Double Kick
Double-Edge
DoubleSlap
Draco Meteor - Salamence on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Dragon Claw - Groudon on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Dragon Pulse - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Dragon Rage
Dragon Rush
DragonBreath
Drain Punch
Dream Eater
Drill Peck
DynamicPunch
Earth Power - Palkia on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Earthquake - Groudon on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Egg Bomb
Ember
Endeavor
Energy Ball - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Eruption
Explosion - Metagross on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Extrasensory
ExtremeSpeed - Rayquaza on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Façade
Faint Attack
Fake Out
False Swipe
Feint
Fire Blast - Salamence on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Fire Fang – Already known [B]YES[/B]
Fire Punch - Groudon on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Fire Spin
Fissure
Flail
Flame Wheel
Flamethrower - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Flare Blitz
Flash Can[B]NO[/B]n - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Fling
Fly
Focus Blast
Focus Punch
Force Palm
Frenzy Plant
Frustration
Fury Attack
Fury Cutter
Fury Swipes
Future Sight - Already known [B]YES[/B]
Giga Drain - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Giga Impact
Grass Knot - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Guillotine
Gunk Shot
Gust
Gyro Ball - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Hammer Arm
Head Smash
Headbutt
Heat Wave
Hi Jump Kick - Medicham on Gardevoir [B]NO[/B]
Hidden Power
Horn Attack
Horn Drill
Hydro Cannon
Hydro Pump - Salamence on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Hyper Beam
Hyper Fang
Hyper Voice
Ice Ball
Ice Beam - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Ice Fang
Ice Punch - Medicham on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Ice Shard
Icicle Spear
Icy Wind
Iron Head
Iron Tail - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Judgment
Jump Kick
Karate Chop
Knock Off
Last Resort
Lava Plume - Camerput on Poryogn2 [B]NO[/B]
Leaf Blade
Leaf Storm - Wormadam-G on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Leech Life
Lick
Low Kick
Luster Purge
Mach Punch
Magical Leaf
Magma Storm
Magnet Bomb
Magnitude - Camerput on Poryogn2 [B]NO[/B]
Mega Drain
Mega Kick
Mega Punch
Megahorn
Metal Burst
Metal Claw
Meteor Mash - Metagross on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Mirror Coat
Mirror Shot
Mist Ball
Mud Bomb
Mud Shot
Mud Slap
Muddy Water
Natural Gift
Needle Arm
Night Shade
Night Slash
Octozooka - Octillery on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Ominous Wind
Outrage - Medicham on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Overheat - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Pay Day
Payback - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Peck
Petal Dance
Pin Missle
Pluck - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Poison Fang
Poison Jab - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Poison Sting
Poison Tail
Pound
Powder Snow
Power Gem
Power Whip
Present
Psybeam - Octillery on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Psychic - Wormadan-G on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Psycho Boost - Deoxys-N on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Psycho Cut - Medicham on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Psywave
Punishment
Pursuit
Quick Attack - Pachirisu on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Rage
Rapid Spin
Razor Leaf
Razor Wind
Return
Revenge
Reversal
Roar of Time
Rock Blast
Rock Climb
Rock Slide - Camerupt on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Rock Smash
Rock Throw
Rock Tomb - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Rock Wrecker
Rolling Kick
Rollout
Sacred Fire
Sand Tomb
Scratch
Secret Power
Seed Bomb
Seed Flare
Seismic Toss
Selfdestruct
Shadow Ball - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Shadow Claw - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Shadow Force
Shadow Punch
Shadow Sneak
Sheer Cold
Shock Wave - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Signal Beam
Silver Wind - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Skull Bash
Sky Attack
Sky Uppercut
Slam
Slash
Sludge
Sludge Bomb - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Smelling Salt
Smog
Snore
SolarBeam - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Sonicboom
Spark
Spacial Rend - Palkia on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Spike Cannon
Spit Up
Steel Wing - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Stomp
Stone Edge - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Strength
Struggle - Already known [B]YES[/B]
Submission
Sucker Punch
Superpower
Super Fang
Surf - Palkia on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Swift
Tackle
Take Down
Thief - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Thrash
Thunder - Deoxys-N on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Thunder Fang
Thunder Shock
Thunderbolt - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
ThunderPunch - Medicham on Porygon2 [B]NO[/B]
Tri Attack
Triple Kick
Trump Card
Twineddle
Twister
Uproar
U-Turn - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Vacuum Wave
Vicegrip
Vine Whip
Vital Throw
Volt Tackle
Wake-Up Slap
Water Gun
Water Pulse
Water Spout
Waterfall
Weather Ball
Whirlpool
Wing Attack
Wood Hammer
Wrap
Wring Out
X-Scissor - Mew on Spiritomb [B]NO[/B]
Zap Cannon
Zen Headbutt

MagicMaster87 · Jan 20, 2009

I would like to test Gravity, but Obi's comments are a bit confusing. Would using Gravity and Sleep Powder repeatedly until it either misses or I have acquired a large-enough sample of successful hits be enough for the test?

Also, does anyone know of an opponent in-game that has a Pokemon that can at least use U-Turn? I tried testing it out in a double battle, but apparently Pursuit doesn't work on your own Pokemon switching out...

obi · Jan 21, 2009

Yes, use Double Team under Gravity, and attempt to hit the DT Pokemon with Sleep Powder. If you ever miss, you can stop, otherwise, continue going for a while. After 82 attempts at using Sleep Powder, there will only be a .5% chance of misidentification, which I'd say is acceptably low. However, I suspect that you will miss.

Mekkah · Jan 21, 2009

I thought the norm was that you had to test over WiFi/link battle, since these mechanics are sometimes different from the in-game ones?

ΩDonut · Jan 21, 2009

MagicMaster87 said:
Also, does anyone know of an opponent in-game that has a Pokemon that can at least use U-Turn? I tried testing it out in a double battle, but apparently Pursuit doesn't work on your own Pokemon switching out...

There's a female trainer north of the Resort Area that has a lead Ambipom with U-turn. She's just north of some grass where you can find Dugtrios, Cacturnes and Rhydons.

DP Research Thread #5 (Newest yet)

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don't glaze me bro

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