how do people feel about the suspect thread opening up on Sunday? Is that a fine time, is it too soon, etc?
The meta is definitely had some time to stabilize I've been playing a decent bit recently and I can say with confidence -ate is all over the damn place. That replay is a more ridiculous example, but all of the serious high ranking teams I've seen have both one or more -ate abusers and have one or more -ate counters. The only people not using -ate are those who are sub 1250ish.
Anecdotal, yes, since I've not saved literally every replay I've seen or watch, but I can say with confidence -ate is becoming very centralizing and I don't see a reason to continue waiting. I'm getting tired of every match against decent or better players boiling down to "whose -ates are better" and/or "whose -ate counters are better".
turn 7 was literally the worst play I've ever seen oh my godThe meta is definitely had some time to stabilize I've been playing a decent bit recently and I can say with confidence -ate is all over the damn place. That replay is a more ridiculous example, but all of the serious high ranking teams I've seen have both one or more -ate abusers and have one or more -ate counters. The only people not using -ate are those who are sub 1250ish.
Anecdotal, yes, since I've not saved literally every replay I've seen or watch, but I can say with confidence -ate is becoming very centralizing and I don't see a reason to continue waiting. I'm getting tired of every match against decent or better players boiling down to "whose -ates are better" and/or "whose -ate counters are better".
also both teams were ilate spammers, which doesnt really show the "brokeness" of ilate.Yeah exactly and if he had protected or scouted for his tran he'd have done markedly better. Ofc this is hindsight but I feel like that replay shows more inexperience than -ates being superior to anything else the tier can offer
wasnt your past arguement the exact same in regards to the ability clause? lol. your rmt of your ph abuse...you specificly said "In reality, the counter can stop one, two, or, if it's really lucky, maybe even three of the same thing. But, especially in BH where even a hard counter can find it difficult to OHKO or completely shutdown the thing it's supposed to be countering, the counter will eventually be overwhelmed and, shortly after that, the rest of the opposing team can easily follow." basically, this team is the prime example of this, and thus, is rendered irrelevant in terms of arguments about brokenness. something to consider is treating ilates as one such ability (just like huge power and pure power could be considered such) and limit them to the ability clause.I'm saving my arguments for the actual suspect thread since this isn't the place, but let just say one thing. Look at the picture and the team in the below spoiler and ask yourself this: does a team that poorly built and deliberately as poorly played as I show you in the replay above deserve to be that high on the ladder? I'd argue it shouldn't even be breaking 1250.
Whether you think it's ban worthy or not, I seriously believe this is worth discussing in the suspect thread.
I'm ranked 34 on there, user Its come to this. This team doesn't deserve 1500, which is high ladder territory. I could go higher, or probably even peak if I felt like it (and I don't because I really don't want to peak a shit team), but Real Life™ demands my attention right now and I probably won't get back to playing it tonight. And yes, that's me in the above replay. Yes, I built a purposely shit team. Yes, I purposely played it like shit (hell, half the time I was doing other things and just pausing to click an -ate move.) No, that's not Photoshop, you can go look on the ladder right now.
It also annoys me it's doing this well with so little thought. My ability clause pls team required a lot of thought into both building and playing to fully abuse the lack of ability clause. This one? I just click Boomspeed while doing other things and win games. It's stupid as hell.
Kyurem-Black @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Refrigerate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Extreme Speed
- Infestation
- Bolt Strike
Kyurem-White @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Refrigerate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Boomburst
- Earth Power
- Blue Flare
- Switcheroo
Xerneas @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Feint
- ExtremeSpeed
- Thousand Arrows
- Heart Swap
Xerneas @ Life Orb
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Boomburst
- Stealth Rock
- Sacred Fire
- ExtremeSpeed
Rayquaza @ Lum Berry
Ability: Aerilate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpA
Lonely Nature
- Fake Out
- ExtremeSpeed
- Boomburst
- Rapid Spin
Yveltal @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Aerilate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Fake Out
- ExtremeSpeed
- Boomburst
- Knock Off
I was mainly going for a counter argument on everyone using -ate, but I have noticed some really stupid things on the ladder, namely dazzling gleam.I've reached #20 and above iirc with a gimmick team; ladder ranks in the Other Metagames don't really prove much, especially since a large part of the ladder lacks knowledge about the metagame.
wasnt your past arguement the exact same in regards to the ability clause? lol. your rmt of your ph abuse...you specificly said "In reality, the counter can stop one, two, or, if it's really lucky, maybe even three of the same thing. But, especially in BH where even a hard counter can find it difficult to OHKO or completely shutdown the thing it's supposed to be countering, the counter will eventually be overwhelmed and, shortly after that, the rest of the opposing team can easily follow." basically, this team is the prime example of this, and thus, is rendered irrelevant in terms of arguments about brokenness. something to consider is treating ilates as one such ability (just like huge power and pure power could be considered such) and limit them to the ability clause.
there is no way for me to ensure I can consistently run into a large variety of teams abusing -ate from a variety of players at a variety of skill levels. I can't control my opponent's team choices, and to do so I feel would defeat the purpose of such an experiment. I can, however, abuse it myself and consistently hit a variety of teams, players, and skill levels.
The meta is definitely had some time to stabilize I've been playing a decent bit recently and I can say with confidence -ate is all over the damn place. That replay is a more ridiculous example, but all of the serious high ranking teams I've seen have both one or more -ate abusers and have one or more -ate counters. The only people not using -ate are those who are sub 1250ish.