New and "creative" moveset/EV spread thread. Mk. 3

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expert belt with boom ? never!

LO is never that huge of a deal since you just switch on shit that can't touch you like celebi and most scizors/steels/zapdos/jolteon and you're just punishing switches.

camerupt is fucking awesome though and makes a great core with celebi+pert/vappy/gyara/starmie.i wish his def was a little better to help with lame scizor
 
Camerupt @ Life Orb
Ability: Solid Rock
Nature: Quiet (+SAtk, -Spd)
EVs: 228 HP/68 Atk/212 SAtk
~ Earth Power
~ Flamethrower/Overheat
~ Explosion/Rest
~ Hidden Power [Grass]/Hidden Power[Electric]

Probably your best bet for actually making use of him in OU. It's not really creative compared to the lead killer. Besides the EVs and item, it isn't much different from the Choice Specs set in the analysis. Anyway, he takes a hit or two and dishes them out. Attack EVs and Explosion to get a nice kill. Rest is an option that would work well with a cleric in your team. HP Grass is for bulky waters on the switch, although HP Electric hits stuff like Vaporeon just as hard and destroys Gyarados. Unfortunately, Camerupt has no business staying in on these threats anyway.

I don't think it's as effective.
 
If Metagross is going to be setting up the rocks, did you test a full powered Eruption vs. Metagross?
152-179%, so it can't OHKO with Occa. The 10 Base Power increase compared to Overheat is negligible. There's also the issue that the Base Power is 15 if Metagross does Earthquake you, and you'll always attack second. The Fire move is really just a filler anyway, in case Camerupt doesn't end up dead with 3 turns.

Supereffective STAB special hits are the only way to OHKO Metagross, so I'm pretty sure nothing else in OU can OHKO Occa Berry Metagross on turn 1.
 
What about say... Solid Rock Rhyperior? I think that may make it, as Meteor Mash won't be hurting as much with Solid Rock. Also, what if that was lead Camerupt, and carried a Sp. Attack Boosting Berry with Solid Rock, it could possibly KO.
 
Solid Rock Rhyperior gets the OHKO on Metagross 100% of the time with Expert Belt/Life Orb, positive nature, and 240 Atk EVs. Heatran is overall less defensive, so Shuca Heatran goes down too, although Heatran's Earth Power has about a 60% chance of KOing first, so it's kind of risky. 252 HP EVs can ensure survivability, but it's debateable whether it's worth crippling Rhyperior for the rest of the match.
 
why not just run Cb rhyperior lead to OHKO Heatran (does it? I haven't calced it) with EQ and do a lot to Azelf with Megahorn, then switch to your weatehr abuser for the KO on Azelf? That would be a neat lead...
 
why not just run Cb rhyperior lead to OHKO Heatran (does it? I haven't calced it) with EQ and do a lot to Azelf with Megahorn, then switch to your weatehr abuser for the KO on Azelf? That would be a neat lead...

I know AgilityGross OHKOes Shuca Heatran with EQ, so I'm sure Rhyperior can definately do the same. You probably won't need Megahorn, seeing as a CB Stone Edge will bring Azelf down to low health.

The only problem is Swampert leads, and most run Surf now adays.
 
So I used the updated Blaziken set in my OU team over Infernape for 4 matches...
Blaziken racked atleast 2 kills in all 4..Scoring a high of 5 and a low of 2. With the others being a 4 and a 3. So...uh..it is pretty beast.
I think it makes a wonderful sweeper, that really catches teams off-guard. It is mixed so it destroys Walls pretty well, I mean it isn't the best wall breaker, but I do admit it makes for a very sweet pokemon, definately OU material I felt. Only problem was Garydos, which I tried to use Reversal to kill but that wasn't that amazing.
Anyway, on to a new set
Some guys on chat were talking about a physical Blastoise, and while it isn't super effective, I think you can give it a try and have decent success, specially with suprise factor.

Physical Blastoise
Choice Band/Jolly/Torrent
252 Attack/252 Speed/4 Life
Aqua Jet
Waterfall (Aqua Tail in Platinum if you care for more power)
Ice Punch
Earthquake

Aqua Jet and Waterfall both provide STAB's one with a priority, the other with a strong attack and flinch factor, with Torrent it is pretty beast :O. Ice Punch covers Grass pokemon, which are a pain, and whereas many focus on special defense you can suprise for a OHKO! Earthquake is for Electric pokemon, whose attacks you can survive and hit them back with a really powerful super-effective EQ's. It also destroys Steels pretty well, so it gives another part of good coverage. Jolly nature and 252 speed is really so you can use Earthquake/Waterfall/Ice Punch first, if you are outsped, so be it but meh :(. He is pretty bulky himself so generally you should be able to attack again. Overall, Blastoise CB is pretty fun, maybe not the best way to use him, he does provide a unique skill set that can be used as you see fit. Once again, sometimes the cookie cutter set isn't as strong as this just because of the suprise factor. Suprise and confusion are the two most important parts of warfare, and you will have your opponents confused with these strong attacks, making them wonder what the hell are you doing, which can lead you to victory.
Cheers
 
It Metagross gets KOed by an Earthquake, Heatran will, even with Shuca. Metagross has much higher defense and runs HP EVs.

The problem with Megahorn and Stone Edge is that they have horrible accuracy. Since Azelf is always sashed, it's almost not worth it. There's a 64% chance that two consecutive Stone Edges will hit and a 72.25% chance that two Megahorns will hit.

Tyranitar will kill off Azelf much easier with Crunch/Sandstorm, while being immune to Psychic and resistant to Fire Blast/Explosion. Unfortunately, Tyranitar doesn't get STAB Earthquake, so it can't OHKO Metagross.

I don't like Choice Band on a Rhyperior lead either. It does ensure an easy OHKO on Heatran and Metagross, but Earthquake is incredibly predictable and you allow any flying-type/levitator a free switch in and chance to set up.

I do like the idea of leading with Rock Polish Rhyperior, though. If it's Metagross or Heatran, they'll probably switch or set up rocks on turn one, so you can Rock Polish and outspeed to KO. Maybe

Rhyperior @ Life Orb
Ability: Solid Rock
Nature: Adamant (+Atk, -SAtk)
EVs: 16 HP/240 Atk/252 Spd
~ Rock Polish
~ Earthquake
~ Stone Edge/Megahorn
~ Rock Blast

Rock Polish to take advantage of switches. Earthquake as the primary attack for taking out Metagross/Heatran. Stone Edge/Megahorn for various threats. Rock Blast for sashes and subs (Ninjask's one fear?). Needing Adamant for the KO on Metagross is unfortunate, since Jolly really would be nice.
 
It Metagross gets KOed by an Earthquake, Heatran will, even with Shuca. Metagross has much higher defense and runs HP EVs.

OHKOed, yes.

The problem with Megahorn and Stone Edge is that they have horrible accuracy. Since Azelf is always sashed, it's almost not worth it. There's a 64% chance that two consecutive Stone Edges will hit and a 72.25% chance that two Megahorns will hit.

Tyranitar will kill off Azelf much easier with Crunch/Sandstorm, while being immune to Psychic and resistant to Fire Blast/Explosion. Unfortunately, Tyranitar doesn't get STAB Earthquake, so it can't OHKO Metagross.

I realize that. To avoid that I would switch in a weather changer instead of trying to hit again, as detailed in my post.
 
Ah, now I understand. That would work better.

Physical Blastoise doesn't look too bad. I'd consider Return over Earthquake as it has decent enough coverage.

Scarf Azumarill pulls off the exact same thing without Earthquake, but will have greater Speed and Attack. It only has 100/80/80 defenses, but those really aren't too much worse than 79/100/105.
 
...Scarf Azumarill...?? It might be due to the fact that I've never seen one, but does such a thing exist in competitive pokemon? All the Azumarills I've seen are Banded.
 
It reaches 327 Speed with +nature 252 EVs and Choice Scarf, so hardly worth the drop in power when you have a great priority move anyway.
 
I'm not suggesting that Scarf Azumarill is common or anything. I'm just saying that it probably does that Blastoise's job better, although most are Banded. And CS Azumarill would beat CB Blastoise's speed with Adamant nature, so it still retains its godly 438 Attack.
 
Just take notice of this
Timid Specs Camerupt
-Reaches 196 Speed with a positive Speed nature which ties base 80s with no investment in speed. Meaning you outspeed most siginificantly Swampert and Metagross leads who would be crazy to run speed and lose their bulk.
-Sp att reaches 463 with specs

Earth Power
Lava Plume/Eruption
HP grass
Overheat/Explosion/Stealth Rock

Cals done using libelldras
-Deals 1 HKO's to Metagross Heatran and most Tyranitar with earth power.
-Lava Plume for the burn rate on Azelf leads.
-Hp grass- Outspeeds swampert and lands a 2HKO on most Hippowdon
-Most Bronzong (Heatproof, Occa exceptions), and all Jirachi OHKO'D by Overheat

Metagross and Swampert and most bronzong never get a chance to set up their Stealth Rock.

No defensive number crunches yet but this definately has power and enough speed to make it work. It can hit all the top leads hard but can it weather their standard attacks? I have to get some sleep for a big test tomorrow so someone else can run defensive calcs on Timid 4hp/ 0Def/0 Sp Def Camerupt( make sure you calculate with solid rock in mind)
 
It's a 252 Speed investment for 196 speed, but that definitely does work for OHKOs on Gross and Swampert, getting unscathed. Leadpert is probably more common than Leadtran, so this works well. Unfortunately, it needs bulk to survive Heatran which will always outspeed.

Let's optimize EVs:
All right, first of all, LeadGross is the fastest you want/can hope to outspeed. It runs 178 speed. That means that 68 Speed EVs can be dropped for a total of 184 Speed. Next: KOing it. Timid, Specs, with only 80 SAtk EVs is going to KO Metagross (and Heatran) 100% of the time. Unfortunately, this doesn't always nab the OHKO on Pert (93-110%). Insurance on that requires 152 SAtk. This leaves 172 EVs to throw into HP. This EV investment allows you to survive Earth Power 100% of the time, taking only 72-85%.

We're left with:

Camerupt @ Choice Specs
Ability: Solid Rock
Nature: Timid (+Spd, -Atk) / Hasty (+Spd, -Def)
EVs: 172 HP/152 SAtk/184 Spd
~ Earth Power
~ Hidden Power [Grass]
~ Flamethrower / Overheat
~ Stealth Rock / Explosion

Now we have created a lead that OHKOs all Swamperts, Metagross, and Heatrans, outspeeding Swampert and Metagross. I removed a few of the slashes. Lava Plume lacks power and is only good for burning, which isn't great on a Choice set. Flamethrower is accurate and powerful enough. Alternatively, Overheat has better accuracy and power than Fire Blast, although worse accuracy than Flamethrower. Unlike Eruption, it doesn't rely on Camerupt having high HP. Overheat is better for hit-and-run tactics that are often associated with Choice items anyway.

Stealth Rock is for use with Timid, although due to the Scarf you must switch out after, whereas Explosion is best with a Hasty nature, to aid with OHKOing more defensive Blisseys. Hasty over Naive (+Spd, -SDef) because it needs to take Heatran's Earth Power as easily as it can.

Trick Jirachi is also less effective. They get Specs and lose their Scarf, taking an Earth Power (although, a weakened one, due to Specs loss). Heatran can't switch in on Earth Power, so they will find their attempt to give Heatran a Flash Fire boost fruitless. Even with a Scarf, Heatran will be OHKOed if it doesn't have Shuca.

Advantages over the other set:
- Takes care of Swampert rather than running.
- Takes care of Metagross without losing any HP.
- Actually outspeeds some stuff.
- Hits Aerodactyl neutrally.
- Handles Trick Jirachi better.

Disadvantages:
- Choiced.
- Explosion cannot be used on Blissey that tries to wall you. You have to switch out and come back in on a higher chance that Blissey will use Protect (probably a reason to use Stealth Rock instead).
- Can't take on Heatran switch-ins later in the game and must switch out.
 
I guess it isn't really that creative or 'new' but here it is...

Absol @ Razor Claw
Super Luck
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 HP / 252 Spe
Adamant(+Atk, -Sp Atk)
~ Psycho Cut
~ Sucker Punch
~ Superpower
~ Night Slash

Night Slash and Psycho Cut for higher crit chance and Sucker Punch for priority. Superpower is just more type coverage.

It's 'that' hax set.

Edit:

What is this was used on Tauros in double battles?
 
Tauros could be killed by the opponents, so unless both of the opponents have to switch the turn Tauros is getting hit, it isn't worth it.

perhaps:

Smeargle: Choice Scarf

Dark Void
Trick
Helping Hand
Filler

Honchkrow @ Scope Lense / Razor Claw

Drill Peck
Sucker Punch
Superpower
Night Slash

Tauros: @ Focus Sash

Return
Earthquake
Rock Slide
Zen Headbutt


1ST: Have Honchkrow attack something as Smeargle Dark Voids both foes.

2ND: As both foes switch due to sleep, switch out Smeargle for Tauros, and have Honchkrow attack Tauros with Night Slash, and activate Tauros' Anger Point, while it holds on with Focus Sash. Tauros' Intimidate hits both foes, and Honchkrow has Sucker Punch for Faster foes, and Azelf / Gengar.

3RD: Tauros sweeps with +6 attack, and 2 attacks that can hit both foes. Honchkrow is Immune to EQ.


***********
I decided to post a set that forces mind-games. Basically use Destiny Bond to scare your opponent into thinking they can attack you next turn, as they expect it to wear off if you are faster.

Say Gengar uses Destiny Bond on a Scizor's Bullet Punch, barely surviving. Many Scizor would probably switch to a non-priority move such a U-turn, and then expect Gengar to switch to an attack, ready to Bullet Punch on turn 3, and since Gengar's Destiny Bond will end after it attacks, you can just use Focus Punch instead of another move, and make Destiny Bond wear off after Scizor uses U-Turn and double KO them.

By using a negative priority move (like Focus Punch), and extend the effects of Destiny Bond into the end of the next turn. (it lasts until you attack, so using a negative always last attacking move like Focus Punch, forces Destiny Bond to last longer, even if you are normally faster).


Gengar/Gallade: @ Life Orb

Set Name: Focus Bond

Destiny Bond
Focus Punch
Shadow Ball/Psycho Cutter
Thunderbolt/Shadow Sneak


Qwilfish:

Destiny Bond
Revenge
Swords Dance/Spikes
Waterfall


Froslass: Leftovers


Destiny Bond
Avalanche
Spikes
Substitute

Cacturne

Destiny Bond
Revenge
Sucker Punch
Swords Dance
 
That's interesting; I don't really see the utility on Froslass as much as the others, but I think the other three COULD work as the moves aren't wasted slots (I've seen quite a few focus punch gengars...).
 
How can tauros use both Anger Poi9nt and intimidate at the same time?

Didnt u read about the new update? Now every pokemon can use up to 5 traits and 9 moves. Thats why i use a Mold Breaker/Speed boost/Pure power/Magic Guard/Wonder guard Rampardos, with Sub/SD/Stone Edge/EQ/Zen Headbutt/Rock Slide/Ice Punch/Thunder Punch/Fire Punch.

Seriously, if you dont get the crit with this tauros, you are gone. if the opponent brings a Scizor, you are gone. If the opponent can use a Aqua Jet squirtle from his LC team, you are gone (come on, who will sucker punch a squirtle?)

This Tauros is phail, not good even as a theorymon.
 
Much like the Victreebel set I designed for my OU Sunny Day team, (which was later posted by LR in the Peer Edit Analysis section, with minor alterations to Speed), this set uses 2 Attacks, Swords Dance and Hidden Power to great success.
I also used this Tangrowth on my OU Sunny Day team as a back-up Mixed sweeper when Victreebel died, and it works great to lure in Heatran, Skarmary, Scizor, Jirachi, and of course, Bronzong.

http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/tangrowth

[SET]
name: Chlorophyll Mix Sweeper
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: Power Whip
move 3: Earthquake
move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Ice
item: Life Orb
nature: (+ SpA, - SpD)
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe [8 SpA / 248 Spe for Hidden Power Ice]
ivs: 29 HP

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>This set is designed for use on Sunny Day teams, where Tangrowth will still need max EV Speed investment to outspeed Base 130s, while keeping a nature that boosts its very high Special Attack. While many would expect Tangrowth to use more than 1 Special Attack with such a high Special Attack stat, Tangrowth is better using its Attack stat thanks to Swords Dance, which Tangrowth can find time doing thanks to its strong Defense and HP, which isn't always easy for Victreebel.</p>

<p>Power Whip and Earthquake are Tangrowth's main attacking moves. While Tangrowth has a lower Attack stat and less EVs invested in Attack compared to Mixed Victreebel, Power Whip has a much stronger base power compared to Leaf Blade to make up for that. This difference in power is amplified more when dealing Super Effective damage [making the base power gap increase enough to overpower max Attack Adamant Victreebel's Leaf Blade], and is especially helpful when dealing with Suicune, Tyranitar, etc. Again, just like the Electivire's Thunder Punch or Thunderbolt dilema, many were surprised to learn that base power more than makes up for lower offense stats.</p>

<p>Hidden Power Fire is used in the last slot to give Tangrowth the coverage it needs to beat the Steel-types that resist its other moves, namely Scizor, Bronzong, Skarmary, and those with a higher Defense such as Metagross, while Earthquake hits the Heatran, Infernape, and Empoleons that seem to not mind Tangrowth's other attacks. On the other hand, Hidden Power Ice will take out the odd Dragonite, Gliscor, Flygon, and Salamence, but that will leave Tangrowth unable to fend itself off from its more common counters. Additionally, Gliscor and Flygon will still take nuetral damage from Power Whip, and after a Swords Dance, that will 1HKO-2HKO both said Pokemon.</p>

<p>Attack is maxed to give Tangrowth as strong a Power Whip as possible. 252 Speed EVs give it a stat of 198 [factoring Hidden Power Fire's drop in Speed], which allows Tangrowth to outspeed scarfed Modest Heatran and Lucario in the sunlight, and Scizor, Rhyperior, and Cresselia outside of it. The remaining EVs and nature are allocated to Special Attack to power up the Hidden Power. With the listed EVs, Tangrowth will 2HKO max HP Metagross on average with Stealth Rock support, and with Hidden Power Fire in the sun, always OHKO max HP Skarmory with Stealth Rock. 29 HP ivs are to give Tangrowth a HP ending in 9, so Tangrowth has 11 turns to sweep with Life Orb rather than 10.</p>


***YAY MY 410 Post!***
 
Most of you probably view Donphan with disdain, wondering why he is still in OU. I have one reason for you. He can actually be quite good.

Donphan (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP/172 Atk/84 Def
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Ice Shard
- Seed Bomb

This set functions quite well as a lead. It will KO Metagross leads 100% of the time with Earthquake. The other common leads are dealt to like this.
Azelf: 2HKO with Seed Bomb. Survives the Explosion.
Infernape: OHKO with Earthquake.
Jirachi: OHKO with Earthquake
Aerodactyl: Possible 2HKO with Ice Shard or Seed Bomb.
Swampert: 2HKO'ed by Seed Bomb
As you can see by the above, it is very potent at killing other leads, while getting up his own SR.

The EVs allow him to achieve many of the above kills, but specifically, survive 2 Meteor Mashes from 'Gross, and be able to KO back with EQ. It reliably counters some of the main leads in OU, while still doing what the main purpso of most leads is, SR.
 
Donphan has a 33% chance to OHKO on Swampert w/ Seed Bomb if you max Atk, so that wouldn't be a bad idea.

I don't know how much good Ice Shard is on this set, as Aero is already 2HKOed by Seed Bomb, and he can't 3HKO Donphan back wite Ice Fang. Maybe Rapid Spin would be a nice option to spin away the Stealth Rock that other leads put down.

Bulky Metagross Leads, like 252 HP / 252 Atk, are OHKOes 97% of the time versus 100%, but whatever. I'll try this out.
 
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